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So start a thread to ban all these. The entire post above is irrelevant to vaccines.
I don't want to ban these items. I'm simply asking if you are for banning them, via gov decree, given your concern for public health and your pro view on gov requiring vaccines for kids attending public schools.
I think suzy_q2010 said it well and is the thought process for many here who are pro-vaccine and want the gov to force such a thing on kids to attend public school.
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010
When public health is threatened, the government should act to prevent it.
Given cancer is a major threat to public health, well, I'd guess you'd be all for having the gov ban all tobacco and all junk food(deemed by some gov oversight group of course what constitutes junk food) based on the data I provided in my previous post though perhaps I'm mistaken.
I don't want to ban these items. I'm simply asking if you are for banning them, via gov decree, given your concern for public health and your pro view on gov requiring vaccines for kids attending public schools.
I think suzy_q2010 said it well and is the thought process for many here who are pro-vaccine and want the gov to force such a thing on kids to attend public school.
Given cancer is a major threat to public health, well, I'd guess you'd be all for having the gov ban all tobacco and all junk food(deemed by some gov oversight group of course what constitutes junk food) based on the data I provided in my previous post though perhaps I'm mistaken.
So start a thread if you want to discuss that stuff.
And I wonder just how long the list is of "medical reasons" that allow those parents to opt out and rely on the "herd effect" because others (but not their children) are required to be vaccinated.
Only medical exemptions, approved by a doctor, will be allowed under the law. A licensed physician will have to write a letter explaining the child’s medical circumstances that make immunization unsafe for that child.
Children who are not vaccinated must be home-schooled or participate in public school independent study. The law goes into effect July 1, 2016.
This is in West Virginia, but pertinent in terms of what is allowed
What Medical Exemption requests are typically granted in West Virginia?
• Weakened immune system due to a permanent or temporary condition e.g. certain diseases, medications,
cancer, chemotherapy, radiation treatment, etc.
• Severe allergy to a vaccine component
• Serious adverse event associated with a previous vaccination
What Medical Exemption requests are typically denied?
• Vaccine-hesitant and for reasons not supported by current medical or safety standards
• Use of experimental or unlicensed products to provide immunization
• Family has history of vaccine reactions
• Philosophical and religious objections to immunization
• Common side effect to a previous vaccination
The California law allows for family history exemptions if the doctor thinks it is warranted unlike WV.
You're missing the point. This is much bigger then vaccines. It's about government mandating what people do with their bodies.
Oh, you said this so well and concise. Thank You.
Interesting how on some of my posts when I try to push this point further and ask "where does it stop" with specific examples, no one wants to answer the questions and call "off topic!" when it's spot on topic to get some to see that this is a much larger issue that decisions like this can potentially cause. That's telling, isn't it? But there's really nothing for some to be embarrassed about in my view. If one is for more gov insight/oversight/mandates, not sure why some don't want to admit that. We all have different opinions on this/that but it's interesting how many don't want to address this can of worms. Oh well.
Interesting how on some of my posts when I try to push this point further and ask "where does it stop" with specific examples, no one wants to answer the questions and call "off topic!" when it's spot on topic to get some to see that this is a much larger issue that decisions like this can potentially cause. That's telling, isn't it? But there's really nothing for some to be embarrassed about in my view. If one is for more gov insight/oversight/mandates, not sure why some don't want to admit that. We all have different opinions on this/that but it's interesting how many don't want to address this can of worms. Oh well.
They can't answer the question because they don't want to face reality and recognize their own inherent contradictions and hypocrisy. I have brought up the topic of abortion in this regard. Personally I think that abortion is wrong but I am pro-choice because I don't believe that the government has any right to tell people that they cannot have an abortion. I am also pro-choice when it comes to vaccinations. They are both examples of the old saying, "keep your laws off of my body". I am willing to bet that many of the vaccine pushers are pro-choice when it comes to abortion, but not when it comes to vaccinations. They tell me it's not related or they tell me that there are no victims in abortion (hello ) but there are when people don't vaccinate. They either are unable or unwilling to face the fact that they are being hypocritical when they want to take away choice in regards to what people do with their bodies when it comes to vaccines and not in other regards. Your examples about nutrition and the government adding mandates to what we eat, drink, smoke, etc. are spot on. Great posts.
