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Old 11-13-2018, 05:07 PM
 
Location: Somewhere extremely awesome
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Indentured Servant View Post
Of particular note to me was the size of the Detroit Mega region. I think the Detroit region is undermined by current MSA methodology/percentages as it relates to how Detroit hollowed out from the center of its mass....which impacted commutes to the core. It's really a heavily populated area/region, but if you just look at MSA numbers its not even a top 10 metro area, yet, there are about 10 million people in a 100 mile radius of Detroit (including Canada). Not too many areas or "regions" can boast that.


My problem with the map is that regions don't just begin and end like that. There is much overlap and so the colors should blend together to show influences from different regions. For example, SW Michigan should be purple, as that area is heavily influenced by Chicago, as well as Detroit....but of course, politically its in the same state as Detroit.
It looks like the Detroit Combined Statistical Area (which would include Ann Arbor and Flint) would get about 5.3 million people. A large remainder of the population within 100 miles of Detroit is in the Cleveland area, which is less than 100 miles as the crow flies, but in reality, there's a lake in the way. I'm guessing that you could get close to an additional million from fringe areas of the radius in Michigan (Lansing, Jackson, Saginaw maybe?) and close to an additional million from Toledo and nearby areas such as Bowling Green and Sandusky.
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Old 11-14-2018, 06:21 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharks With Lasers View Post
It looks like the Detroit Combined Statistical Area (which would include Ann Arbor and Flint) would get about 5.3 million people. A large remainder of the population within 100 miles of Detroit is in the Cleveland area, which is less than 100 miles as the crow flies, but in reality, there's a lake in the way. I'm guessing that you could get close to an additional million from fringe areas of the radius in Michigan (Lansing, Jackson, Saginaw maybe?) and close to an additional million from Toledo and nearby areas such as Bowling Green and Sandusky.

Well....there is Canada that you are leaving out. Windsor and Detroit are siblings. Even if you move the center of radius to Lansing, you still get nearly 10 million people.
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Old 11-14-2018, 02:56 PM
 
Location: Somewhere extremely awesome
3,024 posts, read 2,461,585 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Indentured Servant View Post
Well....there is Canada that you are leaving out. Windsor and Detroit are siblings. Even if you move the center of radius to Lansing, you still get nearly 10 million people.
I'm wondering if you could get to London within 100 miles of Detroit? If so, that could add in another 500,000 people in its surrounding areas, in addition to Windsor and Sarnia (which I think is another half million people?)

Centered in Lansing, you're basically trading Grand Rapids and Kalamazoo/Battle Creek for northern Ohio and a bunch more of Canada, right?
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Old 11-15-2018, 06:18 AM
 
Location: Windsor Ontario/Colchester Ontario
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharks With Lasers View Post
I'm wondering if you could get to London within 100 miles of Detroit? If so, that could add in another 500,000 people in its surrounding areas, in addition to Windsor and Sarnia (which I think is another half million people?)

Centered in Lansing, you're basically trading Grand Rapids and Kalamazoo/Battle Creek for northern Ohio and a bunch more of Canada, right?
Windsor/Essex County, Chatham-Kent and Sarnia/Lambton would add another 600,000 plus
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Old 11-15-2018, 07:08 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharks With Lasers View Post
I'm wondering if you could get to London within 100 miles of Detroit? If so, that could add in another 500,000 people in its surrounding areas, in addition to Windsor and Sarnia (which I think is another half million people?)

Centered in Lansing, you're basically trading Grand Rapids and Kalamazoo/Battle Creek for northern Ohio and a bunch more of Canada, right?

London is a little more than 100 miles away. That is an impressive little skyline for a city that size, meaning London, by the way. Other places get way more fan fare as being larger areas....but the region encompassing Detroit is heavily populated. Its one of the most heavily populated areas of the country in a 100 to 150 mile radius. There are lots of large and midsize metros in that swath.
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Old 11-15-2018, 09:11 AM
 
Location: Somerville, MA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Indentured Servant View Post
I think you are kind of trying to force this into being something that its not. I don't think they are saying that Buffalo influence extends to all those places more than other cities in the grouping does. I think that Buffalo just happens to be the largest metro or city in that defined mega region.

What the OP mega region map does is simply make the regions smaller and by commuter patterns. Take the "Great Lakes" Mega-region from the map above. They could have, instead of calling it the "Great Lakes Mega Region" instead called it the "Chicago" Mega-Region simply because that is the largest city in the defined area. That is all the OP mega region map does. Again, the authors, on a different site than the one linked to in the OP, give them different names not necessarily associated with a city.
Do you mean Albany? I wasn't commenting on Buffalo.

Anyway, I get what you're saying and my points stand. There's almost zero connectivity between Albany and Northern VT in a practical sense. So tying it into Albany (or whatever you want to call the area) doesn't work. It's not a "mega region," it's a completely distinct area. Whatever data they're using to determine commuting patterns in this area doesn't align with what they're trying to do in terms of identifying regions at all. If it's not it's own region, then it should be tied to Boston. But definitely not Albany.

My point re: Hartford sort of contradicts what you're saying - my issue is that it isn't aligned with the largest city in that region (New York). Almost all of Fairfield County, and the more populous half of New Haven County is an extension of the New York City area on every level. Commuting patterns? It's suburban New York. People go to New York. Identifying that region as having anything to do with Hartford (aside from government functions) over NYC is just wrong.
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Old 11-17-2018, 08:15 AM
 
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If we are basing it on commuting patterns, Detroit would be its own thing - separate from the rest of Michigan.

