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Roxborough is nice, and 'small', but just a short drive into Littleton or Castle Rock. Beware of foundation issues out there, though, if you are thinking of buying.
Smaller towns within a short drive: Bailey, Castle Pines, Elizabeth, Erie, Conifer..
The walkability score algorithm is as good as can be without looking at each and every address one by one and for each person but it is flawed. It assumes that what everybody wants to walk to is the same. It doesn't take into account that one person never wants to go to the bar or get coffee but someone else want those but never goes to the library or needs an elementary school. It also can't take into account what someone considers 'their' walking distance and generalizes. Its categories aren't fully refined so it marks the local gas station as a grocery store and the address of a local resident as an Art Museum so it doesn't take into account the quality of stuff. It gives a higher score to someone who lives a few blocks from a couple of things than someone who lives a little bit further (maybe 1/2) from a whole lot of things. So it needs to be taken with a grain of salt.
That is not the problem with walkscore. Walkscore leaves off some important places, e.g. the park where my friend and I walk almost every day is not on their map and does not count towards my walkscore at all. For "entertainment" in my area it lists a motel! What kind of "entertainment" do they have in mind? This is not a motel that has bands, etc, it is a Marriott Courtyard.
The walkability score algorithm is as good as can be without looking at each and every address one by one and for each person but it is flawed. It assumes that what everybody wants to walk to is the same. It doesn't take into account that one person never wants to go to the bar or get coffee but someone else want those but never goes to the library or needs an elementary school. It also can't take into account what someone considers 'their' walking distance and generalizes. Its categories aren't fully refined so it marks the local gas station as a grocery store and the address of a local resident as an Art Museum so it doesn't take into account the quality of stuff. It gives a higher score to someone who lives a few blocks from a couple of things than someone who lives a little bit further (maybe 1/2) from a whole lot of things. So it needs to be taken with a grain of salt.
It is only attempt to give general information that may be helpful. I see the flaws in my neighborhood but it is close to the mark. You can somewhat assume that a very low score is about correct as being not walkable, and it can be assumed as close to being correct for a very high score, that it is very walkable with much variability between the extremes. One would not rely totally on this score for a place to live but will look at other information and maps that are available. Of course a drive or walk around for familiarity is best.
Quality and desirability of the amenities nearby are subject to each persons desires. My neighborhood fulfills my needs for basic necessities; another person would desire glitzy bars and entertainment. Yet, with the new rail station that is being constructed down the street from my house, I can easily and quickly get to Downtown Denver, to the east, and Olde Town Arvada, to the west.
Having lived in Europe and NYC, I have learned that your walkable neighborhood is expanded by any nearby quick and frequent public transit. That is the big allure of NYC, specifically Manhattan. If you live near a subway station, all you have to do is board a train and in a few minutes in this dense city, you have another walkable neighborhood with many different set of stores, shops, museums, entertainment, parks etc. For every rail station or transit connect point that is added in Denver, we add a larger walkable neighborhood for those who are fortunate, or make the choice to be considered fortunate, to live near these public transit points.
Livecontent
Last edited by livecontent; 06-22-2012 at 07:49 PM..
After looking at the map of Highlands Ranch on Google maps and Google Earth, I can sum up why Highlands Ranch is not considered walkable. I looked at the King Soopers at University and Highlands Ranch Parkway and measured the straight line distances and the distance of the path the resident of the closest houses and apartments must walk in order to get to the front door. This is what I found:
House A (northeast of King Soopers): Straight line distance: 1085 ft, Walking distance: 3549 ft.
Apartment B (east of KS): Straight line distance: 1885 ft, Walking distance: 2258 ft.
House C (east of KS on other side of apartments): Straight line distance: 2787 ft, Walking distance: 3741 ft.
In contrast, I looked at the King Soopers in the Bear Valley neighborhood of Denver. Here is their data:
House A (north of King Soopers): Straight line distance: 615 ft, Walking distance: 750 ft.
Apartment B (northwest of KS): Straight line distance: 1450 ft, Walking distance: 1875 ft.
House C (northwest of KS on other side of apartments: Straight line distance: 1286 ft, Walking distance: 1592 ft.
If you looked at the KS at 9th and Corona, you'd find even more walkability.
