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And re: the redshirting debate, while I don't have children I will say the following:
1) I have always found it odd when a child starts K at 4, when I was in elementary school some 28 years ago, there was only 1 child started at 4 & that was b/c her mother couldn't wait to get her out of her hair for the day. She was in remedial classes too. IMO there is a big difference btwn a child turning 4 to 5 and a 6 year old from an emotional maturity standpoint although I am sure there are exceptions.2) I have several NJ teachers in my circle of family & friends; some teach Kindergarten. The curriculum is at least a grade ahead of what it was when I went to school (& I was one of the few back then attending an all day kindergarten). I was considered advanced, in enrichment tract & accelerated programs & I don't know how I would have passed the Kindergarten curriculum of today (& I was born in January so was a solid 5 1/2 when I started).
3) Yes redshirting did exist back then - my mother redshirted my sibling who had a mid October birthday.
4) Of course it depends on the individual child & I am sure with the prevalence of more children in daycare/pre-school they may be learning at a faster rate, but just from a size & social maturity standpoint I can't fault or term it overprotective if a parent chooses not to send their 4 year old into elementary school.
interesting - all my girlfriends from HS, with the exception of me with an August birthday, were 4 starting kindy (i obviously just turned 5). 2 october b'days, 1 november bday, and 1 january (of the following year). our cutoff was 12/31 so you had a lot of kids who were 4. redshirting was unheard of.
now, i have 2 born in may, and they are younger than fully 80-85% of the class - we have a 10/1 cutoff. (i may have mentioned this earlier in this thread). redshirting just because a child is physically small or they need to become better at sports is stupid, IMHO.
I totally agree with that every child is very individual and it is up to the parent to know what might be best for your specific individual child. When I moved back to NJ from Florida in March of 2004 I had a choice to enter my son (born in August of 1997) in either Kindergarten or 1st grade. I consulted with family, friends, and finally professionals and chose to hold him back for several reasons (in which I really in my gut already knew). First my son is a boy and fell into the not as mature as most girls category, physically my son was one of the shortest in class(his father is 5'7) and logically speaking I assume he will not be on the tall side as an adult, and of course the academic side...although I consider my son to be bright...I knew already he was not going to be one of the few gifted Einsteins . That being said, now that my son is 10 and very involved in sports..I am extremely glad that I did keep him back mainly because physical size is very important to boys and men growing up...especially in competitive sports. I say only you know your child best...because she is a girl and possibly more mature and perhaps she is showing signs of already being academically advanced then maybe putting her in early is an option. Worst case is you don't and she happens to become the most advanced person in her class...not so bad. I always go by the motto...when in doubt don't...but go by your inner motherly instincts.
I certainly never said that my reasoning for holding my son back was soley due to his size nor to "excel" at sports and my 3sonsnj response did not hold back hers soley due to height. Please don't ALWAYS be so quick to assume nor insult my intelligence that I would actually hold back my son based on just those 2 reasons. I guess the pyschologists I consulted with thought it was wrong as well. I think the only thing that was stupid was the comment....IMOP ....of course!
Last edited by BaskingRidgeMom; 02-21-2008 at 07:58 PM..
I certainly never said that my reasoning for holding my son back was soley due to his size nor to "excel" at sports and my 3sonsnj response did not hold back hers soley due to height. Please don't ALWAYS be so quick to assume. I think the only thing that was stupid was the comment....IMOP ....of course!
are you talking to me? i wasn't talking about you so don't ALWAYS be so quick to assume. if you didn't hold your kid back for the reasons i mentioned, then i'm not talking about you obviously, right?
I would assume it certainly was me after all I was the ONLY person to mention the "sports" factor. Who else were you speaking of? Of course that would be me...right?
I would assume it certainly was me after all I was the ONLY person to mention the "sports" factor. Who else were you speaking of? Of course that would be me...right?
no. i mentioned it because, believe it or not, it's a quite common reason to redshirt a child. i live in an area where parents do it quite frequently.
i've held this opinion for awhile..in fact, I said earlier in this thread that redshirting is out of control and shouldn't be done "for the hell of it" - and, IMHO, size and sports qualify "for the hell of it". maturity and learning disabilities are another issue.
oh, there's another reason too redshirting is stupid - just because you want your kid to "be the oldest".
