Less expensive alternative to Boulder (Denver, Arvada: townhouse, neighborhoods, buying)

[livecontent]

Bradburn 1,

Wonderful truthful post. Over the time, I have read your posts, I have come to enjoy your comments, even though sometimes I do not agree.

I did visit Brandburn, many times based on your posts. I do have to agree that it can be good place to live. I like that there has been some growth in stores near and about this development.

As I said before, I think Bradburn will look much better when it ages. A little patina, a little blemish, a few wrinkles, more tree growth will give it much more character--like a pretty young woman who reaches her 30s and 40s and now has the intelligence and experience, all melded together with her beauty....Ahhhhhh

[Bradburn1]

Man, you crack me up!

[cityofdenver]

Originally Posted by livecontent

This is a very good post. These areas are good areas to live if you want real authentic neighborhoods. However, note that real is not a fake sterile copy of reality. Authentic also means old that is can be "real old" and areas will have tarnishes, defects and have the patina of time. Also some residents can have these same characteristics.

Many times people talk about wanting to live in an area that is authentic, different, unique older homes and neighborhood shops and not "cookie cutter" but their needs are best served by that clean and scrubbed copy, like Bradburn, a new urban community, or a suburban new development. This is not criticism because each have different needs and tolerate less from their desired wants. They may not admit it, but why move to a neighborhood and be unhappy, where your sight will disclose that which is not always your view of perfection.



Livecontent

I admit-we may (as a couple/family) fit into this category. That is why I am so thankful for all of your input. This journey is exploratory and I am sure in the end we will figure out what is a best fit. After reading these posts to my husband it is clear that we will need to find a compromise. He is from Southern California and I am from Seattle. He could care less about unique,mature trees, or walkability. He is interested in more square footage and a medium sized yard. We both agree that we would like to have fun, family oriented neighbors, a sense of community and a good balance between affordability and location to the city. We are foodies and enjoy exploring new restaurants or cooking/bbqing ourselves at home with friends (no chain restaurants).

What do people have to say about Stapleton? I have read through some historic threads, but don't yet have a good feel for it.

Again, I am SO grateful to have all of your input. Thank you. I am so excited to find our home neighborhood!

[livecontent]

Originally Posted by cityofdenver

I admit-we may (as a couple/family) fit into this category. That is why I am so thankful for all of your input. This journey is exploratory and I am sure in the end we will figure out what is a best fit. After reading these posts to my husband it is clear that we will need to find a compromise. He is from Southern California and I am from Seattle. He could care less about unique,mature trees, or walkability. He is interested in more square footage and a medium sized yard. We both agree that we would like to have fun, family oriented neighbors, a sense of community and a good balance between affordability and location to the city. We are foodies and enjoy exploring new restaurants or cooking/bbqing ourselves at home with friends (no chain restaurants).

What do people have to say about Stapleton? I have read through some historic threads, but don't yet have a good feel for it.

Again, I am SO grateful to have all of your input. Thank you. I am so excited to find our home neighborhood!

Thank you for taking my post in the proper context and not as an insult.

Taking all the considerations, your needs, wants and desires. I do not think that Stapleton will meet your qualification. I like it as it has many good attributes and is fast changing the characteristics of this area, which is extremely important for Denver. In addition, it provides basic stores and new housing in this area. However, it is really built in the middle and nearby to some neighborhoods that you difinitely will not find acceptable, per your view--not mine.

Saying all that, your best place to live that will give you good security, excellent education, walkable neighborhoods, good commute to downtown-- in a city that has many unique, older homes and newer homes in well established treed neighborhoods, that are well desired and maintained is Arvada.

There are many other fine areas that are people favorites but natives and long term residents know that Arvada and the Ralston Valley is considered an exceptional place to live and raise a family, in the Denver area.

Again, I suggest you do a search on my name and keyword Arvada for my many posts. You could also seek out areas of Wheat Ridge/Lakewood/Golden, keyword is Applewood.


Livecontent

[davebarnes]

Originally Posted by cityofdenver

interested in more square footage and a medium sized yard...would like to have fun, family oriented neighbors, a sense of community and a good balance between affordability and location to the city. We are foodies and enjoy exploring new restaurants... (no chain restaurants).

You have some conflicting goals.
1. More sqft. For the most part, the further from city center, the more sqft.
2. Restaurants (not chain). For the most part, the closer to city center, the more restaurants for foodies.

So, here is my suggestion.
Start at 38th Avenue and Sheridan Blvd and drive west on 38th until you find the house (in Wheat Ridge) that suits you. Go no further west than you have to.
Now, you will drive east to reach downtown and all the restaurants inside Denver city limits (West Highland, Highland, Berkeley, LoDo).
You could also repeat this process with 32nd Avenue.