Bottom line is this, the suburbs with their larger lots, lower density and dendritic (fancy term for the cul de sac layouts) street patterns means that there is a wide disparity between straight line distance and walking distance. This makes the area very UNwalkable. The core city with its grid street patterns, smaller lots, and higher density has much less disparity between straight line and walking distance. This leads to more people walking and less driving around.
After looking at the map of Highlands Ranch on Google maps and Google Earth, I can sum up why Highlands Ranch is not considered walkable. I looked at the King Soopers at University and Highlands Ranch Parkway and measured the straight line distances and the distance of the path the resident of the closest houses and apartments must walk in order to get to the front door. This is what I found:
House A (northeast of King Soopers): Straight line distance: 1085 ft, Walking distance: 3549 ft.
Apartment B (east of KS): Straight line distance: 1885 ft, Walking distance: 2258 ft.
House C (east of KS on other side of apartments): Straight line distance: 2787 ft, Walking distance: 3741 ft.
In contrast, I looked at the King Soopers in the Bear Valley neighborhood of Denver. Here is their data:
House A (north of King Soopers): Straight line distance: 615 ft, Walking distance: 750 ft.
Apartment B (northwest of KS): Straight line distance: 1450 ft, Walking distance: 1875 ft.
House C (northwest of KS on other side of apartments: Straight line distance: 1286 ft, Walking distance: 1592 ft.
If you looked at the KS at 9th and Corona, you'd find even more walkability.
Bottom line is this, the suburbs with their larger lots, lower density and dendritic (fancy term for the cul de sac layouts) street patterns means that there is a wide disparity between straight line distance and walking distance. This makes the area very UNwalkable. The core city with its grid street patterns, smaller lots, and higher density has much less disparity between straight line and walking distance. This leads to more people walking and less driving around.
Have you been to Highlands Ranch? The lots for the most part are not what you'd consider "large". Also, you are posting walking distances to the closest homes. Not everyone can live within 750 feet of a King Soopers, even in the city.
Highlands Ranch has Highlands Walk neighborhood. They have a series of cluster,patio homes,flats,townhomes well within reach to multiple grocery stores, restaurants, even a Tattered Cover. There are plenty of suburban hoods that are fairly walkable.
One of the big differences between urban and suburban is how they separate residential and commercial.
It is assumed you will drive to the grocery so little is done to provide pedestrian access.
Growing up our house was less than 100' from the neighborhood strip mall, but it was a block and a half walk because of the zoning required separation.
Neighborhoods like Highlands Ranch are VERY walkable from a exercise/recreational viewpoint with all the open space trails, but lack in the day to day walkablility.
Never heard the word "dendritic"!
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidv
After looking at the map of Highlands Ranch on Google maps and Google Earth, I can sum up why Highlands Ranch is not considered walkable. I looked at the King Soopers at University and Highlands Ranch Parkway and measured the straight line distances and the distance of the path the resident of the closest houses and apartments must walk in order to get to the front door. This is what I found:
House A (northeast of King Soopers): Straight line distance: 1085 ft, Walking distance: 3549 ft.
Apartment B (east of KS): Straight line distance: 1885 ft, Walking distance: 2258 ft.
House C (east of KS on other side of apartments): Straight line distance: 2787 ft, Walking distance: 3741 ft.
In contrast, I looked at the King Soopers in the Bear Valley neighborhood of Denver. Here is their data:
House A (north of King Soopers): Straight line distance: 615 ft, Walking distance: 750 ft.
Apartment B (northwest of KS): Straight line distance: 1450 ft, Walking distance: 1875 ft.
House C (northwest of KS on other side of apartments: Straight line distance: 1286 ft, Walking distance: 1592 ft.
If you looked at the KS at 9th and Corona, you'd find even more walkability.
Bottom line is this, the suburbs with their larger lots, lower density and dendritic (fancy term for the cul de sac layouts) street patterns means that there is a wide disparity between straight line distance and walking distance. This makes the area very UNwalkable. The core city with its grid street patterns, smaller lots, and higher density has much less disparity between straight line and walking distance. This leads to more people walking and less driving around.
After looking at the map of Highlands Ranch on Google maps and Google Earth, I can sum up why Highlands Ranch is not considered walkable. I looked at the King Soopers at University and Highlands Ranch Parkway and measured the straight line distances and the distance of the path the resident of the closest houses and apartments must walk in order to get to the front door. This is what I found:
House A (northeast of King Soopers): Straight line distance: 1085 ft, Walking distance: 3549 ft.