Being on the western edge of the metro Detroit area, usually the border for commuting into here is Lansing/Jackson. I also know people who live here that drive to Downtown Detroit every day. In other areas of the region, it isn't weird to see people commute in from OH or Windsor. It's about an hour from Lansing/Jackson to the Western Suburbs.

When I worked in Lansing, I met plenty of people who split the difference and live here so one spouse can work in Lansing and the other can work in the Metro area. (That's why Brighton is a popular place to live!) However, that isn't something that routinely happens in other areas of the state.

Usually, if you work in the Grand Rapids/Holland/Muskegon, you live in the area. Same with the other cities. It isn't weird for people drive in from Van Buren County or Calhoun County to work in the Kalamazoo area. (But nobody from those regions of the state would willingly drive out to Detroit every day- for a long period of time!) Rather, they'd set up an apartment for the week and go home on the weekend. (I knew of a professor who did that from Kalamazoo to Ypsilanti). So, I consider that more of an alternative living arrangement than commuting.

From downtown Detroit to Ann Arbor and the Western suburbs, it's about 50-60 minutes. People seem to think that it's easy to get around this area, but the area encompassing Genesse, Oakland, Macomb, Wayne, and Monroe counties is really quite large and dense. Just because a map tells you that something is 20 miles away doesn't mean that it's actually a direct shot or easy drive to get there. Driving from St. Clair Shores to Auburn Hills easily takes 45 minutes on a good day. The same amount of time as driving from Rochester Hills to Canton. That's not even leaving the Metro area. Even though I live 15 miles away from Ann Arbor, it takes me closer to 20-25 minutes to get there in real life.

So, yeah, another vote for altering the Detroit section of the map.
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Old 11-19-2018, 06:45 AM
 
9,948 posts, read 6,881,760 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopygirlmi View Post
If we are basing it on commuting patterns, Detroit would be its own thing - separate from the rest of Michigan.

Being on the western edge of the metro Detroit area, usually the border for commuting into here is Lansing/Jackson. I also know people who live here that drive to Downtown Detroit every day. In other areas of the region, it isn't weird to see people commute in from OH or Windsor. It's about an hour from Lansing/Jackson to the Western Suburbs.

When I worked in Lansing, I met plenty of people who split the difference and live here so one spouse can work in Lansing and the other can work in the Metro area. (That's why Brighton is a popular place to live!) However, that isn't something that routinely happens in other areas of the state.

Usually, if you work in the Grand Rapids/Holland/Muskegon, you live in the area. Same with the other cities. It isn't weird for people drive in from Van Buren County or Calhoun County to work in the Kalamazoo area. (But nobody from those regions of the state would willingly drive out to Detroit every day- for a long period of time!) Rather, they'd set up an apartment for the week and go home on the weekend. (I knew of a professor who did that from Kalamazoo to Ypsilanti). So, I consider that more of an alternative living arrangement than commuting.

From downtown Detroit to Ann Arbor and the Western suburbs, it's about 50-60 minutes. People seem to think that it's easy to get around this area, but the area encompassing Genesse, Oakland, Macomb, Wayne, and Monroe counties is really quite large and dense. Just because a map tells you that something is 20 miles away doesn't mean that it's actually a direct shot or easy drive to get there. Driving from St. Clair Shores to Auburn Hills easily takes 45 minutes on a good day. The same amount of time as driving from Rochester Hills to Canton. That's not even leaving the Metro area. Even though I live 15 miles away from Ann Arbor, it takes me closer to 20-25 minutes to get there in real life.

So, yeah, another vote for altering the Detroit section of the map.

Again, I don't think that is the purpose of the groupings. People keep trying to look at this in terms of Metropolitan Statistical areas where ONE city is the primary influence of commuters. Maybe I am wrong, but I think the authors are saying a region is a contiguous connections of commuters. Ergo, people in Grand Rapids don't commute to Detroit, but people in Grand Rapids do commute to Lansing (and visa versa) and people in Lansing commute to the Detroit area. Hence, its an unbroken region of cities connected by commuters. It's not saying that Grand Rapids people are commuting to Detroit.
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Old 11-19-2018, 04:07 PM
 
Location: Mobile,Al(the city by the bay)
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They nailed the New Orleans mega region influence right on the head.
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Old 12-10-2018, 02:35 PM
 
Location: Richmond, VA
10 posts, read 5,710 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Indentured Servant View Post
Again, I don't think that is the purpose of the groupings. People keep trying to look at this in terms of Metropolitan Statistical areas where ONE city is the primary influence of commuters. Maybe I am wrong, but I think the authors are saying a region is a contiguous connections of commuters. Ergo, people in Grand Rapids don't commute to Detroit, but people in Grand Rapids do commute to Lansing (and visa versa) and people in Lansing commute to the Detroit area. Hence, its an unbroken region of cities connected by commuters. It's not saying that Grand Rapids people are commuting to Detroit.
Indentured Servant is right, this map is "Six degrees of Kevin Bacon" for exurban and between-city commuters. Just like the game, if you're 4 degrees removed from Kevin Bacon you're not actually friends with him; at some point these "regions" represent friend of a friend of a friend connections, not meaningful cultural/social/economic places. It looks pretty subjective to me why they chose to connect some cities when the connections get whispy. Hence that weird Iowa/Illinois state.

The 50 states in this article, which were derived from social media connections, make more sense to me. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...iendships.html

New Mega Region Map-facebook-connections-50-regions.jpg
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