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most all of your shots I wouldn't consider "nature" ... they are just parts of urban parks that are largely planted by man and manicured, I am talking about beautiful "nature" if there is a confusion, the cliff along the hudson there are mostly houses out there, I drove the entire west side of NYC this summer through JC, to Battery Park up to the Cloisters and up to Yonkers, went to dined on the river, etc. you have to go realllly far to get anywhere that is real nature, where as you can go over the bridge in SF or south of it and be in a national park. If we are talking about pretty streetscapes, urban parks, tree lined streets and such, which is a lot of what you are posting, then yes NYC is pretty in that regard and can go head to head with SF.
There are some pretty areas such as the Palisades.
but as you can see right behind it are entire communities and condos and such, Ft Lee, Englewood Cliffs, golf courses, etc... They should have had that area protected land or something. instead it is just nj burbs forever right behind it.
most all of your shots I wouldn't consider "nature" ... they are just parts of urban parks that are largely planted by man and manicured, I am talking about beautiful "nature" if there is a confusion, the cliff along the hudson there are mostly houses out there, I drove the entire west side of NYC this summer through JC, to Battery Park up to the Cloisters and up to Yonkers, went to dined on the river, etc. you have to go realllly far to get anywhere that is real nature, where as you can go over the bridge in SF or south of it and be in a national park. If we are talking about pretty streetscapes, urban parks, tree lined streets and such, which is a lot of what you are posting, then yes NYC is pretty in that regard and can go head to head with SF.
There are some pretty areas such as the Palisades.
but as you can see right behind it are entire communities and condos and such, Ft Lee, Englewood Cliffs, golf courses, etc... They should have had that area protected land or something. instead it is just nj burbs forever right behind it.
Uh, last I checked, the City of San Francisco wasn't untouched land. So, great, there are large swaths of undeveloped areas. That doesn't add points, for me. In fact, I love the look of man-made craftsmanship against a beautiful nature scene. Hell, that's a majority of the appeal of a place like Santorini.
Uh, last I checked, the City of San Francisco wasn't untouched land. So, great, there are large swaths of undeveloped areas. That doesn't add points, for me. In fact, I love the look of man-made craftsmanship against a beautiful nature scene. Hell, that's a majority of the appeal of a place like Santorini.
no, it isn't, but the areas around it are far more preserved.
I'm still not understanding how people say New York has no natural scenery.
C'mon dont be so dense, of course it has some. Its just not engulfed in its surrounding beauty like San Francisco is. San Francisco is a postcard opportunity around every corner.
Why is he being dense? I liken it to people and type - you know how you can find someone attractive but your friend would say ewwww ugly - well same with natural beauty. I agree with Nairobi's sentiment though I have the same feeling as you in terms of attraction.
Quote:
Originally Posted by slo1318
C'mon dont be so dense, of course it has some. Its just not engulfed in its surrounding beauty like San Francisco is. San Francisco is a postcard opportunity around every corner.
I'm an outsider in this comparison, I know San Francisco somewhat a little bit better than New York mostly because of all the family treks I've made. In my family, we jokingly like to call our family hub "the Bay Area" since that's where the majority of my close family members live & all of them in San Jose or Cupertino.
