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Sorry Russel, but you're an idiot - and a naive one at that. Yes it's true that California and Orange County were once the very best of the United States - the finest country in the world.... but those days however are LONG GONE. I could go on and on and on about why Orange County has degenerated so rapidly over the last 10-15 years, but instead I'll be responding to bullet # 8. Perhaps Russel has long-term memory loss. The following website should jog his memory and that of anyone else who questions my common sense and historical understanding of what is going to happen to California - AGAIN.
(I can't wait to make money off the inevitable though... people like Russel are a dime-a-dozen throughout the southland - and oblivious to the overcrowding, overpopulation, over-development, over-saturation of NON-ASSIMILATING minorities - which all just barely begin to scratch at the surface of the demise of the once glorious Orange County. My grandfather who bought in Newport back in 1959 is surely rolling in his grave at the thought of modern-day “OC living.”)
There really are truly wonderful people here, and there are neighborhoods where the people are more than friendly on the surface. Your neighborhood is what you make of it, and all it takes is one family to take the risk to open up and be real, and suddenly you have a culture of neighbors instead of a culture of co-habitators.
I very much agree, I see superficial people in my neighborhood, but I see many more friendly, real people. If you look for the negative you will find it, and if you look for the positive you will also find that. So many negative posters on here, yet they are only 20 or so of the nearly 3 million people that live here. Orange County continues to grow year by year, and for every person who leaves here, they are very quickly replaced. Of course, Orange County has grown leaps and bounds over the past few decades. Many of the age 50+ residents remember when OC didn't even have 1 million people. To many of them, the current OC isn't what they were dreaming of when they moved here in the 60-70's. But don't crush the dreams of the new residents who are coming here just because it is no longer for you. Of course, people looking to relocate here would be absent minded to let other people decide for them if it is right for them or not. I wish people who move to other cities and states the best of luck in their ventures, and I equally welcome the new residents who are relocating to OC.
I'm a midwest transplant(michigan), and I've lived in Orange County for a total of approx 4 years (moved away and came back) So here's my "grounded" perspective.
I see a lot of negative opinions, but people are trying to generalize things too much. here's my take:
1. Stop basing your opinions on shows like "THE OC" Hint: it's not even filmed in orange county.
2. There do tend to be some selfish, self absorbed people in southern california. There are those "plastic people" who strive to pretend to be something they are truly not, and overextend themselves (e.g, making 2k/month and driving an $700/month beamer-see that a lot). there are those who DO actually believe that looking like a movie star will get them everything they want in life, who haven't figured out there are limits to how far looks will get you, and that ultimately no worthwhile person cares what house you live in or what house you drive. That's their problem.
BUT
That is not everyone, and not even the majority. it's small percentage of the overall population who skew people's perceptions. FACT: a lot of people are transplants who bring thier values from where they grew up. FACT: There ARE decent people in OC. You just have to look for them.
3. Cost. It's expensive to live here, and ultimately the differential in cost of living won't be enough if you make a lateral career move. Unless you get a promotion, expect to reduce you standard of living when it comes to housing. If you make 50K in another state, you will make 55K here but housing will be double what you are used to.
BUT: ask yourself what you value- why are you moving here? Is it necessity, or is it the nice weather, the thriving economy and better job opportunities, and the fact you never have to see snow again if you don't wish to? If you value this, then you must pay the premium. Ask yourself how badly you want to be able to run on the beach every morning, watch the sun set on the ocean every weekend, or live in the safest city in the country?
digression: when I moved here, I was paying $500/month rent in the midwest- my new rent in cali: $1100/month. let me tell you, my income certainly didn't double. In fact, it didn't go up enough to even offset the difference in rent. But that's the price you pay. The american dream doesn't get handed to you on a platter, you get off your butt and get it, or stay where you are- it's that simple.
