Good Job Missouri on the ObamaCare vote (Liberty, Washington: car insurance, lawyer)

[skrizzle]

Originally Posted by Ciaerin

It is not a left/right thing. It is a "the government has no right in telling me what I can and cannot do with my money" thing. They have no right to tell me I have to purchase something. And yes that means auto insurance as well. And lets not get started on the stupid seatbelt law. I wear my seatbelt, but is should be my CHOICE, not someone that sits in the back of a limo.

Wow, talk about someone not knowing how to pick their battles.

We are in 2 wars, wasting billions of dollars, a recession, unemployment rising, gas prices rising, small businesses dying, corperations on the verge of changing the internet into a class system..... and you complain about not just health care, but seat belts and having to buy insurance?????

Geeez. whats next... are you going to complain that the government puts up stop lights as well... cuz who are they to tell you when to stop, it should be YOUR choice right?

MO is fricken hypocritical. It doesn't want the government having any say in health care, yet we sure didn't have any uproar when the state government basically banned strip clubs in MO by stopping lap dances, alcohol, and nudity in them....

So many bigger issues, and this is what you complain about?

[misplaced1]

It's early yet but did I read that to imply that strip club restrictions is a bigger issue than the government having their hands in our health care?

[skrizzle]

Originally Posted by misplaced1

It's early yet but did I read that to imply that strip club restrictions is a bigger issue than the government having their hands in our health care?

You might have read it to imply it... but no thats not at all what it said.

I'm saying that MANY of the same people (conservatives) who rage over the health care bill and anything they think is government intervention (such as the person I was replying to saying he shouldnt be told to wear a seat belt) didn't care one bit or even supported the government placing restrictions on an industry, with the results being lost tax revenue and jobs.... yeah it's hypocritical

[misplaced1]

So the million dollar question might be where to draw the line at the govt. making laws in the name of what is good for the people.

I'm not sure anyone has an answer that we could all agree on.

As far as the difference between people standing up to speak on a medical insurance law or one that concerns strip clubs, this could be wrong, but maybe the medical issues being something that concern a lot more people personally are more important to them personally. Oh and I think the entertainment industry you are referring to also relies on moral issues where other topics really do not. I really can't say more than that because I'm not personally familiar with the circumstances of the entertainment industry but I am the health care.

[lifelongMOgal]

Originally Posted by misplaced1

So the million dollar question might be where to draw the line at the govt. making laws in the name of what is good for the people. ........................

.

Within those powers enumerated to them in the US Constitution. Those powers not specifically given to the federal government remains with the states and with the people.

^^^^^Line drawn since 1789.^^^^^

[skrizzle]

Originally Posted by misplaced1

So the million dollar question might be where to draw the line at the govt. making laws in the name of what is good for the people.

I'm not sure anyone has an answer that we could all agree on.

As far as the difference between people standing up to speak on a medical insurance law or one that concerns strip clubs, this could be wrong, but maybe the medical issues being something that concern a lot more people personally are more important to them personally. Oh and I think the entertainment industry you are referring to also relies on moral issues where other topics really do not. I really can't say more than that because I'm not personally familiar with the circumstances of the entertainment industry but I am the health care.

Really familiar with health care? I work at a hospital, I'm in school to be a PA.

One could argue health care is a moral issue.... a responsibility to the well being of our fellow citizens?

[skrizzle]

Originally Posted by lifelongMOgal

Within those powers enumerated to them in the US Constitution. Those powers not specifically given to the federal government remains with the states and with the people.

^^^^^Line drawn since 1789.^^^^^

Except the constitution is open for interpretation. I would say one could argue since it was written and signed by people with backgrounds in law, they knew this would be the case and perhaps its intentional?

On that grounds the Fifth Amendment of the Constitution states:

"No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation."

Even an average law school student would be able to take those words and make the case that this line alone could show intent for national health care, especially the life and liberty part.

In Griswald v. Connecticut Justice Douglas wrote:

[LEFT]“specific guarantees in the Bill of Rights have penumbras, formed by emanations from those guarantees.” This was in relation to how the constiution does not specifically mention our right to privacy, but it is implied.

See how one could say health care is implied?
[/LEFT]

[Inkpoe]

Originally Posted by skrizzle

Really? You need to head over to jail then since you let the government force you to pay for:

1. streets
2. sewage treatment
3. police departments
4. Pointless waste of money and lives with 2 wars
5. etc...

There's a saying: "Nothing in life is certain but taxes and death."

Our taxes are suppose to pay for streets, sewage, treatment, et. c. War is entirely another issue, but definitely covered by the taxes.

However, Obama himself said that the Obamacare was NOT a tax and doesn't want it to be labeled as a tax. To show a note of contradiction, his staff argued at the Supreme Court that it was a tax-- which is it?

Its not a Left/Right issue, its how the politicians are handling this. How do you pass something into law that you haven't read, studied or understand? Even now, nobody is really taking the helm, explaining and defining the citizen's expectations well. Not even Obama. Too many people don't understand what to expect, don't know what's going on and so on. How is this surprising? The politicians don't either.

My sister and step-father are Insurance agents and said that the day after Obamacare was passed, that a lot of people came in demanding their free health care. My sister and step-father had to explain the deal to them. What were those people's reaction? They CHEWED my sister and step-father out, screaming and storming out of their office.

Universal Healthcare shouldn't be an entitlement... it's only a privilege.

[aragx6]

Originally Posted by lifelongMOgal

Within those powers enumerated to them in the US Constitution. Those powers not specifically given to the federal government remains with the states and with the people.

^^^^^Line drawn since 1789.^^^^^

So based on this you would be opposed to a reinterpretation of the 14th amendment that would strip away citizenship rights to children born in America to illegal immigrants then, yes? Because this issue is gaining traction with many in the Republican party.

[northbound74]

Government run healthcare is always a bigger fiasco than private healthcare. Neither are perfect, but at least one respects basic freedom more than the other. Remember, this IS America. Let us do things the way we want and respect our vote and our intelligence. Just because we don't agree, it doesn't mean the other is stupid and uninformed. Get over it.
To those who don't like it, Europe is just a boat ride away. I'm sure their healthcare is perfect and flawless and fair and everyone dies when they're 150 in their sleep and the system is well-funded with no controversy....
If only the government actually accomplished something they set out to do instead of creating even bigger problems, perhaps more people would be on board with more government control. Oh, but then there's that pesky lack-of-freedom part.
Both parties are guilty in their own way.
People need to be taken care of, but the federal government is the worst possible source for healthcare or charity of any kind.

And whoever said that high Republican turnout did this needs to quit taking their talking points from the Star. That lame-lopsided rag should just give up and merge with move-on or something.

Good job, Missouri.