Is it really that bad? (Miami, Havana: buying, school, quality of life)

[intelfan11315]

I love this city

[doggiebus]

Originally Posted by compelled to reply

Really though, do we need another "Latins are extremely rude, non diverse criminals and are responsible for taking my job, the destruction of America and all of the problems in my life and zero of them speak any English and now they ruined Broward with crime and filth and Palm Beach is next, we will all be in shantytowns because of the Latins, rude people, crime" thread? The OP didn't ask about Latins .

Just trying to say that the overall downturn (crime, rudeness, etc) of Miami is spreading north nothing to do with latinos. I never said that Latins were the issue, many however do see it the way you described. Its the people themselves that seem to be bad seeds.

[observer]

I was raised in Miami and have seen the quality of life diminish greatly in the metro area during the last 20-25 years. Even though I appreciate the difference among the different nationalities, I have to agree with "BIG MEAN BEAR" when he or she stated " that Miami would be better if it were an American friendly city".

Many folks that I have met when I have traveled out of town unfortunately have a negative view of the lack of courtesy and lack of friendliness in Miami. As far as 3rd world mentality, as much as I do not like to admit it, YES!!!! and getting worse every year. The sad part is that folks who have not traveled outside of South Florida or rarely travel outside of the area feel and think that the way people in general treat each other in Miami is the norm all across the nation. Yes we have the beaches, the clubs until 5:00 AM, gorgeous women at the beaches and in the malls. However, we also have a great deal of ignorance, self-centered mentality, impatient drivers, hostility everywhere, lack of civility in general, and poor customer service in general.

Anyone looking to move to Miami if being around friendly people, courteous drivers, civilized community, and being around well educated people in general is important? Do yourself a favor and look elsewhere, because Miami may not be for you.

[Miami Vice]

Originally Posted by observer

Yes we have the beaches, the clubs until 5:00 AM, gorgeous women at the beaches and in the malls. However, we also have a great deal of ignorance, self-centered mentality, impatient drivers, hostility everywhere, lack of civility in general, and poor customer service in general.

So the Latins are the only ones with those attibutes? Give me a break.

[observer]

Originally Posted by Miami Vice

So the Latins are the only ones with those attibutes? Give me a break.

No, not the only ones. Unfortunately Hispanics are the majority in Miami Dade and well, just look around at the attitude (especially among the hispanics); you can put blinders on all day and refuse to see it for what it is.

Let me add, my family is hispanic so I do speak spanish and do so at gas stations and stores when the attendants do not speak or speak very little english as opposed to giving them a hard time. Therefore, I am not against hispanics. Yet, I feel it is not right for some of the employees to assume that everyone that comes in to the store speaks spanish, yet will give a customer the "cold treatment" and sometimes hostile service when a customer doesn't speak spanish.

I call it as I see it.

[Miami Vice]

I have many stories about non-latins who treated my parents very bad when they arrived in this county without knowing the language. It works both ways.

I don't look latin. As a matter of fact, many latins try to speak English when they first see me. I have even pretended many times that I didn't speak spanish, to see this poor treatment that everyone talks about. I have found that when you smile at people, or atleast don't look at them as if their inferior, the result is almost always positive. If you look down on people, or give them the s**t face, you're going to be treated accordingly.

I also call it as I see it.

[FloridaandOhio]

I looked at some investment properties in Doral a few months back. That was the last time I was in the Miami area. Miami is a nice place to visit but I wouldn't want to call it home even if I lived in the neighborhoods the OP listed.

[Miami Vice]

To each it's own. While Miami is far from perfect, I wouldn't trade it for many other places. It is home for myself and many, and bashing it isn't always appreciated.

[planetsurf]

Originally Posted by observer

I have to agree with "BIG MEAN BEAR" when he or she stated " that Miami would be better if it were an American friendly city".

What exactly makes up an "American city". I'm serious, is it white? Courtious? As painted by Norman Rockwell? Less people speaking Spanish(or any language but English)? NYC is American. Boston is American. Chicago, Milwaukee, SanFran and LA. They are all VERY different places with different strengths and weaknesses.

