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As I have said many times, some of us stay on Long Island due to proximity to family. For some of us, proximity to family is something that you cannot put a price on.
Until your family leaves Long Island as has happened to me, and several others that I know.
It's one thing if it's your second cousin, once removed, but it's another if it's your parents.
When the "anchor" relatives (the ones who host all of the holiday parties, summer BBQs, etc.) leave it makes people think themselves of why they pay such a high price for poor infrastructure, political corruption and the stress of having both parents working because that's the only way to pay the cost of living.
If you research the average salary for a job in Nassau or Suffolk with other suburban counties near large metro areas, you'll find more than a few have average salaries around the same or more than LI, with considerably less expenses. And they are not filled with people from expensive areas cashing out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeyKid
We also see the common misconception in this thread that salaries are much bigger on LI than other suburban metros. This is also flat false. Many suburbs offer the same or more money for the same job on LI. Working in the city and commuting out to Suffolk county has a price and it's not just the monthly LIRR ticket... it ages you prematurely.
I don't think anyone believes it's the LI salaries that are high. Did someone say that?
It's NYC and how it's within an hour for half of LI. It's no secret that's why LI'ers are staying.
Everyone is just strengthening the argument that many people DO want to be on Long Island, regardless of how crazy expensive and crowded it is.
A primary reason (or perhaps THE primary reason) that I, in particular, would want to be situated on Long Island (or in the greater NYC metro area at-large otherwise) is because of NOSTALGIA. That is, I was born and raised there and spent part of my educational and career life there, and, although having lived around the U.S. otherwise over the decades, I feel a primordial tie to and affinity for the greater Downstate New York CMSA (and then particularly Long Island, ideally). For all my family is dead and gone now (I'm a senior in my 60s now) and remaining members of the greater family tree are rather scattered around the U.S. or the globe. Besides whatever all the benefits and virtues are of being in the greater Downstate New York CMSA that matter to me at all, I can have much if not nearly all of those benefits and virtues elsewhere and at lower cost . . . BUT living in the greater Downstate New York CMSA (ideally Long Island, and otherwise select parts of Queens or Brooklyn or else I'd consider other select areas), I can take trips down memory lane whenever I want and reminisce upon all the many memories I have here in this vast region (and a region which is covered throughout by 24/7/365 mass transit for the most part, though I would have an automobile of whatever type as well at my avail). That is something that no other place can offer me. However long I have lived in ALL other places, I always feel like a transplant. With the greater Downstate New York CMSA, I am not an eternal transplant with no foundational links or historical ties to anything but rather truly feel like I belong to it & it belongs to me because of my history with it. Even if I didn't have a single friend there, I at least have all my memories and hence my feeling of belongingness (unless I develop dementia or Alzheimers down the line, wherein my memories won't or may not remain intact anyway for it to matter where I am situated).
I don't know how many others on C-D or not on C-D but in the general population have what I stated here as a primary reason (if not THE primary reason) for desiring to stay wherever in the greater Downstate New York CMSA (and then particularly Long Island).
OP falls into the typical misconception trap about LI. the insinuation that all of LI, no matter where you live, is equal. Which we all know is flat false. LI runs the gambit from highly affluent to what most of us would consider plain unsafe - and in between.
The majority of complaints about LI are neither that "it's too expensive" or "too crowded". The closest I typically come to complaining along those lines is how ridiculous the tolls are to get onto the island and the small amount of options to get off, all of which are infuriating as you stare at an endless sea of brake lights. It's frankly painful being funneled like cattle through bottlenecks.
The main complaint is the value that LI provides today, especially when you compare it to the past... and beyond that, the proposition for future value is even worse. The issue is what you get for what you pay. Is there demand? Of course. There is demand in every metro because of where you work, so that's kind of a silly point. I would tend to agree with what was said about staying on LI to be close to family/friends. That trumps the value proposition for many and is not specific to LI at all. These people would stay to be close to family/friends no matter where it was... they are not staying on LI for LI specifically.
We also see the common misconception in this thread that salaries are much bigger on LI than other suburban metros. This is also flat false. Many suburbs offer the same or more money for the same job on LI. Working in the city and commuting out to Suffolk county has a price and it's not just the monthly LIRR ticket... it ages you prematurely.
