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Chicago has long had race relation issues, this goes back to the early part of the last century when blacks began arriving in masse from the south.
Two of the worse race riots in US history happened in Chicago (1919 and 1968), but there have been others. The book turned into a play and later film "Raisin In The Sun) is about an AA family seeking to move into the Washington Park Subdivision which was then a largely if not wholly white area.
Racial and or ethnic tensions or whatever are what they are in Chicago due to the political machines from either party that have dominated things for decades. New York state and city have nothing on corruption of the political sort when compared to Chicago.
The Canarsie whites have fled most parts of NYC. To get that "ethnic" flavor you have to go to LI, or NJ.
I will not be shocked to see whites, priced out of other parts of Brooklyn, looking at Canarsie. Its not that far on the L.
Not anytime soon.
Contrary to what many believe, whites in NYC are on the decline and the Hasidic and Orthodox Jews are a growing share among whites.
If we keep the same pace, in 20 years, whites will comprise somewhere around a third of NYC and half of whites will be either Hasidic or Orthodox Jews.
Contrary to what many believe, whites in NYC are on the decline and the Hasidic and Orthodox Jews are a growing share among whites.
If we keep the same pace, in 20 years, whites will comprise somewhere around a third of NYC and half of whites will be either Hasidic or Orthodox Jews.
Image result for white population in new york city
New York City
Year Population White (includes White Hispanics)
1980 7,071,639 4,294,075
1990 7,322,564 3,827,088
2000 8,008,278 3,576,385
2010 8,175,133 3,597,341
8 more rows, 13 more columns
Demographic history of New York City - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demogr..._CityWikipedia
Growth was so low that it was almost flat among whites from 2000 to 2010. A big chunk of the whites in NYC are also white latinos and they too are a growing part of NY's white population. You do have a lot of transplants coming in and Canarsie could still gentrify, but the white populations growth is checked probably by white retirees moving to FL.
Some neighborhoods have certainly gained white residents, but people forget South Brooklyn lost a lot of it's white residents. Chinese and Russian Jews (white) moved in as Italians moved OUT. White working class Queens continued to shrink as formerly white neighborhoods became heavily Latino or Asian (ditto Brooklyn).
A lot of the whites moved out of the region to NC or FL.
Image result for white population in new york city
New York City
Year Population White (includes White Hispanics)
1980 7,071,639 4,294,075
1990 7,322,564 3,827,088
2000 8,008,278 3,576,385
2010 8,175,133 3,597,341
8 more rows, 13 more columns
Demographic history of New York City - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demogr..._CityWikipedia
Growth was so low that it was almost flat among whites from 2000 to 2010. A big chunk of the whites in NYC are also white latinos and they too are a growing part of NY's white population. You do have a lot of transplants coming in and Canarsie could still gentrify, but the white populations growth is checked probably by white retirees moving to FL.
Some neighborhoods have certainly gained white residents, but people forget South Brooklyn lost a lot of it's white residents. Chinese and Russian Jews (white) moved in as Italians moved OUT. White working class Queens continued to shrink as formerly white neighborhoods became heavily Latino or Asian (ditto Brooklyn).
A lot of the whites moved out of the region to NC or FL.
Take out the growth from the Hasidic and Orthodox (Ashkenazi and Sephardi) communities (mostly in Brooklyn) and the white population would be plummeting.
Transplants aren't making up for the losses. I've seen the changes myself.
I grew up in Bergen Beach. When we moved in, in the late 1990's, the area from Flatlands to the north and Flatbush to the East was almost entirely white. I used to take the B3 and the B41 on a daily basis and the only people left on the bus past Flatbush (for the B3) and Flatlands (for the B41) were whites. If we saw a black person past those streets still on the bus our eyes got real big. lol
Fast forward to today and the only whites left are in Bergen Beach and Mill Basin.
In 15 years time, Bergen Beach will be a mixed neighborhood. My parents still live there and there aren't enough white families who want to move there. Simple demographics. Any white family who could afford a $700K+ home, doesn't want to live in bumble****, Brooklyn.