Originally Posted by observer

As far as 3rd world mentality, as much as I do not like to admit it, YES!!!! and getting worse every year. The sad part is that folks who have not traveled outside of South Florida or rarely travel outside of the area feel and think that the way people in general treat each other in Miami is the norm all across the nation.

I like how everyone uses Third World; have you been to a real Third World country, like Sub-Saharan Africa or Bangladesh? THAT'S Third World.
I think the comparison is really of Second World, like Mexico or Peru, but that doesn't have the same ring to it, does it?
I understand your point, I just don't agree. We came back 2x a year for the last 6 years while we lived in San Diego. I can honestly say that things really haven't changed much AT ALL beyond the highrises in the Brickell to Biscayne corridor. Miami is Miami, most of it isn't all that attractive. Go to LA or Phoenix, SAME THING. Sprawling, urban/suburban cities all kind of look alike.

Some people treat us great, others worse. The average service at Publix or McDonalds is worse here, Nordstroms, contractors or high-end restaurants better here.
And I've NEVER been given a hard time b/c I'm a gringo. Just hasn't happened. Not saying it hasn't happened to others, but I have a pretty good attitude about it, maybe that helps?
Just what we've observed.

Originally Posted by observer

Anyone looking to move to Miami if being around friendly people, courteous drivers, civilized community, and being around well educated people in general is important? Do yourself a favor and look elsewhere, because Miami may not be for you.

I would ABSOLUTELY agree that if your criterion for a place to live is courteous drivers and "friendly people" (like saying "good morning" to strangers?) then Miami is not for you. Nor is NYC, Chicago, Boston or LA.
But a "civilized community," and being around well educated people?? Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but you should check out how packed a book signing is at Books & Books or a lecture at Art Basel. I've found that there is plenty of interesting, courteous and intelligent people in Miami.

[Natali26]

Originally Posted by planetsurf

I disagree -- Miami's stature will grow further BECAUSE it offers something else, something new that another city (like an Atlanta) just can't. (That is of course it's view looking South to LatAm and the gateway status it already has.)
Look at a Portland or Seattle, except for being the base of Microsoft, these cities really shouldn't be able to influence the rest of the country and YET they have influence BECAUSE they offer a fresh new perspective on American life.
Miami is the same way (but for very different reasons).

We had dinner at Vinisimo the other night (AMAZING tapas btw) and there were a few families there. All appearing solidly middle-class, educated, respectful. THESE are the kinds of kids that I believe will be the leaders of not just Miami and SoFla but our entire country. Kids that get other POVs, understand another language and eat "weird" food (a joke). And of course they ARE Americans just as much as some redneck in Georgia. WE are all Americans in Miami -- well most of us anyway. Look at Obama, without his "worldly" background I don't believe he's the same person. Irregardless if you respect his politics or not, you HAVE to respect his amazing achievements in life.

We have LOTS of problems in SoFla, there is a lot of shifting and rearranging going on and there is a lot of work to be done before it can be considered a "top 5" city by most everyone else in the US. But I don't think it's too far off and it is EXACTLY the kind of place that I believe will give my kids the kind of world view to be successful in life. It certainly has for my wife and I.

Miami is definately more like a Latin American city than an American city.

I personally enjoy the diversity - it teaches me alot about human nature from a new perspective. For example, as a successful, upscale Caucasian American, I typically encounter no racial discrimmination in most American cities. Miami is the exception. I have a condo in a very upscale building in the downtown Financial District - and I have run into some definite snobbish / chilly attitudes and discrimmination from my equally rich Latin neighbors. (i.e., Americans: Don't ever go barefoot in the elevator down to the pool!)

However, I can also appreciate the Latin strong family values, well-behaved children, and wonderful foods. Also, some of Latins bring major financial resources into Miami, which don't seem to be affected very much by the current American economy slowdown. So I tend to agree that Miami could become a major player in the future decades compared to places like Atlanta. (Personally, I am taking Spanish classes to ensure my power in business remains competitive . . . .)