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Is it just me or is the quality of construction tradesman going down the drain?
Just completed a small bath remodel (los angeles) and was unable to oversee the project.. I hired guys that I knew from other projects, told them I need quality and not speed, so charge me by the hour and do a good job.
Honestly, everything but the tile work was done half'a**d and thrown together. I have to call back every single tradesman and stand over them to re-install, re-align, level and/or secure about ten different issues. I have a fair amount of both remodel and ground up experience, and cant believe some of the visual and behind the trim mistakes these guys made.
There was a time when a contractor visually checked his work, then checked it with a level or a tape measure, stepped back and made sure it looked good, didn't damage anything else in the process and walked away proud of his work.
Contemporary stick built houses constructed of particle board, cheap drywall, low quality 2'X4's, masonite siding, and held together with glue and nail gun staples, are junk. The craftsmanship is no better than the materials.
You've got to go back to at least the 70's if not the 60's, to find decent construction.
Pick any profession you wish, 10% are fantastic craftsmen, and the remainder dwindle down in varying degree from there, until you reach the bottom. That goes for doctors. lawyers, house cleaners, etc...
You mention you told them you wanted quality, not speed. What you got was their version of quality. The second and third rate guys consider their work to be super, and nothing will change the guys who think like that, they aren't capable of quality.
I can assure you there are still good craftsmen out there, but finding them isn't always easy. I often kid my wife that I wish we could get Norm, Tommy and Richard from "This Old House" to come and do our work for us, but I don't think they make house calls from Boston to So Calif.
I can appreciate what you're talking about, I have had my contractor trials, so when you find a good one, don't let go..!
Great ones are out there, it just takes a little searching, and don't take their word that they do quality work, they may not understand the level you want. Get referrals and check out their work closely.
I have seen some bad work in well drilling. NEVER hire a driller with out talking to your local health department and filing a FOI form and looking in their file. Check ALL the counties around you.
Contemporary stick built houses constructed of particle board, cheap drywall, low quality 2'X4's, masonite siding, and held together with glue and nail gun staples, are junk. The craftsmanship is no better than the materials.
You've got to go back to at least the 70's if not the 60's, to find decent construction.
Sorry you feel that way. First off there is NO particle board in new home construction. None. There are some cabinet brands using particle board but that dont make it bad. No particle board is anywhere in the framing or homes structure. Do you mean OSB? OSB is proven to be stronger and out last any plywood no matter how many plys the plywood has.
Cheap drywall? Drywall product is unchanged for more then 50 years. Before that was plaster lathe. The only improvement in the drywall industry is green drywall for moist areas like in bathrooms. Oh and today you can buy 5/8th for garages which happens to be code now.
Low quality 2 X 4? Well a little bit but that dont make for a bad house. The preferred material is Dougles Fir but Southern Yellow Pine is sometimes used. It is a tad softer and about 8 cents per board foot less then Doug Fir. Hardly cheaper.
If a builder uses glue in addition to nails or staples then you have a better house. Far better. Many states it is code to use glue (liquid nails) on the sub floors. That is a great thing !! Whats wrong with staples? They have 35% stronger holding ability in plywood. On framing only nails are used. And if you watch the guys who use those neumatic nailers they shoot more then needed. It takes nothing but a squeeze of the finger as opposed to hamering each nail by hand. Besides if you built a home without a nailer it would take 2 extra months to build it.
As far as craftsmanship? Yes I agree with you all the way. With the flood of unskilled workers migrating northword, builders have learned that they can fire one carpenter who they paid $24/hr and hire 3 south of the borders for $8/hr. It cost the builder the same but they get 3 or more times the work output. And may the customer home buyer be damned.
I have seen particle board used for sub flooring in homes built in the 70's. It is crap. OSB is good stuff.
As a home inspector, I see houses that are days old to almost two centuries old. Older homes were not always all that great either. Foundations have come a long way.