3. Racism: I'm not saying it doesn't exist in california, but tell me where else in the country besides NY you have this much diversity and such racial harmony? I'm white and my wife is Asian. Anyone from the midwest knows how well THAT goes over with the hicks in the midwest and south?. I've NEVER had a racial issue here. If it exists, it's not widespread. IMHO.
4. You get what you pay for. The real estate market IS the highest in the country, but you get what you pay for. You couldn't pay me to live in NY, yet for higher prices than OC, you get bad weather, angry people, and the crowds. It's calfornia with bad weather. Not appealng. At least here you feel like you're getting your money's worth, but it depends again, on your priorities. Once you get a foothold in the real estate market, your property will appreciate realatively fast in comparison to the rest of the country, and you can upgrade. Right now the market's in a slump, so the next year is the perfect time to buy if you're able to. The prices will eventually recover, but right now is the time to get in.
5. To that idiot who relates looks to employability. Get a clue. I'm all for eating healthy, exercise, and living a long life, but unless you work at a gym or you're an actor/model, no one will make that kind of a shallow decision- and if they did, HR would have a field day. "hey, he can't operate a computer or add simple numbers, but since he has rock hard abs, he's in." I'm sure there are those out there who share this opinion, but any relatively intelligent person will laught at that perspective. But thanks for the laugh.
6. Someone talked about the "personal space bubble". I can relate. In the midwest having a house with a huge backyard (1 acre+) is very common and affordable. You NEVER have trouble finding a parking space, and the busiest freeway traffic would never compare to the 405 on a sunday night at 3am. to give you an example, my 35 mile comute in the midwest took 25 minutes(I know, I know)If you are claustrophobic, this will require an adjustment. It's crowded, ,there's less space in general, so you'll be shrinking that bubble considerably. It took me a while to figure out my agitation level was due to this, but one I identified it, I was able to cope. It just takes time, like most new things.
So to sum up:
PROS: weather, beaches, super clean, safety, cultural attractions, economic opportunities
Cons: expensive, crowded, some shallow people, illegal immigrant issues
I've known people who've moved here from the midwest and left because they didn't like it, or couldn't cope. I've stayed because in spite of all it's shortcomings, it's an extremely pleasant place to live, and because for me the business opportunities are plentiful, being that I'm in Information Technology.
Bottom line is this all comes down to you: what you want in life, and what you're willing to sacrifice to get it. If having a huge house is more important than not having to ever feel your fingers go numb again from scraping ice of of your windshield, then OC is not for you. Orange County is ultimately only what you make of it.
TO QUOTE: "SOCAL IS WHERE MY MIND STATES, BUT IT'S NOT MY STATE OF MIND-I'M NOT AS ULGY-SAD AS YOU"
One bad thing about living here and in SoCal are peoples bulls--t attitudes
There are idiots no matter where you go. And the are positives and negatives with every region of the country. Narcissism runs rampant in Orange County. If you're thin skinned, easily jealous, or unable to deal with arrogant,rude, and insensitive people, you'll get frustrated here. If you lived in the south or the midwest, you'd have to deal with racism. People on the east coast have attitudes of thier own. If you want to find a reason not to live somewhere,you probably will.
I have no idea which beach you are going to. I have NEVER had a problem finding a parking space at at any OC beach. I am a surfer and go to the beach ALL the time. You just need to know where to find them. You just can't expect to park right on the beach in downtown Laguna on a 80 degree Saturday! Be realistic. But still park a few blocks down at any beach for FREE and walk. God forbid people walk in OC.. Oh man that would be a sin!
Hm.... some people actually work daytime. Since you state that you go to the beach and surf "all the time", clearly you're not aware of the problems of the working people. This means they can only get to the beach on weekends. It can be a bit tough to get parking on weekends, but of course, with some patience it is possible.
