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Back in the early 80's, we had the same summer schedule and we called it "spat camp" (I suspect they still do). There were several days that we started in the morning and didn't stop till dusk. It also started in mid July exclusively for field show development. We worked on a new show back then for every home game. Now-a-days they have the exact same artsy-fartsy show at every single home football game. BORING and they don't know their crowd! Other than the drummers, I cannot imagine anyone's heart rate rising. There is a lot of standing around in Marching band while other sections work out their details. I've lived it for all three years in high school.
That being said, most gym classes sessions don't exactly get your heart rate up all the time either. But there are weight lifting sessions, volleyball, basketball, mile runs etc. IF they every lift the mandatory PE requirements in favor of athletics, I predict marching band won't be a substitution to PE. Surely sports like hockey, track, basketball, cross country, and soccer have more exercise than PE can ever match. We agree that lifting the PE requirement is LONG overdue.
No offense, but you really don't know what you are talking about and yes, I can see with the Andover band this might be the case--talk to the Andover band kids about Rosemount--it's quite different.
No offense, but you really don't know what you are talking about and yes, I can see with the Andover band this might be the case--talk to the Andover band kids about Rosemount--it's quite different.
You missed my point. I clearly stated my comparison back in the 80's. Like I said ,I was in marching band during high school. They started weeks before school started and we put in many many many hours. Too many dusk to dawn sessions to count. Rosemount marching band is old school (that's a good thing). They put in the time (8-10 hours a day) and that is why they smoke the competition. I saw Rosemount marching band a couple years back and I was in awe. What a HUGE sound stage!
So I am not comparing Andover band programs in 2012 with Rosemount of 2012. It's not even remotely close. But I am comparing Rosemount band program with Anoka in the 80's. Hundreds of hours to hundreds of hours. It's a level of dedication that is only present in one MN school today (that's Rosemount). I was in concert band at Anoka (played French horn) for all three years. Back then, they had 5 distinct high school bands (concert being the highest). It was the largest school in the state. I do in fact know what I am talking about.
With that said, marching band is positively not a sport or remotely close. I don't care if you put in 100 hours a week. Maybe we can talk about the drummers and having some exercise. The strongest muscle of most marching band members are their "embouchure" (that's the lips for you non-band geeks out there).
Meanwhile my son ran 5 miles yesterday in their captain's practice. Don't you see an obvious difference versus walking in formation?
I'm not comparing marching band to cross country, I was comparing it to a high school PE class and they get FAR more physical activity in marching band in a week of band camp then the would in a semester of PE class. Our drumline probably gets the least amount of activity in the band as they do most of their practicing standing still....
Not sure how Roesmount is "old school" when all of the top bands have similar practice schedules and perform similar shows?? (We have 8 concert band and 4 jazz bands).
Back in the 80's the Sibley marching band was THE band to beat for parade bands. They had several national titles in the 80's. I had many friends in that band and they most certainly got a workout in band practice let alone the mile plus parade routes (or the 5 mile route for the Rose Bowl parade).
I'm not comparing marching band to cross country, I was comparing it to a high school PE class and they get FAR more physical activity in marching band in a week of band camp then the would in a semester of PE class. Our drumline probably gets the least amount of activity in the band as they do most of their practicing standing still....
Re: the drum line. Your right. When we marched in our field shows, most of the drums marched in the battery. Lifting heavy things for hours == a degree of exercise. Today, the drumline is out front stationary or "in the pit". As much as anything, I was talking about marching in parades. Again, back when we were marching, you lifted your legs higher than you do now and you pointed your toes. Today, it's glorified walking. So if walking is considered quality exercise for a 16 year old, then I guess that's some sort of a workout.
As I mentioned, I've lived three seasons of band camp. The band camp has been (and always will be) a long week to learn you music, practice with your sections, memorize it, study the drill book, and do several dry runs. There is a lot of standing around so it's simply not "exercise" like track, cross country, soccer, football, hockey, etc. There isn't one sore muscle with this "physical activity" (just sore lips and sore feet).
So if we define physical activity as walking and standing, then marching band is a FANTASTIC substitute for PE.
Re: the drum line. Your right. When we marched in our field shows, most of the drums marched in the battery. Lifting heavy things for hours == a degree of exercise. Today, the drumline is out front stationary or "in the pit". As much as anything, I was talking about marching in parades. Again, back when we were marching, you lifted your legs higher than you do now and you pointed your toes. Today, it's glorified walking. So if walking is considered quality exercise for a 16 year old, then I guess that's some sort of a workout.
As I mentioned, I've lived three seasons of band camp. The band camp has been (and always will be) a long week to learn you music, practice with your sections, memorize it, study the drill book, and do several dry runs. There is a lot of standing around so it's simply not "exercise" like track, cross country, soccer, football, hockey, etc. There isn't one sore muscle with this "physical activity" (just sore lips and sore feet).
So if we define physical activity as walking and standing, then marching band is a FANTASTIC substitute for PE.