What I find most amusing... even the OP throws in the "barring corrupt govt nonsense" caveat with regard to their opinion of being expensive. They know how ridiculous the tax structure, unions, and spending is... yet they think it's OK. Hilarious. It's not OK and that corrupt nonsense is a huge contributing factor to the terrible value of LI today and is only hurting future value.
Exactly!
I get the feeling that a large number of posters on this forum live in northwestern Nassau County, have jobs in the city that are high paying but expect long hours, high stress, and frequent travel. Most of them seem to live in "keeping up with the Joneses" type neighborhoods, and believe that their children need to be enrolled in a large number of organized activities.
The truth is, while that is certainly an integral part of Long Island, that is not all of Long Island. For example, I don't think most of the people living in areas like Centereach are commuting to the city for high paying, long hour, high stress, frequent travel jobs. I don't think those areas are so much into keeping up with the Joneses or overscheduling their children.
People on this forum keep telling me that I won't be able to afford to stay on Long Island. Yet my colleagues with similar salaries and multiple children seem to be able to do it ok. I'm sure some posters on this forum might find their lifestyle to be unacceptable. But I would find the lifestyle of most posters on this forum to be unacceptable.
I don't think anyone believes it's the LI salaries that are high. Did someone say that?
It's NYC and how it's within an hour for half of LI. It's no secret that's why LI'ers are staying.
Value... that's a given in any expensive area.
NYC salaries aren't as high as they used to be! Check out the stats, but I'll give you the skinny on the situation. Wall St. has shrunken and continues to shrink at a brutal rate. Don't believe it, take a ride through peak summer season Westhamption Beach. Montauk Highway is dotted with empty storefronts and defunct businesses. Not the summering haven it once was for up-and-coming yuppies. Two areas on Wall street are hiring and they're areas the banks don't want you to know about: High Frequency and Algo trading. The conventional trading businesses are shrinking, with surgical lay-offs on every trading floor in every bank. JP Morgan Chase doesn't even deal with headhunters any more. Bottom-line, Wall St. bonus' kept the suburbs flush with mad money for years. Not so any more.
Tech business? Did anyone say startups? Yes, NYC is awash in venture capital $ and these nascent businesses pay pretty well, but guess what? They don't pay $15-20k/yr property tax well. No, if you want the real cash, try San Fran, where some skills are fetching $250k-300k.
Bottom-line here is, if you're white-collar, maybe you've got a legacy job. If so, good for you. But lots of high priced 40-55 year olds are being terminated in favor of youngsters and h1bs in almost all disciplines. The old idea of taking the LIRR but reaping the financial benefits just doesn't hold water today. The huge economic engine of NYC that LI used to build all things overpriced is running out of fuel and will soon leave LI high and dry.
I lived in Great Neck in my latter childhood years, and could not wait to escape LI once I graduated HS. Came back to NYC/Brooklyn to work after I finished all my schooling/training. I thought I would live in NYC for the rest of my life. Had my fun in Brooklyn for many years, but once you get married and have more than 1 kid, LI makes a lot of sense. You can complain all you want about how expensive LI is, but you get way more bang for you buck than living in NYC with multiple kids.
The NYC suburbs as a whole are a ripoff. Let's compare what $400k gets you suburbs of various metro areas. Yeah, the pay in MANHATTAN is higher than average but the pay on Long Island SUCKS; if you want a decent income, you would have to fight for it and do a long, painful and expensive Parking+LIRR+subway commute TWICE a day; and then even after that, you get raped by property taxes. The topic is like beating a dead horse but let's just use a bit of common-sense..
I don't think government corruption is "ok" nor do I live in one of "keeping up with the Joneses type neighborhoods". But I do like Long Island, and I'm not leaving. I do live in Nassau, and we do it on one income precisely because we don't "keep up with the Jonses".
My argument really has nothing to do with the cost of living, the corruption or even the quality of life. My argument is very simple - places that people ACTUALLY don't want to live (like Detroit) are neither crowded nor expensive. The fact that Long Island IS crowded and expensive makes it clear that MANY people WANT to be here, regardless of any of the stuff CD forum members complain about. No one thinks LI is an easy place to live, but most of us WANT to be here regardless. CD is not a representative sample of LI residents, it's probably 10 old ladies with 45 screen names.
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