What States Are Considered Southern - Here's Your Sign (best, better, map)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
There seems to be great debate on this site as to what states are or are not considered Southern states and/or Border states. The information below will hopefully add some clarity to the question.
Modern definition: The following states are almost always included in modern day definitions as constituting the South: Alabama, Arkansas, Georgia, Florida, Kentucky, Oklahoma, Louisiana, Mississippi, North Carolina, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas, Virginia and West Virginia. Sources, such as the US Census Bureau, classify Maryland and Missouri as Southern, with Delaware only rarely grouped within the region. West Virginia is usually considered Southern, because it was once part of Virginia with strong southern ties and speech patterns. Oklahoma is included as a southern state as it was considered a slave territory with it's government sympathies pro-Confederate and strongly influenced by Texas.
Why did the five states, some considered Southern states and some border states (Missouri, Kentucky, West Virginia, Delaware and Maryland) remain in the Union? States decided whether or not to secede either by voting or through the actions of their state legislators. Why the states of Maryland, Delaware, Missouri, Kentucky, and West Virginia decided to stay in the Union despite being slave-owning states are as follows:
Missouri, in relation to Union States, would expose herself, if she became a member of the confederacy, to total destruction when any disjunction occured between the different republics. Militarily, secession and association with the Southern confederacy could mean annihilation for the state. Therefore it was thought best that Missouri assume the role of a state whose interests were tied the continuance of the Union, and whose kindredship and firm sympathies were alongside the Southern States as they were strongly linked by friendship and blood.
This was of critical importantance as well for the Western counties of Virginia, which to some degree seceded from Virginia out of distrust for the State government in Richmond and fear that West Virginia would be conquered by Union soldiers long before the Confederacy could advance military protection. Kentucky’s governor was in sympathy with the South, however most of the legislature was pro-Union with a large contingency of Union forces present in the state, therefore Kentucky did not secede. The State legislature did, however, back the Crittenden Compromise which proposed to add six amendments to the State Constitution protecting slave-holders rights. Maryland voted against succession due in part to a split on the issue by their citizenry, but also because Maryland was occupied by the Union Army at the time. In Delaware, though slavery was legal, many were anti-slavery or believed secession to be an over-reaction. Having only 587 slaveholders, or .05% of the total population, who owned on average three slaves, Delaware had much of their population either anti-slavery or feeling that secession was gross over-reation — slave-owning interests were not vital to Delaware. The State legislature voted decidedly to remain in the Union rather than leave and continue to seek compromises on the issue of slavery.
Missouri and Kentucky both had governments-in-exile that were loyal to the Confederacy. The flag of the Confederate States of America had 13 stars representing the 11 seceded states and 1 for Missouri and 1 for Kentucky, which were member states though the CSA did not have military control over either.
So of the five border states which did not secede, two had Confederate representation, one state was occupied with another being partially occupied, one state thought slavery was not crucial to it's economy or survival and therefore of little import, and one felt, as did Missouri though represented in the Confederacy, the risk was too great compared to the benefits. This state was West Virginia. Opposition to secession was strong and the state chose to secede from Virginia rather than from the Union.
Reasons border states stayed in the Union were many and respective to their heritage, location, economy and ultimate chance for survival given the circumstances of the times. Even today, some are more decidedly Southern, such as Kentucky and West Virginia, with others being of mixed sentiment such as Missouri and Maryland and only Delaware falling more resolutely Northern in association just as in the Civil War era.
A few years ago two men were pulled over in Texas. One had a gun the other had an ounce of marijuana. The man with the gun got written a citation and let go. The man with the marijuana went to jail.
My family in Missouri, about an hour and a half south from KC consider themselves to be southern, not midwestern.
Would that be fairly typical of your area with regard to considering themselves Southerners or Mid-Westerners? What would those in St. Louis consider themselves?
Would that be fairly typical of your area with regard to considering themselves Southerners or Mid-Westerners? What would those in St. Louis consider themselves?
People in St. Louis consider themselves Midwesterners, and ceeglass, the U.S. Census Bureau considers Missouri to be Midwestern. Wherever you pulled that crap about the U.S. Census Bureau classifying it as being Southern I don't know, but look at any modern U.S. Census Bureau definition and map and you should see quite the contrary. As far as an hour and a half south of K.C., I know that my dad grew up in Joplin, Missouri, 2 and a half to 3 hours south of Kansas City and most people his family knew living there at the time didn't consider themselves to be southern. His paternal side of the family has roots in the region all the way back to the mid 19th century, and his grandfather (my great grandfather) was the mayor of Monett in either the late 1800s or early 1900s. I kid you not. So my father and information passed on through generations of our family is probably a better source of information than those people mentioned in the previous post. In the 1960s growing up there he said that a minority there considered themselves to be Southern, and he didn't consider most people he knew there to be that way. As far as Maryland and Delaware go, they have more in common with Pennsylvania today than they do with Virginia. Kentucky and West Virginia were the two border states to decisively go Southern, that's where the definition is right. Missouri, Maryland, and Delaware all clearly went the other way though...this was especially evident after the Civil War. The Mason-Dixon line was never even meant to divide the North and the South in the first place..it was part of a property settlement. Missouri is the least rarely grouped into the region today. The U.S. Census Bureau considers Maryland and Delaware to be Southern far more often, but anyone with common sense would realize they are Mid-Atlantic states, quite different from Virginia. Also, there is no proof the entire government of Missouri supported secession, only that the governor and some of his close delegates did...the state convention was against secession and even declared the state offices vacant. The state convention had to vote for secession in order for it to be legitimate. You either have bad sources of information or are manipulating facts. There are many holes in that theory, and it's not the final say because official documentation says otherwise.
