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"If Boston were set up like NYC, Cambridge would certainly be considered part of the Boston along with a slew of other smaller cities that are much more Urban than many areas of Boston Proper."
1. hoboken, Jersey city, etc are analogous to Cambridge.
2. even adding cambridge and slummerville and brookline doesnt add that many jobs (I doubt ANY of the inner communities other than cambridge have many non locally oriented jobs at all). Most professional employment in greater Boston is on rte 128 or beyond.
The only thing is Boston didn't consolidate it's surrounding cities like most other places did so the actually City of Boston is deceivingly small.
actually it did, it absorbed roxbury, charlestown (sp?) dorchester, etc in a desperate attempt to preserve a Protestant majority. When it became clear that attempt was failing, towns like Brookline refused to be annexed.
actually it did, it absorbed roxbury, charlestown (sp?) dorchester, etc in a desperate attempt to preserve a Protestant majority. When it became clear that attempt was failing, towns like Brookline refused to be annexed.
Sure but Cambridge, Somerville(hasn't been fair to call in Slummerville in decades), Brookline are as much as part of Boston as those other communities. Boston doesn't have any place analogous to NJ, there is no question NYC is on a much larger scale. There are tons of good jobs- not just for local services- to be had in the communities that can be easily reached on public transit in the area.
All I'm saying is that NYC is now geared to a very few industries and only certain types of people can really live there viably now. As an engineer if I wanted to live in NYC and find a job in my field I'd have to have a car and commute out to the suburbs meanwhile living in some boring far-flung side of Queens that is no different from the suburbs. Here I can still take public transit and have lots of jobs opportunities.
Holden how long have you lived in NYC? You think the only difference in opportunities between NYC and Boston is being an actor or star? Really?
You and starfox are welcome to compare Boston and Brooklyn.....there you may have an argument. But please, don't waste everyone's time trying to compare Boston and NYC. I mean really...so silly. NYC is the papa, the breadwinner, the goal, while Boston is the redheaded step-child always trying to keep up....I know you wanna be NYC when you grow up...but you can't. Be happy being Boston and don't try to compare yourself to something you can never be.
I don't live in NYC. I left because I didn't want to live in NYC. But I was born in NYC. I lived in NYC for part of my childhood, 7 years as a student and 8 years of working. My family goes back 5 generations there and most of them are still there.
And you know what, when I "grew up" I realized I didn't want:
-to work insane hours so I could pay too much for a tiny apartment with no place to relax outside
-to pay 11% state and local income tax instead of 5%
-to sit in traffic for 2 hours every time I wanted to check something out beyond city limits
-to stay out all night like it was some great cool rebellious thing. (Interesting thing about the 24-hour subway service. It doesn't stop running, but if I needed to get back to Brooklyn it took almost 2 hours after 10 pm)
-to deal with the constant attitude
I got out and my quality of life has been much better. Every so often I'll check out the NYC forum and it's a good reminder of what I don't miss. If NYC is so great, why are people so touchy about the thought that some people might not want to live there?
The moment someone suggests that the economics of NYC make no sense for a middle-class person unless they're willing to put up with a longer commute, less space and less disposable income than they's have somewhere else, it starts. The sputtering. "But, but, it's NEW YORK. Don't you know, it's really big? Frank Sinatra sang about it. And it's really big. So it must be the only place worth going, right?"
I think if you are unhappy you should live elsewhere. And I believe alot of people are better off living elsewhere...there is a big country out there..go live your life. But let's not try to make Boston better than NYC....the 2 are not comparable anymore than NYC and Miami are. In addition, the idea that there are no middle class neighborhoods left in NYC is laughable, and shows profound ignorance and assumptions based on 'what I heard' and 'what I read.'
NYC isn't for everyone...it is a gateway city that populated the rest of the country. Go live your happy life somewhere else without putting down NYC in the process..get it? You have gotten old and crabby..and it's best to leave NYC before you shriveled into a prune. Those darn taxes! Kids making so much noise outside! I don't want to stay up past 10! Boston awaits...and then Florida shortly thereafter.
NYC is for people who like a lot of stimulation and the opportunity, not the guarantee, of being very successful at whatever they end up doing. It does wear you down though, so a lot of people can only take it for so long before they move on. Then they get replaced by someone else, and it all begins again.
Sure but Cambridge, Somerville(hasn't been fair to call in Slummerville in decades), Brookline are as much as part of Boston as those other communities. Boston doesn't have any place analogous to NJ, there is no question NYC is on a much larger scale. There are tons of good jobs- not just for local services- to be had in the communities that can be easily reached on public transit in the area.