To live in? Well I would definitely not pass up an offer to live in San Francisco for a spell but overall I'm going with New York because it's a hypercity & I really really really love the 24/7 factor to it (because I'm hella nocturnal). Plus if it means anything, it's ultimately one city in the United States (along with Chicago) that reminds me of my hometown Singapore & reminds me of other cities I've really grown to love like Seoul, London, Tokyo, & Hong Kong (two of which I haven't been to yet- Tokyo & Seoul). I like that vertically tall atmosphere where gazing at stars you see the shimmering lights of the buildings that encircle & overwhelm your atmosphere. It's a really awesome urban atmosphere. New York's an exquisite place to visit- albeit I've never lived there but it's a very fun environment sort of like an urban theme park. You pick what you want to do, make an agenda, & just do it because it's almost an endless opportunity. While I don't have much of a fascination with "historical events" because 9 out of 10 times I've been bored on history tours in other cities- I've always loved how New York utilizes every damn square inch of space for a historical cause. I remember seeing that tiny piece of land in Manhattan near the Flat Iron District, they made a monumental statue to that Fort Worth guy and put it on what in other cities would be an average road median with only flowers & some plants and a sidewalk with nothing more. While I'm more of a fanatic of post modern or modern architecure- anything that remotely resembles that city atmosphere (or comes close to it) from Star Wars (Episode III), Matrix, or DREDD- New York has a fascinating way of integrating all types of architecture into an area. That Flat Iron Building, the Empire State Building, even prettier is the Chrysler Building, the entire skyline curbed in Lower Manhattan along the fork that separates the Hudson & East Rivers right before the overlooking bay where the Liberty Island looks like a monumental "first sight" as you enter the bay from the Atlantic. I'm also stoked with the progression of New York's skyline (the second best in the world in my opinion after Hong Kong)- the shimmering, tall, almost sky bruising skyscrapers erected for a city with such a rich history for everything. The glass panels, those gyms on the 20th floor with skyline & river views, those lights, that crowded fast moving environment, that sense of accomplishment that this is it, you've made it- big into the city of dreams. I'm a bit of a weird person as I like to think of myself that way but I'm really into literature as well as an overly impressive environment for professionals. I love the clean cut, busy, powerful, as well as accomplished & educated atmosphere swarmed by well suited & dressed individuals of all walks of life cutting into their reality of the American dream day in & out. One thing about New York that is irreplaceable is it's cosmopolitan features, it cant be underestimated. Not only the resident population but the tourists too- I love how you can literally meet people of every walk of life there is on the planet on one 22 square mile island, if they're not a local then you'll definitely meet them as tourists- that adds to the incredible environment. You see people speaking their native languages en mass, walking about, exploring about, their daily routine- it's incredible to have the opportunity to "get to know" people in that nature. To talk to them about where they're from, to get their impression of our culture, to learn about theirs, their way of life, their families, their language, their history, their accomplishments, what drove them to visiting the United States, what they're most stoked about seeing- if their expectations live up to it or not. It's incredible. I also have grown quite fond of the local as well as diverse collection of cuisines in New York- incredible Thai food. Just simply incredible- I was in Bangkok this summer as well as Kuala Lumpur & Singapore and I must say New York's selections for Indo-Malay-Chino food is second only to Singapore at this point, the Thai food is the best I've tasted out of Bangkok. I'm not so familiar or a fan of Malaysian food on its own nor have I tried it in New York but I would imagine spectacular quality nonetheless. I love the ability to walk everywhere endlessly & it's a huge feeling city- here in Washington since I moved here I've gone out every single day (till it became pretty cold- then I started staying indoors more often- I hate cold) and have explored street by street for hours & hours and it still wouldn't quench my thirst. I would see something on the way back home & I would detour on to it to see it- because it would catch my eye and I would want to experience something unique & different each day. Now in New York, I would imagine far more flexibility, there is no constraint on safety- I would do the same there while feeling overwhelmingly confident that my life is in good hands due to it being an extremely safe & monitored city. I cant ever replace that feeling- it's incredible- it's like Singapore on steroids plus being infinitely more alive, fun, & character driven. I've grown fond of New Yorkers- people there are real awesome, on my few treks to the city I've encountered many people that have been extremely helpful- all of them going wayyy out of their way to help a stranger they know nothing about. I've never felt that anywhere else in the United States before (okay to a much lesser extent Houston- but much much lesser extent). I've also toured some of the suburbs of New York both on the New Jersey side & Connecticut side and wow- beautiful, could only imagine how lovely they look in autumn during fall foilage. Incredible history- incredible people- incredible scenery (lush & green)- incredible lifestyle. I'm a weird sort of history buff- I don't necessarily care for where papers were signed or made into law & this and that type of stuff. I care for more of the superficial things- New York was the worlds first megacity, the worlds third hypercity, the worlds first powerhouse financial center, the worlds media capital (news, broadcasting, current events). I'm going into a career of journalism- everywhere besides New York & Washington are automatically going to offer me less of an experience, less of that professional environment for my career, less of the networks, & so on. I'm a major fan of trance, house, electro, techno, & dubstep music with great interest in rock as well as alternative too- New York's just perfect for me. Politically & socially I'm pretty liberal but I like to play "moderate" because I believe politics is best kept to oneself instead of spread mouth to mouth like malaria- I believe in live-let-live as well as "agree to disagree automatically". As both an atheist & liberal I wouldn't like it if someone tried to tell me my viewpoints were erroneous so I respect the fact that I shouldn't ever do the same back to anyone. New York's an incredible live-let-live environment. Most of all- I'm a very fast paced person and in actual life I'm very quiet and reserved- I don't go out of my way to talk to people randomly nor do I expect people to be intrusive but at the same time I do like the ability to strike up an interesting conversation when it's appropriate to and meet people with diverse ideologies- again this is the personality that embodies most of New York. I'm a more into a fast moving environment, where hours are minutes, minutes are seconds, & seconds are microseconds- I like to be in a place where the environment gives you a speed to go by, where there's always something to do- where there isn't a time of day that you have so much free time on the sidewalks to be dozing off gazing into oblivion.
