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So.....if your tax money isn't yours (unbelievable...) then, why not donate it all? Seriously? Move to an apartment, sell your cars, and give it all away. Why not? Don't you feel....selfish?
No, it isn't. It belongs to the government. Even the bible says to render unto Ceasar his due. Taxes are just part of living in society. Do you really expect to enjoy the benefits of society without a bill? It's like anything else. I like my house heated in the winter and lights on at night so I pay DTE. That money belongs to DTE for the service they provided me just like my taxes belong to the government for the services they provide me. AND just like the government, they charge different people different rates. Those who can't afford to heat their homes get a break. I have no issue with that. It's how it should be.
Now you're just being silly. Taking things to extremes doesn't make you look smart, in fact, just the opposite. I have a debt to society because I live in society. It's paid. As to what I do with the rest, I, like you, will answer to my maker. "Unto those who are given much, much is expected".
If society decided they were taking 100% of my labors, I'd leave. I do think people should be entitled to get ahead if they are willing to work but I also believe that we are obligated to take care of the less fortunate and to fund the government to the level the majority decides. I wouldn't mind seeing control of the funds for the poor go to the local level because I think it would be cheaper and more efficient but, for now, the system is what it is until such a time as the majority votes to change it.
Back to the subject at hand, which would be the children of parents who would not educate their children if education were not compulsory and paid for by the government, I will not steal from them just to line my pockets.
1). I am only responsible for myself.
2). You owe me absolutely nothing (and I wouldn't take it if you did).
3). I owe you absolutely nothing
4). Anything that you do that creates a burden on society, you are liable for, in every way.
5). Anything I do that creates a burden on society, I are liable for, in every way.
Simple enough.
Simple enough, but not the best way to live in the world. Note that cooperation actually works better than competition in every arena. People don't *owe* each other anything, but humans are social animals and it turns out that we make our society better when we cooperate to achieve goals like educating the young or *all* people in the society.
Which works better, competition or cooperation? The answer,
without equivocation, is cooperation. Although most people are surprised by this, scientists have repeatedly verified it in hundreds of studies since the late 1800s. Yet big business, the educational system, the health-care community, and most parents continue to encourage competition, almost totally neglecting the power of cooperation. None of these groups realizes that unabated competition may be costing billions of dollars in sales and overall decreases in human achievement. Furthermore, researchers have shown that too much competition may cause poor health. Yet we continue to hold the cherished belief that competition (not cooperation), to paraphrase Sigmund Freud, "is the royal road to success."
If in fact competition brings out the "beast" in us, then research demonstrates that cooperation surely brings out the "best" in us. This finding has been held in virtually every occupation, skill, or behavior tested. For instance, scientists who consider themselves cooperative tend to have more published articles than their competitive colleagues. Cooperative
businesspeople have higher salaries. From elementary grades to college, cooperative students have higher grade point averages. Personnel directors who work together have fewer job vacancies to fill. And, not surprisingly, cooperation increases creativity. Unfortunately, most people are not taught
cooperative skills.
Simple enough, but not the best way to live in the world. Note that cooperation actually works better than competition in every arena. People don't *owe* each other anything, but humans are social animals and it turns out that we make our society better when we cooperate to achieve goals like educating the young or *all* people in the society.
I've seen this first hand int he work setting. Working together yeilds a better product and a nicer work environment. Unfortuantely, when employers use competition, they thwart cooperation. It becomes every man for himself.
It looks like this is another thread being hijacked to be used as a Libertarian platform.
We don't live in an a la carte society. Public education is a key component of a democratic society. Everyone who lives within the borders of this great country has an obligation to pay part of the cost for the services legally adopted.
It looks like this is another thread being hijacked to be used as a Libertarian platform.
We don't live in an a la carte society. Public education is a key component of a democratic society. Everyone who lives within the borders of this great country has an obligation to pay part of the cost for the services legally adopted.
Everyone also has the opportunity to run for office or promote legislation to change things to another lawful procedure or to change the law. There are checks to ensure that that freedom is not abused. Thanks again, founding fathers!
Every law we currently have was the result of someone's vision of the American way at the time it was passed. Is it so necessary to vilify people who lived in a society that needed it at the time?
