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Well I just got through a home inspection of a property - house - that I had my heart set on buying.... The list of things to fix was pretty massive. And I don't know what to make of it all.
First - the place has termites.... The subterranean type I'm told. They are along the perimeter of the house - they are in the bedrooms - they are in the living room - all noted by mud tubes etc...tiny holes - and they are in the attic. When I asked about structural damage he said he didn't know. I said you are the inspector - what do you mean you don't know - he said it would take a small bore camera? to look better in the attic... yet he took pics of missing insulation in the attic...
So to me they are EVERYWHERE... There is no grass - just cement and stones in the yard - but the grade goes through rocks to the sidewalk to the house - not the best for drainage eh? So I figure any rains - the water likely ponds near the house - termites love the moisture... the only reason the house isn't trashed from standing water is because of the concrete - maybe the water evaporates and theres no dirt for the moisture to hang out in and seep into structures?
Any treatment to me would seem to be expensive - one owner to the home only since 1986...& can't find a record of any termite treatments... They were an elderly couple that eventually had to leave.
THEN we move on to the roof, the AC, some pool issues, the spa doesn't work at all, the electric needs GFI's everywhere, the garage door opener system is messed up, some windows aren't working right, the toilets are loose causing water damage to the floor - I'm forgetting most of it .... wood fascia issues, gutters need attention...
So as sad as it makes me - I think I'm going to have to just walk on this house. It would take months and months for the termite issue to be settled - then if it's a grade issue - well that's a major overhaul in the yard - the one block wall has water damage in 4 sections - ?likely from the neighbor with perhaps a sprinkler system on those four portions - making the block wall look dark and moist - or rings of white - and crumbling mortar d/t this...
Even if treatment was succesful - we can't say for sure how the termites are getting into the house, right?
If I give the owner a list of what I want fixed - it will be very long! The list of extra inspections I think I'd need:
roof (the second layer roof is damaged)
exterminator company to accurately assess termite damage in the home & attic
heating and cooling (to remove an old evap cooler and fix the current AC)
professional pool people/pool remodel people/pool heating people
electrician
garage door people
plumbing people
contractor to fix wood trim that's falling apart
insulation people for the attic
This is after spending over 400 bucks today for a general inspection.
Can anyone help me with comments on this situation?
If the house only had a few minor things that were easy fixes - I still have to replace all the flooring - paint the entire interior - replace appliances - new toilets and vanities and floor and shower/tub surrounds in 2 bathrooms - just to have the place liveable... This alone is hugely expensive - but to have the news of termites and all the other stuff - I am overwhelmed!
Am I right to walk? I offered the full asking price when the contract was accepted.... If I could stomach the idea of a bad termite infestation in the bedrooms for crying out loud - I would need to ask for a price reduction of about 30K....I'd still come out behind!
Thanks Stokes72 .... My gut is telling me to run - but the realty agent gives the old pep talk of inspections are witch hunts - but rightly so etc... He clearly saw I was sad and overwhelmed at this bad news. I think of course he wishes too things weren't so horrid - but is probably as tired of shopping (3 mos. now) as I am!
I read a bunch of termite infor - some on a forum thing - where a realtor tried to say 40% of Phoenix homes have them - it's not a big deal - blah blah blah - Only to have a lady answer back that the guy was doing a disservice by minimizing this issue as her life had been 'blank on earth' due to AZ termites and one house had to be completely tore down!
I went on the AZ website to find this address - and it doesn't appear to have been ever treated - but homes that had been treated - well they get treated every couple of years!!! So to me that says the problem just keeps coming back!
Ahhh life!
the toilets are loose causing water damage to the floor
Leaking toilets are like Club Med for termites. I don't really understand how a toilet on a slab could be loose. Regardless....
This sounds like a very poorly maintained house. Any one of these complaints in isolation could be dealt with. However, put them all together and the house sounds like it was neglected for many years. Run away screaming.
The termites are probably your least serious problem. They are easy to get rid of and it is unlikely that they have done any structural damage. The other stuff though, not so easy or cheap to fix if you have to hire the work. On the other hand, your agent is right that these inspection reports can often make things sound worse than they really are. It helps to have a background in fix it and DIY otherwise it is hard to judge.
Yeah - I'd think the termite issue is not usually such a huge deal for AZ people - but if this is the first inspection - which it could be - since 1986 - well there could be damage - for it being so long undetected...I'll check the state website again - but I couldn't see any treatments for this property...Lots of holes in the walls of living room, bedroom, outside of house, attic has 'em too...CLUB MED - HAPPY HOUR ... who knew! Floating slab floor doesn't help things either...
The house had a sickly man living there - he ended up passing away... Then his wife bless her heart cannot live alone - just not capable - elderly etc.. So yes years of neglect seems to be the issue...
Yet viewing from the curb it looks absolutely fine - cute actually - same with the backyard ... So to find out all of these major things at once needing action was shocking... Yes I could handle paint, flooring, appliances - the normal small fix-it issues....
I cannot afford a full round two of inspections to get estimates for this seller - know what I mean? I spend all my money - to tell him what it takes to make things right - then he can just say no and not do it! I have a number of further inspection work to do - if I try to hang on to this house - all within the next 9 days..
Has anyone heard of just having the listing agent hand the report to the owner and ask the owner up front to make his decision on what he will or will not address/fix? It'd be a heck of a lot cheaper - rather than me getting a roofer, an AC guy, a pool guy - the list goes on!
You guys are amazing at helping me 'handle' this disappointment - thanks so much!
I'd consider buying it still if the seller gave me a new roof, a removal of the old evap cooler on the roof while they are up there, termite treatment and a 5 year warranty on it, a new AC unit if the 'noise' is a problem (the inspector could only guess what the worst issues were causing noise), upgraded electric to current code, did outside wood, gutter, replacement/fix, addressed the block wall problem, fixed the pool's spa & tile issues...