I was a city planner for various OC cities for 5 years. It is a complete mess of cul-de-sacs, super-avenues (8 lanes wide), congestion will not allow you to move about easily, and the people are terribly selfish. There is a lack of culture, besides mall culture. Laguna Beach is nice, but in my five years of living there, I saw it rapidly turn into a retirement village. If you can afford a 2 million dollar house and you are over 65, you will fit into Laguna Beach and love it. The rest of OC is a smog filled disaster, and is gradually getting worse. I also lived in Hollywood/West Hollywood for awhile. I tried to get the urban lifestyle, unfortunately, LA is not urban, although populated. You cannot live an urban life in socal at all. I moved to budapest Hungary and then came back and now live in the Northeast. The cities here seem to be so much nicer, 4 seasons, trains and subways and a higher quality of life. I grew up CA, and remember when CA did offer a laid back life. Socal and especially OC are going to be the most stressfull places you ever lived in. I averaged a 3 hour round trip commute, no matter where I worked. Don't believe MTV, but again, if you are looking to retire and you are a millionaire....by all means, move to Laguna Beach Best wishes.
Its sooo sad! Laguna is such a beautiful place, but the whole charm of the place has been more and more ruined by the rich, the old rich, mind you. First, it was the 'poofs' who gave it charm, then they left. Then the artists started leaving, and couldn't afford it anymore after the city wanted to turn it into 'rich city'. But they are losing out, I think, because they robbed Laguna of its character.
Moderator cut: personal attack Yes it's true that California and Orange County were once the very best of the United States - the finest country in the world.... but those days however are LONG GONE. I could go on and on and on about why Orange County has degenerated so rapidly over the last 10-15 years, but instead I'll be responding to bullet # 8. Perhaps Russel has long-term memory loss. The following website should jog his memory and that of anyone else who questions my common sense and historical understanding of what is going to happen to California - AGAIN.
(I can't wait to make money off the inevitable though... people like Russel are a dime-a-dozen throughout the southland - and oblivious to the overcrowding, overpopulation, over-development, over-saturation of NON-ASSIMILATING minorities - which all just barely begin to scratch at the surface of the demise of the once glorious Orange County. My grandfather who bought in Newport back in 1959 is surely rolling in his grave at the thought of modern-day “OC living.”)
Moderator cut: personal attack I love the OC but there are great places in many countries far better and more beautiful too. The California beaches, though, are amongst the greatest.
How does he know whether America or OC is the best in the world? I can bet that like so many young kids in the U.S. he knows absolutely nothing at all about the existance of the rest of the world, and have spent little, if any, time at all to travel the world and know what he's talking about!
Last edited by gallowsCalibrator; 05-11-2008 at 05:37 PM..
Reason: removed personal attack
Me and my family will be living in SoCAL this summer, and we definatly don't have those horrible attitudes that the natives and the transplants have (nor will we ever). And none of us are plastic either, you just have to bring the right people in and don't encourage that lifestyle. It's all what you make of it.
I read you're thinking of moving to OC from Chicago, and I thought, why would you do that to your family? So I had to get in my 1 cent since I grew up there.
While the cost of OC living would fortunately not bother me (I actually think that at this point I could live almost anywhere in OC for less than what my house is worth here in Chicago, and the cost sounds like it would be relatively comfortable for you as well;as you see here Californians tend to think that they only have the monopoly on expensive real estate, as you know from certain areas in Chicago, it's not true) I could never go back for other reasons; schools for my kids, the change of seasons which I really like, the ease of commuting downtown with the train, the culture, the museums, the midwest people and their values, my wife's family and the cousins they provide for my kids, the Cubs, Northwestern, the Bears, pizza, great restaurants, Michigan Ave in the spring, the lake and skyline.
No May or June gloom, no necessary ridiculous commutes, no laid back mindless store clerks ( or maybe fewer, anyways) , no endless freeways shrouded in smog among aging subdivisions full of ticky tack ranches with brown vegetation, no ostentatious airheads ( or again fewer ) who barely have enough for the gas but drive a Lexus with custom rims, no crowded feeling which one poster said is like mice in a cage, which I agree with. Don't get me wrong, obviously there are pluses to life in So. California, but the pluses have faded over time.
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Best wishes.
Ex OC now happy in Chicago