Yeah it's basic common sense. But what the recidivists on this thread want is the destruction of public education in order to fill in the gap with one that makes a profit for the tech/book/hedge funds who all stand to make a huge profit from the privatization of public education. Notice they never yap about highways, or electrical systems or enormous waste in the military, naw none of the that. Just education. That's telling in of itself.
Taking the government out of education will eliminate the profit that currently exists in the tech/book/hedge/construction/food service funds that are in operation currently.
Also, I stated a few posts back that the only military we need is a defensive one, and that there is huge waste in the military and many other federal expenditures.
You're using power which is generated by federally funded water projects, you're using computers and Internet which were invented by federal agencies, which also continue to fund their R&D, you use road and highways which have been funded by the FEDS, you live on land which has been developed only after the Corps of Engineers did their magic.
If you're claiming that all of that was based on the theft due to taxation, then you're a criminal, due to the fact that you benefit from that theft. Turn yourself in and stop being a thief.
I turn myself in every April 15th when I pay for all services from which I benefit- and then some.
What stuns me is that people seem to assume that they had a right to be born into a family that is not poor. Why is there no more consideration that "there but for the grace of God, go I"? I have no problem with atheists ignoring the circumstances of their birth, but it does gall me when those who follow Jesus Christ ignore what he said about the least of these, His brothers. Ivory reminded us of his dictum, from him to whom much is given, much will be expected. I've given my life, so I have no qualms about my judgment. It does make me wonder how those will fare who have spent their earthly life building up their stores and spending it on themselves and their own families, while dropping a bit into the coffers of their favorite charities. I don't obsess about it, but I do wonder.
There don't seem to be any pangs of conscience from those who are content to let the children of the poor suffer for their parents' choices. That's one reason why ghettos are so useful--they keep those unpleasantries away from the faces of the haves and their children. As long as it is possible to dehumanize the poor, it will be possible to justify neglecting their children. It reminds me of the Twilight Zone movie, where the bigot kept falling into the realities of his victims.
The children of the wealthy will likely never have to deal with the experience of coming home to a cold home with no electricity and a broken front door, mom in the next room with a new boyfriend, and a mayonnaise sandwich for supper. That's why so many of my students willing eat the slop they get at school for their free lunch. When the alternative is nothing, slop fills an empty stomach.
Please share that with the children of recent immigrants who come home to houses filled to the brim with people, hold part time jobs, do without, and succeed without the help of 'government'. Please.
No, it isn't. It belongs to the government. Even the bible says to render unto Ceasar his due. Taxes are just part of living in society. Do you really expect to enjoy the benefits of society without a bill? It's like anything else. I like my house heated in the winter and lights on at night so I pay DTE. That money belongs to DTE for the service they provided me just like my taxes belong to the government for the services they provide me. AND just like the government, they charge different people different rates. Those who can't afford to heat their homes get a break. I have no issue with that. It's how it should be.
Now you're just being silly. Taking things to extremes doesn't make you look smart, in fact, just the opposite. I have a debt to society because I live in society. It's paid. As to what I do with the rest, I, like you, will answer to my maker. "Unto those who are given much, much is expected".
If society decided they were taking 100% of my labors, I'd leave. I do think people should be entitled to get ahead if they are willing to work but I also believe that we are obligated to take care of the less fortunate and to fund the government to the level the majority decides. I wouldn't mind seeing control of the funds for the poor go to the local level because I think it would be cheaper and more efficient but, for now, the system is what it is until such a time as the majority votes to change it.
Back to the subject at hand, which would be the children of parents who would not educate their children if education were not compulsory and paid for by the government, I will not steal from them just to line my pockets.
So....will you let me steal money out of your wallet and give it to the Salvation Army? Is that ok with you?
It looks like this is another thread being hijacked to be used as a Libertarian platform.
We don't live in an a la carte society. Public education is a key component of a democratic society. Everyone who lives within the borders of this great country has an obligation to pay part of the cost for the services legally adopted.
Hijacked? Do you read? We're talking about education- the topic of this forum. I'm not going to apologize for having a libertarian opinion about education.
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I've seen this first hand int he work setting. Working together yeilds a better product and a nicer work environment. Unfortuantely, when employers use competition, they thwart cooperation. It becomes every man for himself.