I could do the fixing of or replacing of windows, flooring, toilets, garage door (<--- ONLY because my dad invented the garage door opener LOL)
Last edited by SloCoChef; 08-10-2011 at 09:37 PM..
My opinion is to run away. Way too many freaking problems. Cha-ching, cha-ching, how fat is your wallet? Go do something fun, get a good night's sleep, and tomorrow morning come back to this thread and read all the problems you listed with the house. Sure, inspectors can flag things that really don't matter, but my lord woman, read what you wrote!
The termite damage is probably minimal because the termites here will eat the paper from the back of sheetrock. They don't limit themselves to wood. They also have to go back into the ground often for moisture. It takes a long time for them to do damage.
However, your description tells me there are a lot of termites and they may have been there for a long time, so the damage may not be minimal.
The treatment will cost a minimum of $700 with at one year warranty.
Your contract probably gives you 10 days due diligence period, which mean s you will need to cancel the contract within that 10 day period, if you cancel.
The inspection is to discover things that you wouldn't know about by your visual inspection. And of course if a lot of things are discovered, such as was here, then it's good insurance.
The Realtor will give you a BINSR to fill out, and will explain it to you.
In that form you can elect to cancel the contract, or give the seller the opportunity to fix the items.
Anything that is a warranty item (see your contract) the seller must fix.
Other things that are not a warranty item, the seller does not have to fix.
You list all the items that are warranty items in the proper section.
Then list all the non warranty items in the proper section.
It's up to the seller to get prices to fix the items that she is going to fix. You don't have to do that. Also you don't pay to get quotes on prices. You get a contractor to give a bid on fixing the items that you will be fixing yourself.
After receiving the BINSR the seller has choices:
Agree to fix some of all of the non warranty items
Refuse to fix some or all of the non warranty items
Next you have a choice of accepting what the seller won't fix, or cancel the contract.
Your Realtor will explain all of that in detail.
However, from what I hear you saying and the way I seem to read what you're feeling, you may be better off to just cancel.
Thank you - I see things much more clearly through YOUR eyes - Captain and everyone else thank you so much! Realty agent guy didn't mention the reports to me yet - so thanks for sharing that... I did write him this a.m. -- Pretty much told him that if it's determined there is structural damage from the extensive coverage of the termites dining quarters in all house rooms...deals off. Otherwise if the owner wanted to fix absolutely everything - and give me a new roof, AC, pool spa/heater.....fix the property grading issues - if he did it all - I'm in. That's probably laughable but I want it ALL for the full asking price I offered for purchase....
If the seller says he'll only fix the things per the report you mentioned BINSR.... Then I would suggest he lower his price by 30K.....
Two other 'hints' as to the hidden disasters within the property - One was the next door neighbor - who is the listing agent! Her body language and facial expressions during the read-out of the inspection showed clear distress lol.... Same with my agent to a certain degree -- too funny. I was the 'strong' one who proceeded with some measure of poise (once home did a shot of tequila)...
This morning I noticed he'd written about the pool decking having buckled, shifted, heaved due to two reasons - one a gigantic palm tree - and the other idea was expansive soil.........okay girl scream ensued. Is that why huge rocks are placed 3 feet deep all the way around the perimeter of the property? Is this a dream/nightmare? What planet am I on anyway?
Any treatment to me would seem to be expensive - one owner to the home only since 1986...& can't find a record of any termite treatments... They were an elderly couple that eventually had to leave.
THEN we move on to the roof, the AC, some pool issues, the spa doesn't work at all, the electric needs GFI's everywhere, the garage door opener system is messed up, some windows aren't working right, the toilets are loose causing water damage to the floor - I'm forgetting most of it .... wood fascia issues, gutters need attention...
Hokay... not trying to minimize things too much, but...
Other than the termites -(which can be treated) and the roof (which CAN be repaired)... loose toilets? GFCI's? Sticky windows?... those are $10 repairs - home inspectors give themselves a bad name when they don't put things into context. They don't usually have actual knowledge of any specific trade, only the ability to tell you to call an expert...
I personally don't use inspectors for my own purchases - I go straight to the actual experts in the field - I have an A/C guy check the a/c ($75 - & he includes minor repairs for that price, like adding a little refrigerant or taping loose wires), a termite guy (~$40 if I don't need a "cert"), a roofer ($0 to check a roof) - I wouldn't own an old pool even if you were paying for it, but I'm certain you could have a "pool guy" check out a pool for not a lot of dough...
You likely already knew the roof, a/c and pool were old. Pools need re-plastering every so often, pumps wear out, and pipes & valves crack every single season. Roofs need to be inspected & tarred every couple of years here, and a/c systems need loving all the time, because we abuse them for six months at a time.
"Grading" sounds like a terrible problem, until you actually talk to the guys who move dirt for a living - my bobcat guy charges ~$50 an hour, and if you hire him for a whole day he can completely transform a yard - or scoop the whole darn thing up and cart it away...
If you do decide to go ahead with this deal, feel free to pm me, and I'll send you the list of contractors I've used over the past couple of years - skilled labor is not expensive in AZ right now.
A last thing to note-a knowledgeable agent would likely have pointed out the age of the roof, and the a/c BEFORE letting you write an offer - there's a disclosure statement that's required by law to be filled out by the seller that's usually attached right to the listing in the mls (on a normal sale, not shorts, flips or lender-owned properties, in those cases they all plead ignorance).
Last edited by Zippyman; 08-11-2011 at 11:08 AM..
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I don't really understand how a toilet on a slab could be loose. Regardless....