All I'm saying is that NYC is now geared to a very few industries and only certain types of people can really live there viably now. As an engineer if I wanted to live in NYC and find a job in my field I'd have to have a car and commute out to the suburbs meanwhile living in some boring far-flung side of Queens that is no different from the suburbs. Here I can still take public transit and have lots of jobs opportunities.
what major employers are there in Brookline? Or revere? What major engineering oriented firms are there in boston (leaving aside Allston, for the moment) Or even non financially oriented firms?
What you are really describing is the impact of Cambridge and its universities, on employment within Cambridge and adjoining parts of somerville and Allston.
I would agree that NYC probably doesnt have as many large tech companies within walking distance of metro lines. This is a fact. I have yet to meet many engineers who can't drive, or have a huge aversion to the suburbs. And there are many fields in NYC (especially publishing and media) where there are lots of firms near metro stops, and not so many in boston.
The moment someone suggests that the economics of NYC make no sense for a middle-class person unless they're willing to put up with a longer commute, less space and less disposable income than they's have somewhere else, it starts. The sputtering. "But, but, it's NEW YORK. Don't you know, it's really big? Frank Sinatra sang about it. And it's really big. So it must be the only place worth going, right?"
I think because in this case the OP has said some really silly things.
I still don't see how some can say every neighborhood outside manhattan and brownstone brooklyn is unattractive.
I think if you are unhappy you should live elsewhere. And I believe alot of people are better off living elsewhere...there is a big country out there..go live your life. But let's not try to make Boston better than NYC....the 2 are not comparable anymore than NYC and Miami are. In addition, the idea that there are no middle class neighborhoods left in NYC is laughable, and shows profound ignorance and assumptions based on 'what I heard' and 'what I read.'
NYC isn't for everyone...it is a gateway city that populated the rest of the country. Go live your happy life somewhere else without putting down NYC in the process..get it? You have gotten old and crabby..and it's best to leave NYC before you shriveled into a prune. Those darn taxes! Kids making so much noise outside! I don't want to stay up past 10! Boston awaits...and then Florida shortly thereafter.
I do live elsewhere.
As for putting things down, why don't you take a look at your contribution to the thread? They guy said he didn't think NYC offered much for middle class people at this point. You might disagree, but you didn't say, hey, I think you're wrong about that -- check out these neighborhoods. Instead, you said this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by SobroGuy
What you are forgetting is the biggest draw for NYC which does not occur just about anywhere else: OPPORTUNITY. So while you poopoo NYC as not what it's cracked up to be (where is?), you forget that all those midwesterners are faced with absolutely NOTHING in their current small/medium/large towns other than old people, foreclosures, and wal-mart for employment/entertainment. NYC in comparison IS a huge draw as a result...it certainly isn't perfect (where is?) but you have the OPPORTUNITY to do/be whatever you want....I don't see that happening in Poho, Iowa. Dark times for NYC? We are still enjoying record low crime rates, our economy has done far better than most large cities, we are adding employment, and have limited foreclosures. Yeah a dark time indeed!
As for Boston, so long as you are home and in bed by 11 I am sure you'll do fine..seeing as public transportation is a joke and closes at ..hmmm midnight? Bars and restaurants shut by..hmm..10? And oh yeah...a huge bulk of the population are transient students coming and going, without a care for anything, including Boston. Nevermind that Boston has very few opportunities for much of anything...songs were not sung, and the Global population does not flock to Boston for a reason. OK to visit once for a weekend though.
So I've gotten old and crabby because I have a job so I don't stay out all night? Because I'd rather have a bigger, nicer, but far cheaper apartment? Because I think an hour's wait at the tunnel sucks? Because it's kind of nice to have the same base salary but bring home almost a thousand more a month after taxes? I have no idea how old you are, but you act like a 13-year old.
It's perfectly legit to compare Boston and NYC. And you can say: here are the pros and cons of NYC, here are the pros and cons of Boston. That's what a forum is for.
For some people, Boston is better than NYC. Others would rather be in NYC. That's fine. What I don't get is why some of the NYC people are so touchy that they flip out if you suggest there's life elsewhere. Not capable of having a rational discussion.
I left NYC for a lot of the reasons the OP was talking about. I didn't read about it, I lived it. I didn't think it was worth it. I can get a nicer place for less, with a shorter commute, here. It's still urban, I still take the train to work and walk around. There are great things to do all over New England. Like NYC, there are grittier or uglier places, but overall it's a beautiful area.
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