On the slip side, what I like about San Francisco is that it integrates topography with an urban environment. I don't care what anyone has to say (especially the Seattle or Honolulu crowd) but San Francisco is the prettiest city in the United States to me in a natural context. The Bay Area is also the most integrated place I've ever seen in the United States & the plethora of cultures as well as backgrounds there feels like it's second only to New York. Politically the Bay Area is more of my gear on my views but socially I'm not so open to talk about politics with people- remember live let live. I also appreciate the intellectual vibe of the Bay Area & the suburbs with both scenery on vicinity or proximity are incredible. That towering feeling of standing on a hill in the middle of the city, looking at the dizzying road curb, the lights & stars in front & above you with the city glowing right before you looking into the distance and seeing mountains and the bridge as well as the cold depths of the dark waters of the Pacific with the chills running through you while doing so is just incredible. I love the awesome drives- especially crossing the Golden Gae Bridge (at night) with chilly weather and then seeing the mountains as they're outlines by the night shade. Then the next morning seeing the mountains in Sonoma before treking to Napa, driving through the Oakland side of the area and seeing the glimmering and beautiful San Francisco on the otherside masked by lush green trees on the foreground while the city of Oakland lays direcrtly on the other side shining. I have seen the Google headquarters from the inside in Mountain View (my cousin works there) & the Adobe headquarters in downtown San Jose and I must say I'm impressed at how luxuriously companies build their campuses in the Bay Area. I love the city feel that each of the big three Bay Area cities have in their own distinctive ways: San Francisco, San Jose, & Oakland as well as the way they just come together so closely strewn. San Francisco is a very romantic type of city- the type of city where if you go with the right person without any interruptions you'll feel a multitude of different emotions.
What I appreciate about both is definitely the museums, zoos, arts, urban parks, theater, & cultural scenes. I love art galleries- just endlessly staring at art then sidewalks walking to the next frame with a fixated view and staring at a picture for 20 minutes, then repeating the same. I love museums, especially the science museums with prehistoric skeletons, artifacts, mummies, & so much more. I love zoos- especially urban zoos with a variety & plethora of things to see & do in a fun filled family environment. I love urban parks quite a lot especially the ones that pack architectural gems in them (like castles!) with museums, shopping, lovely green trees, ample amount of space for soccer or playing catch with a football, & stunning lakes in them. I love theaters, when in New York I went to go and see "Chicago" and felt myself falling increasingly in love with both my American home city (Chicago) & New York at the same time, I also went and saw Wicked!. It was amazing. I love the ethnic enclaves, the architecture, food, language, clothing styles, culture, even straight on down to the stains & vibe while walking in them is just amazing.
MOST OF ALL: I love cities that are built on mass bodies of water, especially the cities that are built up vertically along an amazing waterfront where you can take a architecture tour from the boat and see the stunning glimmering skyline from the water. It's so breathtaking- as is the dual skyline aspect of New York & Jersey City. If the city isn't built on the water or not on water then I want something dramatic out of it like either staggering mountains in the city with their own unique twists to their look (Denver or Tucson) or have a hella lot of close family & friends there to be set for life (Dallas or Houston). Otherwise no bueno & no can do.