The only thing that's been keeping the neighborhood mostly white is that the prices are at least 100K higher than north of Ave U (on average). When there's no more stock of cheaper houses (already occurring), people will have no choice but to buy in Bergen Beach.
Mill Basin might be better insulated because there are many homes over $1MM and there's a growing Sephardic Jewish community there.
True story. When we moved in there was a burned down house at the corner of E 73rd ST and Ave W with graffiti on the siding that read "we won't sell" or something to that affect. Our neighbor, who was there since the neighborhood was built in the 60's relayed the story.
A black family bought the house. They were accused of dealing drugs and told to leave. They refused and the house was burned down. They rebuilt and it was burned down again. They refused to sell for a long time after that but eventually did and now there's a huge house on that corner lot (I think it's a Greek family).
2. When my parents were looking to buy a house, the RE broker told them that they didn't show black people houses in Bergen Beach/Mill Basin.
3. One of my parents friends had a neighbor who was selling his house. This was around 2010 or so. A black family came to take a look. That guys (another) neighbor threatened him and basically told him, in not so many words, that if he sold to a black family, he'd burn down the house.
**** was real back then and some still try to keep it that way but you can't fight demographics.
Last edited by wawaweewa; 05-31-2016 at 10:34 PM..
There are some neighborhoods which are heavily black though, many in Southeast Queens, as well as Central/Eastern Brooklyn. But there don't seem to be neighborhoods that are 80+% Hispanic, probably just Corona.
Western Sunset Park, and eastern Washington Heights/Inwood if you want to divide each neighborhood into subsections.
Quote:
Originally Posted by G-Dale
Cypress Hills might also be 80% plus Hispanic.
I think it's a little less. Keep in mind that it's near ENY, and there's still some remaining white families there (not to mention there might end up being a few hipsters moving further along the J/Z)
Quote:
Originally Posted by l1995
Oh yeah I didn't mean to imply that all Mexicans worked in Manhattan, of course plenty of them work in the Bronx or Westchester in which living in Wakefield would make sense.
But I don't think you save much money living in Wakefield as opposed to other neighborhoods, the lowest rents in the Bronx I could find were in University Heights. And the places with the highest Mexican populations in NYC generally are close to Manhattan by subway or in Manhattan itself. Corona, Jackson Heights, Sunset Park, Mott Haven, East Harlem, Union City, etc.
Corona is fairly far out. Let's not forget relatively far out areas like Bensonhurst, Belmont, North Shore of SI, etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny
In fact Wakefield and Williamsbridge, west of WP Road is probably more Latin than black these days.
I will say, I've taken the Bx26 along Allerton Avenue, and at White Plains Road, there's a good chunk of Hispanics who get on to go to Bedford Park.
Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny
I will not be shocked to see whites, priced out of other parts of Brooklyn, looking at Canarsie. Its not that far on the L.
Aside from the reconstruction project that will take a few years, it's still a 30-40 minute all-local ride to get to Union Square from Canarsie.
Western Sunset Park, and eastern Washington Heights/Inwood if you want to divide each neighborhood into subsections.
Corona is fairly far out. Let's not forget relatively far out areas like Bensonhurst, Belmont, North Shore of SI, etc.
Yeah Bensonhurst and Belmont are far out but Corona doesn't seem too far, although maybe I'm just basing that off of my experience with neighboring Jackson Heights which has an express subway stop. The North Shore of SI is far out, but doesn't it serve as the downtown of Staten Island?
One thing I've been curious about is why Long Island has big Central American, South American, and Dominican populations, but not a very big Mexican population. The few Mexican people I know from Long Island are only half Mexican or less, and I live in an area with a lot of Hispanics.
Chicago could address some of its problems of impoverished neighborhoods by hiring a lot more police and putting firearm offenders away for long mandatory sentences. That would stem the flow a little. Subsequent investment in those neighborhoods, many of which are well connected to the subway/El, could even turn them around. But... the city can't do either of these things.
