Mass drivers and rotaries...

[lrfox]

The two lane rotaries I drive frequently tend to have a much higher volume of traffic than any of the rotaries in Maine (I used to drive Augusta and Windham rotaries quite a bit) which I think is part of the reason for the difference. The high volume of traffic makes exiting the rotary from the left (inside) lane VERY difficult. Even though none of the rotaries in Maine have nearly the same volume of traffic as even the moderately busy ones in MA, I think MA driving habits die hard. When I'm in a busy rotary in MA, There's no chance I even attempt to exit from the left (inside) lane. It's an accident waiting to happen because it's almost impossible to find the space to change lanes and the guy on the right is probably not going to make letting you over very easy.

The other reason I would say we're different is because we have so many rotaries and each of them is different. There are some of the classic two-lane rotaries (like Augusta's), but there are some two lane rotaries with designated entry/ exit lanes. For example, the Bourne rotary at Route 6/ Main St/ Route 28 (here's a link for visual). People in the left (inside) lane cannot exit to Route 25 (to 495), Main Street or 6 East (toward Sagamore). The Route 24/ President Avenue rotary in Fall River has 2 lanes of travel but only has 2 exit lanes on 2/3 of the exits (President Ave is only one exit lane). Then there are an abundance of rotaries and roundabouts with only one lane.

I'm not coming to the defense of all MA driving. Not by a long shot. However, the fact that we have high volumes of traffic and no standardized rotary which is uniform all over the state is part of the reason you notice that behavior from MA drivers in Maine's rotaries. Augusta's rotary isn't busy in comparison to many in MA, but MA drivers will mostly drive as if it's the same as the ones at home. Augusta's rotary is also a pretty standard, easy to use layout. Many in MA are irregular (see the Bourne one I linked or the image below).

On a semi-related note, this rotary in Medford MA has to be the smallest I've ever driven:

[CoastalMaineiac]

Non-standard designs certainly would make it difficult. And I know in very heavy traffic, a lot of rules seem to get tossed by the wayside as you have to sort of bully your way around to get anywhere.

With regard to using the left lane: One thing Maine has that I don't think Massachusetts has is a yield to left law for rotaries. Yielding to the left applies all the way around the rotary here, not just as you enter. So the person in the right lane has to yield to cars exiting from the left lane.

Originally Posted by lrfox

The two lane rotaries I drive frequently tend to have a much higher volume of traffic than any of the rotaries in Maine (I used to drive Augusta and Windham rotaries quite a bit) which I think is part of the reason for the difference. The high volume of traffic makes exiting the rotary from the left (inside) lane VERY difficult. Even though none of the rotaries in Maine have nearly the same volume of traffic as even the moderately busy ones in MA, I think MA driving habits die hard. When I'm in a busy rotary in MA, There's no chance I even attempt to exit from the left (inside) lane. It's an accident waiting to happen because it's almost impossible to find the space to change lanes and the guy on the right is probably not going to make letting you over very easy.

The other reason I would say we're different is because we have so many rotaries and each of them is different. There are some of the classic two-lane rotaries (like Augusta's), but there are some two lane rotaries with designated entry/ exit lanes. For example, the Bourne rotary at Route 6/ Main St/ Route 28 (here's a link for visual). People in the left (inside) lane cannot exit to Route 25 (to 495), Main Street or 6 East (toward Sagamore). The Route 24/ President Avenue rotary in Fall River has 2 lanes of travel but only has 2 exit lanes on 2/3 of the exits (President Ave is only one exit lane). Then there are an abundance of rotaries and roundabouts with only one lane.

I'm not coming to the defense of all MA driving. Not by a long shot. However, the fact that we have high volumes of traffic and no standardized rotary which is uniform all over the state is part of the reason you notice that behavior from MA drivers in Maine's rotaries. Augusta's rotary isn't busy in comparison to many in MA, but MA drivers will mostly drive as if it's the same as the ones at home. Augusta's rotary is also a pretty standard, easy to use layout. Many in MA are irregular (see the Bourne one I linked or the image below).

On a semi-related note, this rotary in Medford MA has to be the smallest I've ever driven:

[Cato the Elder]

Originally Posted by lrfox

On a semi-related note, this rotary in Medford MA has to be the smallest I've ever driven:

It's not a public street, but I know of at least one ridiculous one lane rotary at a shopping center in Hudson:

https://maps.google.com/maps?q=lowes...&hq=lowes&z=20

[in_newengland]

Originally Posted by Morris Wanchuk

Nothing beats the E. Longmeadow Rotary



Thats 7 roads right there.