I don't need statistics to tell me what place I'd find more desirable- they both are. I don't need statistics to tell me where I'll have more fun- they both are. I don't need statistics to tell me where I'll be more successful- the potential is there for both (but for me specifically New York way more so). To me I wish people would share more of their experiences & opinions rather than statistics all the time- it shows that there's a person there behind the computer screen with a heart & soul with experiences to share. It's possibly because I joined this forum in due respect to the fact that I have an infinitely never ending hobby for travel more so than anything else (I cant ever stay in one place)- so I like to see relative opinions and experiences in comparison. Not only does it tell whose actually been and experienced but it helps others get an idea of what type of "environment" they're working with. Statistics are cool sometimes when they serve a purpose otherwise they come off as just shoving things down other peoples throats all the damn time.
Next time I go to New York- I'll explore more of Long Island. I haven't seen much if any of it except for certain sections of Brooklyn & Queens and in both cases it was only the area along the water. My favorite cities in the world are (in order): New York, London, Seoul, Hong Kong, Melbourne, Tokyo, Chicago, Singapore, Osaka, Madrid, Amsterdam, Istanbul, Barcelona, Frankfurt, San Francisco, Bangkok, Tel Aviv, Hamburg, Zurich, Berlin, Dubai, Busan, Bangalore, Pune, Taipei, & Moscow. Several of which I still haven't seen yet. With retirement prospects of Seattle, Denver, Tucson, San Diego, & Austin (any order except Austin is last). Both New York & San Francisco are represented.
Sidenote: I don't really give a bloody F about things like weather (even though I hate cold but I can suck it for a great place) or beaches (I hate beaches & especially hate the living hell out of beach culture).
Overall: If I had to leave Washington for anywhere else in the United States though- it would be New York or Chicago. One of which I think is vastly better than Washington & the other of which I think of as equally interesting for me as well as my former home- where I still have a place to crash at my parents' loft in River North. Bay Area would be my next choice but for career related reasons as well as the fact that it's far away from New York, Washington, & Chicago and that I have a hella lot of family there (who will be nosy!) it would be my fourth choice in the United States. All of these places being exceptionally great places to live, work, & play. Truly an asset for the entire country in my opinion.
Anyway sorry for the pretty long post but I just wanted to share.
Did you really think that anyone would read all of this?
Winner of the longest post award goes to.....
Last edited by supermanpansy; 02-27-2013 at 10:51 AM..
Why is he being dense? I liken it to people and type - you know how you can find someone attractive but your friend would say ewwww ugly - well same with natural beauty. I agree with Nairobi's sentiment though I have the same feeling as you in terms of attraction.
Nope. Not buying it. Just say you like NYC better as a city, thats all. You dont have to sugar coat and say.....gee the natural setting is subjective and whats great to one is average to another. I can make an argument I like San Francisco's skyline better than Manhattan and be in the 1% like you guys in regard to natural beauty.
Ummmm I'm not even sure you read my comment thoroughly before replying. If you did I stated that I agree with you that S.F is more beautiful from a natural beauty perspective than NYC, but that I agree with Nairobi's sentiment that beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Wheter he is in the minority is irrelevant. If he believe NYC is more beautiful than S.F that is his right because it is a subjective argument so how can we fault him?
On the same token, I'd personally rather live in NYC than S.F and i'm sure most people would say the same, but there are plenty of people who'd rather live in S.F... shall we attack them for the choice.. NO it's called personal preference which squarely sits in the realm of subjectivity.
I feel Vancouver is more beautiful than S.F but that isn't to say I have the final say, nor is it the final say if most people find Vancouver more beautiful than S.F - It just means more people find Vancouver more beautiful that S.F..
What is objective is a statement of fact... such as the ESB is taller than the Transamerica pyramid.. if I made the claim that TP is taller than ESB than I rightfully should be pistol whipped!
Quote:
Originally Posted by slo1318
Nope. Not buying it. Just say you like NYC better as a city, thats all. You dont have to sugar coat and say.....gee the natural setting is subjective and whats great to one is average to another. I can make an argument I like San Francisco's skyline better than Manhattan and be in the 1% like you guys in regard to natural beauty.
Last edited by fusion2; 02-27-2013 at 03:17 PM..
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