They didn't have a chicken pox vaccine when my son was little.
He got it, and kindly passed it on to me at age 25. It wasn't pretty, and I triggered an outbreak of shingles when I was non-symptomatic at the office.
I looked like someone had deep fried me because of all the blisters. The fever, the body aches.
The blisters on areas we don't talk about.
Yuck. Seriously, vaccinate your kids, and yourself.
They can't answer the question because they don't want to face reality and recognize their own inherent contradictions and hypocrisy. I have brought up the topic of abortion in this regard. Personally I think that abortion is wrong but I am pro-choice because I don't believe that the government has any right to tell people that they cannot have an abortion. I am also pro-choice when it comes to vaccinations. They are both examples of the old saying, "keep your laws off of my body". I am willing to bet that many of the vaccine pushers are pro-choice when it comes to abortion, but not when it comes to vaccinations. They tell me it's not related or they tell me that there are no victims in abortion (hello ) but there are when people don't vaccinate. They either are unable or unwilling to face the fact that they are being hypocritical when they want to take away choice in regards to what people do with their bodies when it comes to vaccines and not in other regards. Your examples about nutrition and the government adding mandates to what we eat, drink, smoke, etc. are spot on. Great posts.
Great points again. I'm of the same mind on the concept of individual free choice and that each person is responsible for their own outcomes based on those decisions. I think your 1st sentence can certainly apply to more than a few people I've met/known in this world, that's for sure. The other thing I was thinking that perhaps some who favor such laws do so because they don't want to take the responsibility of making their own decisions in life on certain topics as if the outcome is negative, they will be held responsible for their choice and that's a heavy thing for many to deal with if they make the "wrong" choice. Put it on gov to make the choice for them and hey, if things go wrong, "it ain't my fault/my decision!....I was just doing what I was told." And lets face it, I think some people are just out and out control freaks! And so it is. Given we live in a country where more and more laws don't seem to apply to some with loopholes galore or some just feel they are above the law(insert numerous excuses), well, perhaps this vaccine mandate CA law will just be like many others and end up being a paper tiger.
Thanks for all your comments and for your insight. People like yourself give me some hope that independent thought still exists, even misguided people like us on this whole vaccine thing who are "wrong".
I'm pretty consistent - I believe governments have an obligation to protect people from the stupidity of others who demonstrate an inability to make a responsible "choice" - for example:
- drunk driving
- smoking in public places
- failing to vaccinate
Where a person's behavior only impacts them I'm less concerned although I do have concerns about the financial costs of discretionary behavior being born by others.
I support health care insurance being very closely aligned with risk factors so although I wouldn't go so far as to restrict fattening foods, people who choose not to eat well and exercise should not benefit from the same low premiums as others. Frankly if I were a health insurance company I would jack up the rates for any unvaccinated person because of the risk they are choosing to assume. I support helmet laws because the costs of supporting brain injured riders is born by others.
Others that are pro-science and pro health will draw different lines I'm sure but where we align, in this thread, is that California has done the right thing by clearly protecting the public good and limiting people's rights to choose to expose others to risk.
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) but there are when people don't vaccinate. They either are unable or unwilling to face the fact that they are being hypocritical when they want to take away choice in regards to what people do with their bodies when it comes to vaccines and not in other regards. Your examples about nutrition and the government adding mandates to what we eat, drink, smoke, etc. are spot on. Great posts.
And lets face it, I think some people are just out and out control freaks!
And so it is. Given we live in a country where more and more laws don't seem to apply to some with loopholes galore or some just feel they are above the law(insert numerous excuses), well, perhaps this vaccine mandate CA law will just be like many others and end up being a paper tiger. 
