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I'm trying to think if any other neighborhood in Houston overcame/gentrified successfully after a stigma as bad as Sharpstown/Fondren SW.... Only from posts in here I assume there are some safe haven little pockets in there, but know one really knows about them.And for the most part would dismiss them just because the area surrounding them is the roughest in Houston.
I'm not saying it won't happen, I just can't think of a neighborhood that came back from such a dangerous, not just run down and sketchy, reputation. Modster would know if anyone.
The heights, eastwood, and neighbor Westbury are all thriving.
Sharpstown is no where near the roughest part of town, drive in the 5th ward and you'll see what I mean.
Sharpstown is no where near the roughest part of town, drive in the 5th ward and you'll see what I mean.
Statistically, the crime rate is one of the highest of the metro, and the public schools are terrible. There's no spinning that. The area was ruined by too many apartments and cheap housing.
What type of positive changes are happening here, since I remember one poster saying that Houston's mayor is demolishing a lot of blight areas throughtout the city?
Statistically, the crime rate is one of the highest of the metro, and the public schools are terrible. There's no spinning that. The area was ruined by too many apartments and cheap housing.
The public school argument is an old wives tails. Schools like Sutton and Bonham are exemplary while Sharpstown High ranked 556 on the best schools list in the country beating all suburban schools in Houston. Sharpstown is still rated unacceptable and hasn't made AYP solely because of the drop out rating, not the quality of the academics. The school offers tons of AP classes with an exceptional magnet program.
The cheap apartments is a valid argument but some have been going down. There used to be a huge complex off of Bellaire and Corporate but was replaced by a new asian strip mall.
Oh and statistically, Gulfton has the highest crime rate not Sharpstown, but thats only because its the most populated area in all of Houston. Don't talk about what you don't know.
I'm trying to think if any other neighborhood in Houston overcame/gentrified successfully after a stigma as bad as Sharpstown/Fondren SW.... Only from posts in here I assume there are some safe haven little pockets in there, but know one really knows about them.And for the most part would dismiss them just because the area surrounding them is the roughest in Houston.
I'm not saying it won't happen, I just can't think of a neighborhood that came back from such a dangerous, not just run down and sketchy, reputation. Modster would know if anyone.
You know, I do think that is one of the bigger issues facing Sharpstown, is the whole image/reputation problem. Places near there like Robindell, which don't have that baggage and also have a better approach via Braeswood, will pop up a lot quicker IMO.
Have other areas with high crime turned around? Certainly, but it is still apples to oranges. Montrose was a high crime area. (anyone else remember KLOL airing from "the crime free Montrose?) At one point it was just a declining area with no cool bohemian factor to it. Just a plain old-fashioned sliding down area. Certainly areas like Heights, Washington Avenue, what is now midtown, those have all been bad areas. Garden Oaks and even Bellaire have seen episodes of decline, but Sharpstown does have more of an image problem than most others did, whether it deserves it or not.
The other different dynamic is who is going to constitute the pool of "(sub?)urban pioneers" that will go in and turn an area like that around? In the olden days it was easy to figure out who would go in and take over an old, run down urban neighborhood like Heights or Montrose was at one time and start it gentrifying. The artists, the gays, the other assorted urban pioneers who didn't want the suburbs. In older areas like Eastwood or Lindale Park it is easy to see this similar trend repeating itself as that demographic gets priced out of Montrose, Heights, etc. You are still inside the loop, the houses are old & have "character," however you define that, and you are close to museums, nightlife, etc., albeit less close than the more primo locations.
So now that the original gentrifying areas are pretty much cost-prohibitive for young buyers looking under $250,000, will they venture very far outside the loop? Will they embrace the ranch home subdivisions encircled by crappy high-crime apartment complexes? Or dig their heels into the inner loop and settle for condos in lieu of single family houses?
IMO any real significant change in Sharpstown will only happen in one of two instances. One, if the apartments get so run-down the city actually does step in and demolish a slew of them, which is unlikely. Secondly, more likely, when people who do not want to live in the typical suburban/furhter out set up start running out of options. They will accept the nearby apartments as part of the terrain in an unzoned city, or at least the terrain close in that they can afford. Right now, however, there are too many other options for Sharpstown to have its turn at bat in the gentrification game at this time.