[livecontent]

Originally Posted by davebarnes

You have some conflicting goals.
1. More sqft. For the most part, the further from city center, the more sqft.
2. Restaurants (not chain). For the most part, the closer to city center, the more restaurants for foodies.

So, here is my suggestion.
Start at 38th Avenue and Sheridan Blvd and drive west on 38th until you find the house (in Wheat Ridge) that suits you. Go no further west than you have to.
Now, you will drive east to reach downtown and all the restaurants inside Denver city limits (West Highland, Highland, Berkeley, LoDo).
You could also repeat this process with 32nd Avenue.

Excellent! Excellent! I cannot give you more reps but I never thought about that idea.

I love West 38th. There are so many local restaurants. Some have been around for years and are of reasonable value.

Livecontent

[docwatson]

I admit-we may (as a couple/family) fit into this category. That is why I am so thankful for all of your input. This journey is exploratory and I am sure in the end we will figure out what is a best fit. After reading these posts to my husband it is clear that we will need to find a compromise. He is from Southern California and I am from Seattle. He could care less about unique,mature trees, or walkability. He is interested in more square footage and a medium sized yard. We both agree that we would like to have fun, family oriented neighbors, a sense of community and a good balance between affordability and location to the city. We are foodies and enjoy exploring new restaurants or cooking/bbqing ourselves at home with friends (no chain restaurants).

Dave Barnes has great advice - eastern Wheat Ridge just west of Denver would have walkable, tree-lined streets along with a decent sized house and yard and possibly even views, and an easy time to get to those local shops in Denver or perhaps one day in Edgewater. In Denver, our old neighborhoods are more like Seattle (single-family homes) than like the rowhome-urbanism of the east coast. Plus the Clear Creek greenway is nice out there.

[livecontent]

Having an extensive past and education in the restaurant industry, I want to note an issue about chain vs. non-chained restaurants.

You will more likely find local non-chained restaurants in older areas of the regions where there are older strip malls and older properties for rent. These can be much less expensive places to rent than newer rental properties in newer areas. A local entrepreneur in the food industry has to to more closely look at fixed cost, so these properties are best. It is also a better place for investors to start a restaurants, work out the problems with lower fixed costs, thinking they will expand and later franchise.

Developers and investors of newer properties in wealthier areas want to bring in well known and tested brands because these brands attracts others of their type. National chains and shops group together with non-competing concepts and work off each others business traffic. These properties are more expensive and if the property is desirous, the property owners want businesses that can honor and support a long term lease.

All chained restaurants, at some point in time, started as a single unit, somewhere, and it was for many, a lower cost property in a older area. For they at that time, could not afford the newer properties. They become sucessful, investors come in, franchise happens and then it becomes a chain restaurant. If it is done right and has consistent quality control over many locations and over time, you then get the same quality products that the one single unit developed. So, to say that many chained restaurant does not have quality food is wrong. MacDonald's has quality consistent food. Panda Express has good food, well delivered etc.

However, when restaurants become known with too many units, they can also bore the consumer and also are not unique for those who need continual new arousals of their appetite.

Also going to a restaurant becomes entertainment and many of the money classes want to be be perceive as living their lives in the cutting edge and a more ubiquitous restaurant does not give them the exclusive persona that they crave. It is also the problem when a local unique restuarant becomes a more popular dining spot, that they loose these special customers, who then view that restaurants as too common, and does not serve these customers ego of themselves, being above the masses. That is one reason higher cost restaurants, serving the wealthier and fickled clients, go in and out of business while lower cost restaurants serving normal working people are still there for decades. I give you an example of Dino's Restaurant in Lakewood, at Kipling an Colfax, which is now celebrating its 50 years in business http://www.lakewooditalianrestaurant.net/

Saying all that, you want to live near these types of restaurants then seek to live near older neighborhoods of Denver and the suburbs.

Livecontent

[davebarnes]

Originally Posted by livecontent

Having an extensive past and education in the restaurant industry

In other words; many, small, just starting out restaurants need "Class C" space.

[livecontent]

Originally Posted by davebarnes

In other words; many, small, just starting out restaurants need "Class C" space.

Class B can also work, in additon to Class C properties as subleases if F, F and E (Furniture, Fixtures and Equipment) are in place and adaptable to the new operation, which would lower entry costs. Class A owners are more selective of their tenants and look more closely if they fit the retail marketing mix and will not approve a sublease, if the concept is not appropriate.

Livecontent