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What do I not have that other people have? A lawn. I choose to live in a townhouse in a city. I love to garden and have a patio that is teeming with flowers and I have bushes and trees on my tiny patch of property. But not having a big yard with grass to take care of saves me tons. Lower property taxes, no lawnmower, no landscapers and I still have "free" flowers for the house.
Additional cost benefits to urban living: I can walk to most things I want to do -- concerts, movies, fine and not-so-fine dining, etc., are a few blocks from my home. I work at home and have needed post office, printing company, computer support, etc., within walking distance. Supermarket and other shopping, and a top hospital, too. Exercise is in the beautiful city park. City-sponsored entertainment, farmer's market all summer, a fabulous public library are right there for my enjoyment. I have a 10-year-old car, but I seldom drive it, so I save on gasoline. The city bus is a block from my door.
And please don't lecture me about taxes. I've calculated carefully and the higher taxes that I pay over what my suburban friends may be spending (which isn't much in many cases) are completely returned to me in opportunities to save time and money elsewhere (transportation, esp.) and the ease of working at home, which would be much harder and more time consuming if I were isolated. City living isn't for everyone, but many people don't even consider it, when it could enrich your life AND save you money.
Finally to Texas User, I'd like to note: frugality becomes neuroses when you turn away from your family, friends, and support networks just to save money. If ragnarkar WANTS to leave California, fine, but to make his life lonely and sad for a cost-savings is ... lonely and sad. The same to others here who deny yourself life's pleasures, forego entertaining your friends -- even having children?! -- just to save bucks. If it's a necessity, God bless you. But to choose that road just so you can stockpile money in the bank and/or tell yourself you're frugal is frankly NUTS.
By all means, recycle and reuse, live in a small home, drive used vehicles or no vehicle, forego fashion and gadgets, do things for yourself instead of paying others, use coupons, don't buy things you don't need or to impress others. But, seriously, ask yourself: are you alienating other people and drawing wacky attention to yourself just to save a buck?? Are you the person who doesn't contribute to the office party yet eats all the food others bring? If so, you're a mooch. Do you do anything to avoid tipping; do you give $10 to the kids for graduation when you can afford to be generous? Then you're stingy. You probably don't have any real friends and you're nobody's favorite relative.
There's a fine line between living frugally and acting crazy and both sides of the line are present on this thread.
Yes and no. It's important to thoroughly examine what your bottom line is when you decide to cut something out of your life in order to be more frugal. For some people, they don't mind living in their cars and the benefit they get from renting a home is not worth the money spent.
Personally, I'm willing to pay for a roof over my head but not that much more. In Southern California, 500-600/mo will get you that, a room in a house (and maybe shared internet and utilities.) In other states, the same amount may get you a 1 bedroom apartment unit to yourself. However, I am perfectly content living in cramped conditions and do not derive any additional pleasure in paying more for higher quality shelter, even if I can afford it. (Buying a house is another alternative but with my long term pessimistic views on the housing market, it's out of the question.) That money is better spent being invested or for vacationing in Europe, but that's another story.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texas User
Chinese are everywhere. I live in Texas now and there are plenty of Chinese.
You will save a ton by moving to a lesser Cost of living state and still maintain the same salary.
You can buy a lot more house for a lot less elsewhere.
And I can live even cheaper moving to China and not be paid very much less. I can also potentially find more lucrative investment banking jobs in Manhattan (assuming I have the connections, don't currently.) Even if that worked out, my 600/mo rental unit will fetch for 1000+ there, not to mention higher food costs and less tolerable weather.
Simply put, I highly prefer the life in California over the life in China, Texas, or NYC. Although I can be more frugal, that's still a personal boundary I set for myself to achieve the minimum acceptable living standards I'm willing to put up with long term.
My career gross earnings peaked out at around $80k/annum. I had job offers for positions where I would have earned $180k but I turned them down [for my own reasons].
During my career we invested in apartment buildings; approaching my retirement we had built a collection of four apartment buildings on my $80k/annum.
We have had sedans, trucks and motorcycles. The most that we have ever paid for a vehicle has been $10,500 and we bought it as retirees.
My point is that I am not upper class. Realistically I guess that we have been lower-middle. We were able to build a fairly decent portfolio; which we converted into a farm when I retired. It was done by constant tight budgeting, trying to be frugal and solid tax-sheltering.
You ''paid' $12k, and I congratulate you on paying it off in 2 years. Even so how much total did you end up paying? Including interest?
If you wish to build Net Worth, you can not do it by spending money on depreciating items.
A 10-year old car is no longer depreciating. A budget of $500 each year for maintenance and repairs [before anything fails], will usually keep older cars going for a long time.
I do wish you luck.
Last edited by Submariner; 10-28-2010 at 10:52 AM..
No mortgage.
No smart phone.
No salon. I cut and style his hair and mine.
Few to no new clothes. I own tons of designer clothes but they are not new off the rack.
No new electronics. It's my mission to refurbish everything. We can create a 1000-dollar Macintosh from a piece of junk no one wants.
