Surprised and not in Good Way (Philadelphia, Washington: transfer, public school, vouchers)

[killakoolaide]

Originally Posted by Duderino

I agree completely. If you think about cities like New York, Boston, DC and Chicago back in the 60s/70s/80s, these were not the gleaming, flourishing metropolises that many people consider them today. There is not one major city -- especially in the North -- that suburbanization and deindustrialization did not hit pretty hard. It's just that those cities formed their niche industries in the knowledge economy much quicker in banking, higher education, government and finance, respectively.

Philadelphia is very much on track to follow the urban reinvestment/revitalization trends of the aforementioned cities by really focusing on its higher education, medical and pharmaceutical strengths -- even if it is a little bit late to the game compared to its peers.

Philly is second only to Boston in higher education, and one could even make an argurment for it being tops in Higher education. D.C., New York, and especially Chicago have never been even close to philly in higher education. What keeps Philly viable, despite all of its problems, is that at its heart, it always has been and always will be, a big college town.

What really holds philly back is the level of governmental corruption, and machine politics. You could never have a republican mayor, as New York has had since Guiliani, in modern day Philadelphia. The corruption contributes to the higher levels of crime and poverty. In Philly It's all about who you know (from my experiences anyway), and that provincial mindset of Philly is unattractive to the outside investors who could really help philly out. IMHO former mayor Rendell was the one who saved this city from going the way of Detoit, because in the 80's it was well on its way to becoming just that.

Chicago still has serious crime and poverty issues (due to the same kind of corruption rampant in philly), its just overshadowed by their amazing downtown. Most of D.C.'s problems have been pushed out to P.G. Maryland, due to gentrification. Those cities are currently doing better than philly, but the beauty of Philly is that it doesn't care about what every one else is doing.

[butterscotch12372]

Well when the hell is the gentrification process going to reach the Cobbs Creek area? I say get all of the section 8 people out of the area and send all of the drug dealers who like to kill and shoot each other overseas and bring those good men and women home to their families. Just an unrealistic rant, but what really happened to the good quality of people that I grew up with. When I grew up my neighborhood was black, irish and italian and all of us cared for and took care of our neighborhood. It seems like there all still some areas (very few) that are still like that but I don't think I'll ever see those days again in Philadelphia. Can't wait to move to a decent suburb in pa. Just venting!

[tijlover]

Originally Posted by Duderino

Interesting perspectives from outsiders -- it's always good to get some objective thoughts with people not that familiar with the city.

However, I think the fundamental problem in Philly leading to such a lack of upkeep is something to which cities such as Atlanta -- and definitely San Francisco -- cannot relate: poverty.

Thus, cities like San Francisco can "contain" their dilapidated neighborhoods more simply because they have fewer citizens that lack resources to keep up their properties.

San Fran-Nimby (LOL) has a selfish way of keeping their city so attractive to outsiders: powerful, controlling anti-development, not-in-my-backyard neighborhood groups which makes it an exercise in masochistic futility for any developer to make a housing proposal there.

A developer must first, and foremost, get the approval of the kings and queens of the hills to give blessing to their proposal, and God forbid the building would interfere with their selfish views of the Bay one iota. Then they must consult with those living in the flatter areas of the city, even the myriad number of homeless, to make sure it's not going to block their views of the hills. It would be futile to air the proposal to the mayor or city councilmen before they consult with the true rulers of this city first.

It's a no-brainer why this city is such an expensive place to live. All it takes is some extremely selfish residents with no compassion for the poor to make it happen.

And there are any number of other cities in this country who let their Nimby's rule the city. Minneapolis for one.

I love down-to-earth Philly just the way it is. A refreshing change from the sterility and cleanliness of that Nimby city 75+ miles north of there.

[solibs]

Philadelphia might be a little easier to build in than those other cities but not by much. People tend to forget (or they weren't around to remember) that a lot of decent neighborhoods got wrecked because too many developers and merchants were permitted to do pretty much whatever they wanted.

All it takes is one nuisance bar, one halfway house, one parking garage to demoralize people and suck the life out of a neighborhood.

[niceguy19125]

As a frequent Amtrak passenger between Philly and NYC, it's downright grim to ride through from the minute you hit the Philly line and meander through NE/North Philly onto 30th Street Station. The shear magnitude of decay and abandoned buildings is overwhelming. How can all of that ever be overcome?

[kotter]

Originally Posted by niceguy19125

As a frequent Amtrak passenger between Philly and NYC, it's downright grim to ride through from the minute you hit the Philly line and meander through NE/North Philly onto 30th Street Station. The shear magnitude of decay and abandoned buildings is overwhelming. How can all of that ever be overcome?

Eliminate public housing.

[a75206]

Originally Posted by kotter

Eliminate public housing.

And put a nice big lake there, north of Center City. Right?

[niceguy19125]

Originally Posted by kotter

Eliminate public housing.

It's not public housing, there's little of that left. Stop watching 1970s crime dramas. It's empty industrial buildings...miles of them.

[solibs]

It's actually a little interesting that the Northeast Corridor rolls through the worst part of the city. The Badlands, that whole arc of North Philly, that's bad stuff up there.

Of course, you get much of the same in Baltimore but you're underground for a lot of it too. Same goes for the New York metro.

niceguy pretty much nailed it. The industry attracted to the busiest RR in the country (120 years ago but since abandoned) and all of the dead-end streets created by having such a wide RR right-of-way lend themselves well to decay and crime.

[thekish]

Originally Posted by niceguy19125

It's not public housing, there's little of that left. Stop watching 1970s crime dramas. It's empty industrial buildings...miles of them.

Miles of them in the badlands. Who else is in the badlands and why do they call it the badlands?

There are about 3.5 MILLION people in the burbs and most of them started out in the city. Many of them actually pass through the badlands on the way to work and living in the city would actually be more convenient for them to get to work. Why do you think they choose to live further from work when there are empty buildings that could be bought for peanuts?

The real problem is the hoodrats that already live in the neighborhood. They have pretty much destroyed the neighborhoods and the schools with crime, litter and graffiti. Even middle and upper class blacks do not want to live in those neighborhoods. The first thing EVERY upper class black does when they get enough money is move to white neighborhood. Just look at George Jefferson. WHy do you think Will Smith's mom sent him to live with his auntie in Bel Air?

This week's crime log:
- Flash Mobs
- 15 year old pimps out her 7 year old sister who is d.
- on playground in Gtown
-Woman d and ed in an alley off of Broad
-Woman beats another woman to with hammer in Strawberry Mansion