The reason it can't is because it's out of cash. Corruption and lavish public service payrolls claim every cent it raises in revenue, plus a lot more.
That isn't to say the problems can't be fixed. The city has a great deal going for it. The crime rate is already below that of cities like Atlanta, Miami and Houston, and addressing the gangs would reduce it still further. Much of it provides one of the best urban experiences you'll find in America. Its economy is huge, it has a large population of highly educated and successful people. Truly excellent cultural amenities. That's a strong foundation.
Standing in the way is an army of people whose snouts are firmly in the trough. Until the city's residents are ready to shift them (and nothing less than a constitutional amendment in the state of IL is needed to address the pensions), Chicago will remain in a holding pattern - a heavily class- and race-segregated holding pattern.
Chicago could address some of its problems of impoverished neighborhoods by hiring a lot more police and putting firearm offenders away for long mandatory sentences. That would stem the flow a little. Subsequent investment in those neighborhoods, many of which are well connected to the subway/El, could even turn them around. But... the city can't do either of these things.
The reason it can't is because it's out of cash. Corruption and lavish public service payrolls claim every cent it raises in revenue, plus a lot more.
That isn't to say the problems can't be fixed. The city has a great deal going for it. The crime rate is already below that of cities like Atlanta, Miami and Houston, and addressing the gangs would reduce it still further. Much of it provides one of the best urban experiences you'll find in America. Its economy is huge, it has a large population of highly educated and successful people. Truly excellent cultural amenities. That's a strong foundation.
Standing in the way is an army of people whose snouts are firmly in the trough. Until the city's residents are ready to shift them (and nothing less than a constitutional amendment in the state of IL is needed to address the pensions), Chicago will remain in a holding pattern - a heavily class- and race-segregated holding pattern.
New York has lots of public sector employees with excellent pensions, so that clearly isn't the cause of the problem. Of course NY gets more tourism and more business than Chicago due to it's name, so it can easily afford to spend more money on services.
New York has lots of public sector employees with excellent pensions, so that clearly isn't the cause of the problem. Of course NY gets more tourism and more business than Chicago due to it's name, so it can easily afford to spend more money on services.
You're right - I should have been clearer. Public service jobs aren't the root cause of the problem - corruption and mismanagement are. In fact, I'm strongly in favour of a large and effective public service, both to maintain a city and as a source of sound, middle-class jobs..
Unfortunately, Chicago has been spending beyond its means, including on its public service corps. Its public sector pensions are a serious problem. IIRC the Chicago Tribune, maybe two years ago, ran a lengthy and largely unbiased series on the city's problems and how to fix them.
Image result for white population in new york city
New York City
Year Population White (includes White Hispanics)
1980 7,071,639 4,294,075
1990 7,322,564 3,827,088
2000 8,008,278 3,576,385
2010 8,175,133 3,597,341
8 more rows, 13 more columns
Demographic history of New York City - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demogr..._CityWikipedia
Growth was so low that it was almost flat among whites from 2000 to 2010. A big chunk of the whites in NYC are also white latinos and they too are a growing part of NY's white population. You do have a lot of transplants coming in and Canarsie could still gentrify, but the white populations growth is checked probably by white retirees moving to FL.
Some neighborhoods have certainly gained white residents, but people forget South Brooklyn lost a lot of it's white residents. Chinese and Russian Jews (white) moved in as Italians moved OUT. White working class Queens continued to shrink as formerly white neighborhoods became heavily Latino or Asian (ditto Brooklyn).
A lot of the whites moved out of the region to NC or FL.
To respond to the above comments about most of the white growth in NYC being Orthodox Jewish:
New York City has always had a significant percentage of its white population be Jews, Orthodox/Hasidic or not (most, though not all, Jews are white).
Many if not most of the whites in Southern Brooklyn are from the former Soviet Union, Jewish or not.
Why does it matter though?
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