A few years ago two men were pulled over in Texas. One had a gun the other had an ounce of marijuana. The man with the gun got written a citation and let go. The man with the marijuana went to jail.
Depends on where in Texas, ... If it was Austin the man with marijuana wouldn't have even been written a citation.
There seems to be great debate on this site as to what states are or are not considered Southern states and/or Border states. The information below will hopefully add some clarity to the question.
Modern definition: The following states are almost always included in modern day definitions as constituting the South: Alabama, Arkansas, Georgia, Florida, Kentucky, Oklahoma, Louisiana, Mississippi, North Carolina, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas, Virginia and West Virginia. Sources, such as the US Census Bureau, classify Maryland and Missouri as Southern, with Delaware only rarely grouped within the region. West Virginia is usually considered Southern, because it was once part of Virginia with strong southern ties and speech patterns. Oklahoma is included as a southern state as it was considered a slave territory with it's government sympathies pro-Confederate and strongly influenced by Texas.
Why did the five states, some considered Southern states and some border states (Missouri, Kentucky, West Virginia, Delaware and Maryland) remain in the Union? States decided whether or not to secede either by voting or through the actions of their state legislators. Why the states of Maryland, Delaware, Missouri, Kentucky, and West Virginia decided to stay in the Union despite being slave-owning states are as follows:
Missouri, in relation to Union States, would expose herself, if she became a member of the confederacy, to total destruction when any disjunction occured between the different republics. Militarily, secession and association with the Southern confederacy could mean annihilation for the state. Therefore it was thought best that Missouri assume the role of a state whose interests were tied the continuance of the Union, and whose kindredship and firm sympathies were alongside the Southern States as they were strongly linked by friendship and blood.
This was of critical importantance as well for the Western counties of Virginia, which to some degree seceded from Virginia out of distrust for the State government in Richmond and fear that West Virginia would be conquered by Union soldiers long before the Confederacy could advance military protection. Kentucky’s governor was in sympathy with the South, however most of the legislature was pro-Union with a large contingency of Union forces present in the state, therefore Kentucky did not secede. The State legislature did, however, back the Crittenden Compromise which proposed to add six amendments to the State Constitution protecting slave-holders rights. Maryland voted against succession due in part to a split on the issue by their citizenry, but also because Maryland was occupied by the Union Army at the time. In Delaware, though slavery was legal, many were anti-slavery or believed secession to be an over-reaction. Having only 587 slaveholders, or .05% of the total population, who owned on average three slaves, Delaware had much of their population either anti-slavery or feeling that secession was gross over-reation — slave-owning interests were not vital to Delaware. The State legislature voted decidedly to remain in the Union rather than leave and continue to seek compromises on the issue of slavery.
Missouri and Kentucky both had governments-in-exile that were loyal to the Confederacy. The flag of the Confederate States of America had 13 stars representing the 11 seceded states and 1 for Missouri and 1 for Kentucky, which were member states though the CSA did not have military control over either.
So of the five border states which did not secede, two had Confederate representation, one state was occupied with another being partially occupied, one state thought slavery was not crucial to it's economy or survival and therefore of little import, and one felt, as did Missouri though represented in the Confederacy, the risk was too great compared to the benefits. This state was West Virginia. Opposition to secession was strong and the state chose to secede from Virginia rather than from the Union.
Reasons border states stayed in the Union were many and respective to their heritage, location, economy and ultimate chance for survival given the circumstances of the times. Even today, some are more decidedly Southern, such as Kentucky and West Virginia, with others being of mixed sentiment such as Missouri and Maryland and only Delaware falling more resolutely Northern in association just as in the Civil War era.
Only states with overt Southern culture in the majority of the entire state: Deep South states and then some surrounding states. IMHO here's how I would rank 'em (which matches up pretty well with the Census, although my designations/groupings are a little different):
Deep South
Alabama
Mississippi
South Carolina
Georgia
Louisiana
Mid-South
Tennessee
Arkansas
Kentucky
Western South
Oklahoma
Texas
Coastal South
North Carolina
Virginia*
Florida*
Border South
West Virginia
*Florida and Virginia receive an asterick for not containing a majority of Southern culture due to high influx of transplants. However, in the areas where there is Southern culture in Florida (Pensacola to Lakeland) and Virginia (Richmond to southern border) the Southern culture is very strong/observable.
[quote=ajf131;9236105] Also, there is no proof the entire government of Missouri supported secession, only that the governor and some of his close delegates did...the state convention was against secession and even declared the state offices vacant. The state convention had to vote for secession in order for it to be legitimate.
Dude, the copy I posted never said anything about the entire government of Missouri supporting secession or how it's governor felt, the article cited Kentucky's governor and legislature and where their sympathies were. Please reread.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
