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With 25-35 students in a classroom, that (all A's) would mean that the top students have not been challenged at all. They would reach mastery immediately. Then what? There's no way that the lowest students in the class are going to learn just as much as the top students. In that way we aren't all equal. (I'm thinking of math in particular.)
I do think the goal should be mastery, but there will be different levels of mastery. Also, not all kids are equal in responsibility, diligence, etc., and grades do reflect these (assignments turned in on time, for example).
Tell that to the late Jaime Escalante and the kids he taught at Garfield High School in East Los Angeles. I like math and the interesting thing about it is that you can not debate it, come out with a differant outcome, improve upon a good answer. You are correct or not correct. If you take 30 kids and teach them how to perform the steps within math you will always come out with the same answer from all kids, if they are taught well and gain and understanding of the process. What say you about that?
Tell that to the late Jaime Escalante and the kids he taught at Garfield High School in East Los Angeles. I like math and the interesting thing about it is that you can not debate it, come out with a differant outcome, improve upon a good answer. You are correct or not correct. If you take 30 kids and teach them how to perform the steps within math you will always come out with the same answer from all kids, if they are taught well and gain and understanding of the process. What say you about that?
I think you missed part of the equation.
What if the students don't do their work?
On the other hand you could just teach them how to cheat better.
Sorry your comment reminded me of a great South Park Episode.
Last edited by Captain Obvious; 02-17-2011 at 11:32 AM..
In my kids' school system, an A is 92 or above. In other words, if you earn an A, it really means something.
Not necessarily. The coursework may have been too easy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Milleka
I would've just replied with, "The State of ____ sets the standards for your student's curriculum, not the individual school district or even the teacher. Your child's grade is a reflection of whether or not those standards were met."
That may be true in your state, but it's not true in every state. "Local control" is a big deal here in Colorado schools. Districts do have their policies, but I've known teachers who circumvent those policies, too. For example, an AP calc teacher was known to "double weight" his course in that a "B" scored on a test was recorded as an "A", etc, plus the course was weighted (given an extra point for A,B, or C grade).
I agree that Bell curves are for larger sample sizes than one usually has in a high school class.
Tell that to the late Jaime Escalante and the kids he taught at Garfield High School in East Los Angeles. I like math and the interesting thing about it is that you can not debate it, come out with a differant outcome, improve upon a good answer. You are correct or not correct. If you take 30 kids and teach them how to perform the steps within math you will always come out with the same answer from all kids, if they are taught well and gain and understanding of the process. What say you about that?
BUT...there are different levels of math questions you can ask. Sure the answers are either right or wrong but the questions can be on many different levels.
Not necessarily. The coursework may have been too easy.
That may be true in your state, but it's not true in every state. "Local control" is a big deal here in Colorado schools. Districts do have their policies, but I've known teachers who circumvent those policies, too. For example, an AP calc teacher was known to "double weight" his course in that a "B" scored on a test was recorded as an "A", etc, plus the course was weighted (given an extra point for A,B, or C grade).
I agree that Bell curves are for larger sample sizes than one usually has in a high school class.
I would agree. Only one of my six classes fell into an natural bell curve last semester but when you put all six classes together, I have a bell curve.
In my kids' school system, an A is 92 or above. In other words, if you earn an A, it really means something.
Maybe, maybe not. It depends on how hard it is to get a 92. My school uses 93 and above for an A but I can write my tests so that half my students can get an A or only a few can get an A. I prefer the latter. It makes my kids stretch.
Because why should the standard for an A vary by class to class? You are never going to have a class that has a perfect normal distribution.
If one class has a top 10% that averages 95% and another class has a top 10% that averages 99%, then how is that fair to the rest of the students in the second class?
Who said anything about the standard for an A varying from class to class??? The question is whether exams should be written so a, reasonable, bell curve is attained. If the top 10% of my class averages 99%, it's time to make my exams harder.
You should try to grade in uniformity with other teachers. For you to grade exceptionally hard is really not fair if the teacher down the hall in the same class grades easier.
I don't think that you should grade so hard that it will make it harder for your kids to get into a good college. Obviously, give them constructive criticism to help them get better, but you don't want it to get to the point that people with good standardized test scores are being held back because you just don't like to give out that many A's.
All you can do is try to instill in them the tools to succeed and their life during and after college will determine how successful they are. As a high school teacher, you should not be affecting the trajectory of their lives for the worse.
If your grading is more or less in line with everyone else, then it can't be said that you singularly adversely affected a child's college prospects. Your grade distribution seems closer to law school than to a high school.
They shouldn't give more A's, but they do. The more elite the institution, the more prevelant grade inflation is...these instutions, regardless of it being a public HS in a wealthy area, a prep school or private HS, or an elite university, need to save face.
Non Elite= Elite
A+, A, A-= A+
B+, B= A
B-=B+
C+, C= B
C-= B-
D+, D= C+
D-, Upper 1/3 of F= C
Middle 1/3 of F= C-
Lower 1/3 of F= a D of some sort
Why would there be reason for complaints with a bell curve? If the top 10% are capable of achieving X then X should set the bar for an A. If your child isn't in that top 10%, then their grade is relative.
The only thing I would not change is minimum proficiency. I wouldn't fail a student who has met the minimum but their grade would reflect they've only met the minimum.
I think that there should be an objective standard set for getting an A and every student who meets the standard should get an A (or a B). It's not fair for students to not know what the standard is to get an A (or a B) and grading them against one another makes it impossible for kids to know what they have to do to get an A.
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