Well I certainly feel much differently in my personal decision making regarding my sons matter and I certainly took the decision to due so very seriously. I put alot of time and research in it and perhaps there are some parents who would make such selfish choices based on their own for competive gain...my was no such reason. It's pretty sad that some parents would stoop to such levels...how competive are they getting.
Wow I'm surprised you know so many 4 year olds that started Kindergarten. My aunt just retired as a kindergarten teacher & I reconfirmed with her - she said the vast majority of students are 5 going on 6. I also have several other friends who are elementary school teachers & I've never gotten that vibe from them either. As an adult having lived in 4 different counties in NJ, I can only think of one one person to start kindergarten at 4 (of course I could be missing a few but there is a definite norm to the 5 1/2 y/o starting). Anyway when I mentioned social maturity & physical stature it wasn't from a perspective of competitiveness; rather just ensuring the child is at par with his/her peers so that he/she can mix well versus being cast out due to social immaturity or perceived physical weakness.
I guess my point is that it isn't the height of entitlement to want your child to start school at 5 1/2 vs. 4 since in many circles that is the norm...
Quote:
Originally Posted by tahiti
interesting - all my girlfriends from HS, with the exception of me with an August birthday, were 4 starting kindy (i obviously just turned 5). 2 october b'days, 1 november bday, and 1 january (of the following year). our cutoff was 12/31 so you had a lot of kids who were 4. redshirting was unheard of.
now, i have 2 born in may, and they are younger than fully 80-85% of the class - we have a 10/1 cutoff. (i may have mentioned this earlier in this thread). redshirting just because a child is physically small or they need to become better at sports is stupid, IMHO.
Maybe it was different when my generation entered school (I'm 40), but I grew up in Summit. My sister started when 4 (Sept. b-day), and one of my best friends started at 4 (Dec. b-day). I know my parents didn't try to get my sister in early and I'm willing to bet my friend's parents didn't either. It must have been a dec. 31 cutoff back then.
I'm 33. Not that much younger then you although a bit. I didn't grow up in Summit though. My father did graduate H.S at 17 but both my parents thought that was a weird move on his parents part to send him to kindergarten so early. And when I went to college (in NJ) most of my classmates were 18 going on 19. It was weird to me to meet a 17 year old - as I can recall. Bottom line is I guess people experience different norms in their lives & circles so I guess the concept of people thinking there is some sort of entitled mentality to wanting their child to start Kindergarten after 5 so they are more likely to fit in with their peer groups socially, academically as well as wrspct capability, is what irritates me the most. Obviously people are exposed to different things as this board shows. BTW I have no dog in this fight - I don't even have kids although most of my friends do and the ones that have children going into K are all solidly 5 <shrug>. I just hope it puts an end to the seeming anger at those who would be more likely to ensure their child is 5 (barring some sort of advanced aptitude on their part) before sending them to kindergarten. Like I said too, my family is comprised a great deal of educators & the 4 y/o in Kindergarten is considered young to them. I am willing to concede validity to others attested experiences however it just has not been mine.
ETA - Just spoke to a very close friend of mine who is 39 - he went to school at 5 turning 6. His mom was a teacher & his uncle is a NJ school superintendent. Not only did his mother redshirt his brother (a little bit older then me younger then him) with an Oct. birthday but when I asked about people starting school at 4 - graduating H.S. at 17 he said there was sometimes one but he thought it was weird & his family used to say the same about that too. Just saying this to point out that my experiences obviously are not due to my youth (!) or are not completely invalid - that maybe it is reasonable to want your kid to start school at 5 & there are alot of circles where that is the norm; whereas obviously others have experienced something different.
quote=frogandtoad;2920756]Maybe it was different when my generation entered school (I'm 40), but I grew up in Summit. My sister started when 4 (Sept. b-day), and one of my best friends started at 4 (Dec. b-day). I know my parents didn't try to get my sister in early and I'm willing to bet my friend's parents didn't either. It must have been a dec. 31 cutoff back then.[/quote]
Last edited by b75; 02-23-2008 at 12:59 PM..
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- we have a 10/1 cutoff. (i may have mentioned this earlier in this thread). redshirting just because a child is physically small or they need to become better at sports is stupid, IMHO.