I've said it before & I'll say it again, Westbury is the main one stealing that thunder right now. Go on HAR and run the appreciation chart on Westbury vs. Sharpstown and you will see what I mean. The young urban buyers priced out of Heights, Timbergrove & Garden Oaks are now turning mostly to Westbury and Oak Forest out of necessity. Whenever the market comes back I expect we will see both those areas take off again. They need to get a little "too expensive" and then we will see an increasing number of buyers shifting around to the next hot spot. Will it be Sharpstown? It could be for those that want to live "in town" but work somewhere on the west side (Galleria, energy corridor, whatever). For those working downtown I think Sharpstown will lose out to the east end options as the urban buyers will opt to stay inside the loop in places like Eastwood and Lindale Park. For mid-century modern or atomic-ranch style buyers, Sharpstown will have to compete with its neighbors like Robindell as well as Glenbrook Valley, which I expect will gain a higher profile with that niche audience if the friggin historic designation process will ever come to a fruition (another thread unto itself), plus it too is a lot closer to downtown but will probablay lose out to Sharpstown or Robindell with mod buyers working on the westside.
In the mean time I think there will be some positive things happening there, but as far as big time changes, someday, but IMO not just yet.
You know, I do think that is one of the bigger issues facing Sharpstown, is the whole image/reputation problem. Places near there like Robindell, which don't have that baggage and also have a better approach via Braeswood, will pop up a lot quicker IMO.
Have other areas with high crime turned around? Certainly, but it is still apples to oranges. Montrose was a high crime area. (anyone else remember KLOL airing from "the crime free Montrose?) At one point it was just a declining area with no cool bohemian factor to it. Just a plain old-fashioned sliding down area. Certainly areas like Heights, Washington Avenue, what is now midtown, those have all been bad areas. Garden Oaks and even Bellaire have seen episodes of decline, but Sharpstown does have more of an image problem than most others did, whether it deserves it or not.
The other different dynamic is who is going to constitute the pool of "(sub?)urban pioneers" that will go in and turn an area like that around? In the olden days it was easy to figure out who would go in and take over an old, run down urban neighborhood like Heights or Montrose was at one time and start it gentrifying. The artists, the gays, the other assorted urban pioneers who didn't want the suburbs. In older areas like Eastwood or Lindale Park it is easy to see this similar trend repeating itself as that demographic gets priced out of Montrose, Heights, etc. You are still inside the loop, the houses are old & have "character," however you define that, and you are close to museums, nightlife, etc., albeit less close than the more primo locations.
So now that the original gentrifying areas are pretty much cost-prohibitive for young buyers looking under $250,000, will they venture very far outside the loop? Will they embrace the ranch home subdivisions encircled by crappy high-crime apartment complexes? Or dig their heels into the inner loop and settle for condos in lieu of single family houses?
IMO any real significant change in Sharpstown will only happen in one of two instances. One, if the apartments get so run-down the city actually does step in and demolish a slew of them, which is unlikely. Secondly, more likely, when people who do not want to live in the typical suburban/furhter out set up start running out of options. They will accept the nearby apartments as part of the terrain in an unzoned city, or at least the terrain close in that they can afford. Right now, however, there are too many other options for Sharpstown to have its turn at bat in the gentrification game at this time.
I've said it before & I'll say it again, Westbury is the main one stealing that thunder right now. Go on HAR and run the appreciation chart on Westbury vs. Sharpstown and you will see what I mean. The young urban buyers priced out of Heights, Timbergrove & Garden Oaks are now turning mostly to Westbury and Oak Forest out of necessity. Whenever the market comes back I expect we will see both those areas take off again. They need to get a little "too expensive" and then we will see an increasing number of buyers shifting around to the next hot spot. Will it be Sharpstown? It could be for those that want to live "in town" but work somewhere on the west side (Galleria, energy corridor, whatever). For those working downtown I think Sharpstown will lose out to the east end options as the urban buyers will opt to stay inside the loop in places like Eastwood and Lindale Park. For mid-century modern or atomic-ranch style buyers, Sharpstown will have to compete with its neighbors like Robindell as well as Glenbrook Valley, which I expect will gain a higher profile with that niche audience if the friggin historic designation process will ever come to a fruition (another thread unto itself), plus it too is a lot closer to downtown but will probablay lose out to Sharpstown or Robindell with mod buyers working on the westside.