Building technology has made great progress in the last 30 years. Consider it wasn't that long ago they didn't even consider insulating the attics. Knob and tube wiring wasn't so great either.
HVAC systems? Even the units made 20 years ago are not even close to the ones made today.
Plumbing? Haven't seen anyone rushing out to use galvanized plumbing.
There have always been crappy tradesmen. There have always been craftsmen.
I think a huge difference happened when construction went from a union based industry with apprentice programs, to piece work. That's when the speed increased, costs went down for builders, and quality started to slide.
The incentive was to do whatever you were doing faster to make more money. This brought about cutting some corners, and the quality suffered.
However, like anything else, there will always be someone that can work fast, and still produce a high quality product. However, there are some people that can take all the time in the world, and still turn out crap. Doesn't matter if is was 1950, 1970, 1990, or 2008.
As far as craftsmanship? Yes I agree with you all the way. With the flood of unskilled workers migrating northword, builders have learned that they can fire one carpenter who they paid $24/hr and hire 3 south of the borders for $8/hr. It cost the builder the same but they get 3 or more times the work output. And may the customer home buyer be damned.
$8 / hr, lord they are being over paid. I've heard in some parts of Ohio the going wage is down to $3 / hr for the hold the other end guys.
So sure craftsmanship has suffered badly but so has the going wage. Just a few years back the wage for a skilled carpenter was ~$18, then it dropped to $14, then down from there. And you wonder why there are workmanship problems. Going wage is probably minimim wage if that in most places today.
That one fact drove most really good construction type workers into some other line of work. Hey, they get what they pay for. The other factor was the lack of a living wage, the greed and stuffed suit boys, totally changed the image of what those jobs were. You started to get a lot of undesirables, who may either have prison records, substance abuse problems and on and on. They ain't what they used to be but don't go blaming the workers. Them good olde talking heads boys who knew all about "Cost Efficiency and Management by Objective" and all of the rest of that crap started it all. I sure hope them new workers get a chance to be in their houses soon.
Actually don't be too down on "Illegals or any such implied views". Some of them are very good, shame is they are pawns in a game, the workers on both sides have zero control. The better skilled native workers got displaced by a system that values only the greed of the upper class. Many of them actually view any blue collar worker as almost subhuman.
So did craftsmanship suffer in the process. You bettcha but none of it was the workers fault. The same applies to so many other industries and occupations. Blame Globalization, blame all this fine business theory spouted so often about how the market is so good at setting prices and getting cost efficiencies. Blame just plain stupid approaches to driving folks into a new class based society, anybody working with their hands is at the bottom of the barrel. What did you expect in a system like that????
I have seen particle board used for sub flooring in homes built in the 70's. It is crap. OSB is good stuff.
As a home inspector, I see houses that are days old to almost two centuries old. Older homes were not always all that great either. Foundations have come a long way.
Building technology has made great progress in the last 30 years. Consider it wasn't that long ago they didn't even consider insulating the attics. Knob and tube wiring wasn't so great either.
HVAC systems? Even the units made 20 years ago are not even close to the ones made today.
Plumbing? Haven't seen anyone rushing out to use galvanized plumbing.
There have always been crappy tradesmen. There have always been craftsmen.
I think a huge difference happened when construction went from a union based industry with apprentice programs, to piece work. That's when the speed increased, costs went down for builders, and quality started to slide.
The incentive was to do whatever you were doing faster to make more money. This brought about cutting some corners, and the quality suffered.
However, like anything else, there will always be someone that can work fast, and still produce a high quality product. However, there are some people that can take all the time in the world, and still turn out crap. Doesn't matter if is was 1950, 1970, 1990, or 2008.
Agreed. Bums have always been with us, and have built junk. Always.
Junk is timeless, but tends to disappear faster than good stuff.
One major impact has been the near absolute worship of maximizing square footage, i.e., "more house for the money," bang for the buck from consumers.
Unfortunately, a great many people will just not pay a premium for premium materials or craftsmanship.
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Fine work on the cheap.......