No gym. Outdoors and a 100-dollar bike from KMart cover all 4 seasons.
Basic cable only (Internet is cheaper if we bundle it).
Also, no new TV. Ours is vintage. It also looks really cool.
Public transit only.
No landline, VoIp, etc.
No credit cards.
Actually you have got a stable car for about $5,000.
Yes, I know... my Father is a mechanic and I've worked on cars my entire life.
It's a Mazdaspeed3 and I LOVE it. It was a bit of a 'treat' to myself when I graduated college.
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper
My career gross earnings peaked out at around $80k/annum. I had job offers for positions where I would have earned $180k but I turned them down [for my own reasons].
During my career we invested in apartment buildings; approaching my retirement we had built a collection of four apartment buildings on my $80k/annum.
We have had sedans, trucks and motorcycles. The most that we have ever paid for a vehicle has been $10,500 and we bought it as retirees.
My point is that I am not upper class. Realistically I guess that we have been lower-middle. We were able to build a fairly decent portfolio; which we converted into a farm when I retired. It was done by constant tight budgeting, trying to be frugal and solid tax-sheltering.
You ''paid' $12k, and I congratulate you on paying it off in 2 years. Even so how much total did you end up paying? Including interest?
If you wish to build Net Worth, you can not do it by spending money on depreciating items.
A 10-year old car is no longer depreciating. A budget of $500 each year for maintenance and repairs [before anything fails], will usually keep older cars going for a long time.
I do wish you luck.
I didn't pay a penny in interest. A local credit union was doing a 3 year, 0% interest loan for new cars and I jumped on it, which was the main reason I purchased the car.
I can fix my own cars and have all the equipment needed to do everything from an oil change to an entire engine replacement. I even have access to paint booths and a full body shop for free if I so desire.
I had the money, I wanted a new car (I've always owned jalopies that barely ran) so I got one. I'd have to say it's one of the better decisions I've made.
Yes, I know... my Father is a mechanic and I've worked on cars my entire life.
It's a Mazdaspeed3 and I LOVE it. It was a bit of a 'treat' to myself when I graduated college.
I didn't pay a penny in interest. A local credit union was doing a 3 year, 0% interest loan for new cars and I jumped on it, which was the main reason I purchased the car.
I can fix my own cars and have all the equipment needed to do everything from an oil change to an entire engine replacement. I even have access to paint booths and a full body shop for free if I so desire.
I had the money, I wanted a new car (I've always owned jalopies that barely ran) so I got one. I'd have to say it's one of the better decisions I've made.
Yes, I know... my Father is a mechanic and I've worked on cars my entire life.
It's a Mazdaspeed3 and I LOVE it. It was a bit of a 'treat' to myself when I graduated college.
I didn't pay a penny in interest. A local credit union was doing a 3 year, 0% interest loan for new cars and I jumped on it, which was the main reason I purchased the car.
I can fix my own cars and have all the equipment needed to do everything from an oil change to an entire engine replacement. I even have access to paint booths and a full body shop for free if I so desire.
I had the money, I wanted a new car (I've always owned jalopies that barely ran) so I got one. I'd have to say it's one of the better decisions I've made.
My career gross earnings peaked out at around $80k/annum. I had job offers for positions where I would have earned $180k but I turned them down [for my own reasons].
During my career we invested in apartment buildings; approaching my retirement we had built a collection of four apartment buildings on my $80k/annum.
We have had sedans, trucks and motorcycles. The most that we have ever paid for a vehicle has been $10,500 and we bought it as retirees.
My point is that I am not upper class. Realistically I guess that we have been lower-middle. We were able to build a fairly decent portfolio; which we converted into a farm when I retired. It was done by constant tight budgeting, trying to be frugal and solid tax-sheltering.
You ''paid' $12k, and I congratulate you on paying it off in 2 years. Even so how much total did you end up paying? Including interest?
If you wish to build Net Worth, you can not do it by spending money on depreciating items.
A 10-year old car is no longer depreciating. A budget of $500 each year for maintenance and repairs [before anything fails], will usually keep older cars going for a long time.
I do wish you luck.
I paid $12K cash for a car back in 2007 . I don't believe in financing a vehicle since its a depreciable item.
You can still work things out. Compromise, rules, etc. Its a big chunk you are saving. Nothing is free afterall. You have to sacrifice some things in life to gain other stuff.
The older posts you wrote on this thread make you look very, very arrogant, I have to admit. You really are in NO place to judge people. Seriously. Would YOU live with your parents who steal from you, put bills, credit cards, loans, etc into your name, smoke, are drug addicts (and one is a prostitute), and so on?
I sincerely would hope not. But if so, good for you. Now that I'm an adult, there's no way in HELL I'm going back to that EVER again. Deal with it. If either party doesn't want to live with their folks, it's not up to you to tell them that they should just get over their issues, suck it up, and deal with a buncha bull* just to "save" on a mortgage payment.
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Seriously. Would YOU live with your parents who steal from you, put bills, credit cards, loans, etc into your name, smoke, are drug addicts (and one is a prostitute), and so on?