HAhahahahahahahha. I cut my teeth on the EL Rotary. I was even married in that church and my parents lived right up the street. The bad part of it was that there was so much traffic and if you were coming from Longmeadow and going straight through, the cars coming down the hill from the right would just sail through without stopping. I also seem to remember coming from the opposite direction where the road to the right went toward Spfld, you could never inch out enough to get across.

The rotary part of it was fine.

Now I deal with Gloucester which is a pain. All I know is that you stay to the right and the people who are already in the rotary have the right of way. They will be on your left.

[mr2448]

Originally Posted by CoastalMaineiac

Non-standard designs certainly would make it difficult. And I know in very heavy traffic, a lot of rules seem to get tossed by the wayside as you have to sort of bully your way around to get anywhere.

With regard to using the left lane: One thing Maine has that I don't think Massachusetts has is a yield to left law for rotaries. Yielding to the left applies all the way around the rotary here, not just as you enter. So the person in the right lane has to yield to cars exiting from the left lane.

that to me is just plain suicide. Noone from Southern New England would expect crosover traffic from the left. If I am on the right and continuing onto the next exit I am not stopping for you coming from the left. And it would be problematic if the car in front of me suddenly stopped to let a person on the left take a right across traffic. That type of law should be printed on the "Welcome to Maine" sign on I-95.

[CoastalMaineiac]

Originally Posted by mr2448

that to me is just plain suicide. Noone from Southern New England would expect crosover traffic from the left. If I am on the right and continuing onto the next exit I am not stopping for you coming from the left. And it would be problematic if the car in front of me suddenly stopped to let a person on the left take a right across traffic. That type of law should be printed on the "Welcome to Maine" sign on I-95.

The only thing it really translated to, in practice, was that you shouldn't enter the rotary beside someone who was already in it. If you yield to both lanes, and choose your lane correctly (and the guy beside you did likewise), no conflicts really develop.

I don't know if it's true or not, but I heard that the law came about shortly after some state representative got in a crash as he was exiting one of the rotaries.

It's kind of moot now, because they recently (well, a few years ago) redid the lane markings to make it more obvious that the left lane can exit and the right lane MUST exit (or yield).

Cony Circle, Augusta, ME

Memorial Circle, Augusta, ME


By the by, I think yield to the left at rotaries is the law in some Canadian provinces as well.

[lrfox]

Originally Posted by CoastalMaineiac

With regard to using the left lane: One thing Maine has that I don't think Massachusetts has is a yield to left law for rotaries. Yielding to the left applies all the way around the rotary here, not just as you enter. So the person in the right lane has to yield to cars exiting from the left lane.

Yeah, I think we've identified the difference. That would never work in MA. It may even be law here, but I've never heard it. The basic law in MA rotaries is that traffic in the circle (and circle is loosely defined in many cases) has the right of way.

In Maine, the rotary layouts are all pretty simple and standard. The two Augusta circles are about as straightforward as you'll ever see a rotary. The rotary in Windham is only one lane, but it's also straightforward. Even the fairly new rotaries (technically roundabouts) in Gorham are pretty straightforward. In addition, none of the rotaries in Maine have particularly high traffic. Augusta might by Maine standards, but still not a lot at all. For those reasons, it's pretty easy to set a rule like that and have it become the standard that's followed across the board.

In MA, it seems each one is drastically different from the next. The common trend is to yield to traffic in the circle, but that's followed loosely (if you find even a slight gap, you go!). Some rotaries have two lanes, some have one. Some have multi-lane exits, some have one, and some have both. Some have bypasses and some don't. Drivers, especially unfamiliar ones, are forced to expect the unexpected. And given the much higher traffic volumes in MA, no one would go to the left lane and expect the vehicle in the right lane to yield so they can get over. Not a chance.

I'd go so far as to say the lack of standard driving conditions in MA contributes to MA drivers' overall aggressiveness. But that's for a different thread.

[J.M.M]

Lol, well you have the right idea. However, us MA drivers are in a rush and will do whatever possible to get there quicker! Or, just as likely i might add, many people are just terrible drivers with no common sense. Can't speak to if people outside of MA are better with rotaries though. Only driven through them here in MA

[Electriclime]

Originally Posted by Morris Wanchuk

Nothing beats the E. Longmeadow Rotary .. Thats 7 roads right there.

I just saw that one on the map image while looking at real estate a few days ago. I guess all roads lead to East Longmeadow

They have just started adding rotaries, or roundabouts as we call them, in the Detroit Metro area. They are typically a third of the size and often only one lane and people still can't figure out how to use them!