The drumline still marches battery, the pit is separate however they tend to stand by the pit more to practice their music as you don't have to worry about your "wind" while playing drums. Now, if you want to talk about the Tuba section.....
As for sore muscles after band camp---WRONG. When you are going from 6:30 AM to midnight for 5 days straight starting with a mile run, calisthenics, basics (marching skill drills), etc. kids get VERY sore. Add in holding your instrument up for that long, etc. I have a feeling that the good marching bands have a different experience at band camp then you did.
I told my DS what you said about sore muscles, he just laughed....
As for sore muscles after band camp---WRONG. When you are going from 6:30 AM to midnight for 5 days straight starting with a mile run, calisthenics, basics (marching skill drills), etc. kids get VERY sore. Add in holding your instrument up for that long, etc. I have a feeling that the good marching bands have a different experience at band camp then you did.
I told my DS what you said about sore muscles, he just laughed....
The mile jog and the calisthenics for 5 days straight certainly is great exercise. But how much running do they do outside of band camp (during the school year)? Can we agree it is zero? Therefore one week of jogging a mile every day isn't a substitute for a year of PE in school. If it was, my son's cross country summer summer training would be worth 4 years of high school PE. That's because he logged over 300 miles including a week of high altitude training. But a PE substitute class debate will never have a thing to do with what kids do during the summer.
We agree that school year sports should be a substitute for PE. Where we disagree is marching band is exercise for a 16 year old. I'm going to predict that if the policy is every changed about sports being a substitute for PE, band won't be included in the mix. I will predict sports as PE substitute won't change because someone will b_tch and complain that the cheer club should be a substitute. So in the end, the politics won't let it happen.
If your son is claiming that they have their instruments up and marching for 18 hours a day, I'm calling his bluff. Like I said, you learn the music sitting down in the band room. You break out into sections sitting down with the section leader. You walk though the routine as the director has his microphone. Routines are constantly changed in an attempt to get the right look and feel so their HAS to be a lot of standing around. Rosemount will be no different.
We also jogged during band camp to warm up (it's not running). Being sore from standing / walking all day or being completely exhausted from putting in a very long day is expected ESPECIALLY in the summer. But walking isn't exercise in my book until you get to age 50. Certainly in my mind it is not at age 16. When you come off the ice and are covered in sweat, that's exercise and an obvious substitute for PE. If your sweat is from the heat, that's not exercise.
I'm interested to know what schools/districts are known for their music programs and marching bands. We are narrowing down our lists of towns to buy in...all I seem to find online are state test scores, not incredibly helpful. Any input on schools with competitive arts/music programs would be appreciated!
And to add my two cents to the marching band PE credit debate, it really depends on the type of marching band. In high school I was in a competition marching band, and in college I rowed on a D1 crew team. Both amazing cardio workouts.
I'm interested to know what schools/districts are known for their music programs and marching bands. We are narrowing down our lists of towns to buy in...all I seem to find online are state test scores, not incredibly helpful. Any input on schools with competitive arts/music programs would be appreciated!
And to add my two cents to the marching band PE credit debate, it really depends on the type of marching band. In high school I was in a competition marching band, and in college I rowed on a D1 crew team. Both amazing cardio workouts.
Rosemount is the defending 6 time consecutive state champion band for field show and 4 time state champion band for parades. They have the largest band program in the state and get a lot of national attention for their excellence. Academically the school is excellent, wonderful community. The performing arts program as a whole is outstanding. The choir programs also receive a lot of national attention, we had 2 students selected to attend Julliard for this year's freshman class out of our dance program-which is pretty impressive if you consider that there are only about 25 freshmen at Julliard. The nicest part of the performing arts program is that it is very well supported by the administration.
I'm interested to know what schools/districts are known for their music programs and marching bands. We are narrowing down our lists of towns to buy in...all I seem to find online are state test scores, not incredibly helpful. Any input on schools with competitive arts/music programs would be appreciated!
And to add my two cents to the marching band PE credit debate, it really depends on the type of marching band. In high school I was in a competition marching band, and in college I rowed on a D1 crew team. Both amazing cardio workouts.
Reading your other post, your hubby got transferred to Plymouth. Welcome to MN!
If I was you, I'd live in Plymouth (you would go to Wayzata high school). The school is HUGE so there will be plenty of band opportunities; more kids==more bands and opportunity. The area is full of motivated families (hence the test scores are high). Most average sized MN high schools don't have a big band program any more. Rosemount is known for its band program but it would be a commute. See Music / Overview
.... we had 2 students selected to attend Julliard for this year's freshman class out of our dance program-which is pretty impressive if you consider that there are only about 25 freshmen at Julliard. The nicest part of the performing arts program is that it is very well supported by the administration.
Major Kudos to those students! They obviously got a lot of help from there dance teacher. So if my kids dreamed of dancing, I think Rosemount might be the perfect place to go to high school.
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I saw Rosemount marching band a couple years back and I was in awe. What a HUGE sound stage!