Apartment B (east of KS): Straight line distance: 1885 ft, Walking distance: 2258 ft.
House C (east of KS on other side of apartments): Straight line distance: 2787 ft, Walking distance: 3741 ft.
In contrast, I looked at the King Soopers in the Bear Valley neighborhood of Denver. Here is their data:
House A (north of King Soopers): Straight line distance: 615 ft, Walking distance: 750 ft.
Apartment B (northwest of KS): Straight line distance: 1450 ft, Walking distance: 1875 ft.
House C (northwest of KS on other side of apartments: Straight line distance: 1286 ft, Walking distance: 1592 ft.
If you looked at the KS at 9th and Corona, you'd find even more walkability.
Bottom line is this, the suburbs with their larger lots, lower density and dendritic (fancy term for the cul de sac layouts) street patterns means that there is a wide disparity between straight line distance and walking distance. This makes the area very UNwalkable. The core city with its grid street patterns, smaller lots, and higher density has much less disparity between straight line and walking distance. This leads to more people walking and less driving around.
Good Post!. What really bothers me about these cul de sac layouts is that that many lie in separate little enclaves of developments that connect with few streets or none at all. It causes the car to dump in the main streets and they become busy and with too much traffic. They are just too annoying to walk alongside to a local store and frightening and dangerous to cross at the intersections. You find many of these in the Highland Ranch and other newly type developed areas.
Unless one lives very near or connected to these shopping areas by paths and trails, Highland Ranch is not a very pleasant walkable place to stores. Also the parking lots are so much bigger than older areas and walking across dangerous parking lots is not pleasant; where many of the stores front, in older areas, are nearer or at the sidewalks.
In older grid pattern of streets, there are more streets for auto travel to go through the area and consequently less heavy traffic roads. These types of streets make it more pleasant to walk to local stores and cross at intersections.
I realize that the isolated developments are done to prevent cross traffic in the development. However, in the grid street layout most of the residential streets are very quiet with a few cross streets. Yet, with the more streets available the traffic does not bunch up as much.
There is a movement to build new developments where the parking is situated in the back of the stores, so as to bring the storefront to the front at the sidewalk. There is also new zoning in place to force developers to bring continuous sidewalks into the shopping developments and across the parking lots to the front door.
Of course people choose to live in the place that reflects their lifestyle. Most people in Highland Ranch drive to stores and so the situation of bad walkability does not matter. People who desire to have closer walkable stores and actually do walk, choose other areas to live. You can easily see that if you go to older parts of the metro area, there are many more people walking on the sidewalks. If you go to Highland Ranch, you see very few walkers to the local stores.
Have you been to Highlands Ranch? The lots for the most part are not what you'd consider "large". Also, you are posting walking distances to the closest homes. Not everyone can live within 750 feet of a King Soopers, even in the city.
I am not sure what your argument is. Is it that HR is as walkable as Denver? Yes, I've been to Highlands Ranch, and I am sorry I did not state my conclusions more explicitly.
While many lots in HR are not huge, a large portion of them are. My point considering walkability in HR is that there is a big disparity in the the actual distance and the walking distance. This is due directly to the layout of the city. HR is designed in a way that actually discourages walking and encourages driving.
The disparity between the actual distance and the walking distance in the city is small. This is due to the grid pattern layout of the city which makes it easier for people to walk.
While I know that everyone cannot live close to a supermarket, the way that the city (rather than the suburbs) is laid out, more people can and do walk to the grocery store.
In the city walking is a major form of transportation. In the suburbs walking is a form of recreation/exercise. This is a direct result of the different designs.
I am not sure what your argument is. Is it that HR is as walkable as Denver? Yes, I've been to Highlands Ranch, and I am sorry I did not state my conclusions more explicitly.
While many lots in HR are not huge, a large portion of them are. My point considering walkability in HR is that there is a big disparity in the the actual distance and the walking distance. This is due directly to the layout of the city. HR is designed in a way that actually discourages walking and encourages driving.
The disparity between the actual distance and the walking distance in the city is small. This is due to the grid pattern layout of the city which makes it easier for people to walk.
While I know that everyone cannot live close to a supermarket, the way that the city (rather than the suburbs) is laid out, more people can and do walk to the grocery store.
In the city walking is a major form of transportation. In the suburbs walking is a form of recreation/exercise. This is a direct result of the different designs.
This line pretty much sums up the major difference between urban and suburban at a human level.
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