In the mean time I think there will be some positive things happening there, but as far as big time changes, someday, but IMO not just yet.
I completely agree. Those damn apartments are ruining the area and I wish the city would fix it. To be honest, I have no idea why Westbury is appreciating better than Sharpstown. They're both basically the same except Sharpstown has a superior location due to freeway access.
I could really see the neighborhood taking off in 10 years or so if the University Line does happen and is finished by then. The hillcroft transit center is adjacent to the neighborhood and would be a huge selling point.
It's also crazy to think what the university line would do to Gulfton as well. All the people there will have to move somewhere else -- the suburbs.
I think any rail line will be a bigger boost to areas of individually owned houses, duplexes, etc than areas of big giant complexes. It is harder to change areas of big apartment complexes and the rail didn't reinvent the ones down by the astrodome.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, the city needs to make being a slumlord an unprofitable venture. I am not sure the best way to do that but stepping up enforcement of building codes and setting up a fine structure for properties with too many calls for service from HPD would be a good start.
The working poor have to live somewhere, and there are plenty that just want a quiet place to live. Unfortunately when times get tough, and sometimes even when they are good, the big management companies push for occupancy and loosen criteria and let in anything that can fog a mirror. The law-abiding moderate income residents lose out since they are now living in a crime ridden complex, the single family homeowners nearby lose, since the gluts of gang, drug, name-your-poison complexes drag down areas for miles surrounding the complexes, creating entire swaths of underperforming at best, to deteriorating at worst, tax bases that ring much of the city. Everybody loses because the loss of tax base has to be made up somewhere else.
The land price (not including the house sitting ontop of the land) at Westbury as per HCAD is about $10-15/sqft. On the outer edge of Westbury, it is about $6/sqft (like Hillcroft & HW90). Sharpstown west of HW59 (zip code 77036) area, land is appraised at $6/sqft as well by HCAD. One thing I found interesting is that Westbury, where the land price is the highest, are areas with immediate access to 610 loop. Not all Westbury offers you easy access to 610 or HW59. The same is true for Glenbrook valley. The areas with the highest home sale asking price are the ones close to 610 loop and with immediate access to HW45. So the moral of the story is that the closer you are to 610 inner loop, the more immediate access you have to a major high way such as 45 or 59, the higher the land value, which ultimately drives home prices. Of course the specific neighborhood makes a difference too. As to rail line, this can NOT be developed economically or politically in a place like Houston without gas price being persistently high, say $10/gallon the minimum for an extended period of time (say a year or 2). Then once it is built, those real estate (private homes or commercial) with easy access to that will see their prices go up dramatically as well. Crime and stigma are facts of life and perceptions are hard to change. But the law of economics is immutable. There is nothing romantic about spending one and half hour or 2 hours a day in traffic and gas price at $10-15/gallon... we will get there.... Sharpstown's biggest assets, in my eyes, are HW59, and the bellaire Blvd, with access to beltway 8.
Sharpstown is still rated unacceptable and hasn't made AYP solely because of the drop out rating
Drop-out rates DO matter to parents who care about education. It reflects very poorly on the school, the student body and on the entire area around it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by robertrulez
Oh and statistically, Gulfton has the highest crime rate not Sharpstown, but thats only because its the most populated area in all of Houston. Don't talk about what you don't know.
Sharpstown crime is still high around all of the crummy apartments.... and there are no shortage of those.
As far as speaking about what I supposedly don't know, why don't you take your own advice with the incessant bashing of suburbs. Then, maybe people will actually take you seriously.
Last edited by sxrckr; 12-02-2010 at 06:06 PM..
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