What is pittsburgh? midwest or northeast or...Other??? (Indiana, Rochester: fit in, transplants)

[Tinare]

Originally Posted by srsmn

Ok....so....I'm pretty confident that I got a MUCH better education in Minnesota than you did in Pennsylvania (or wherever)

Originally Posted by srsmn

Pittsburgh's the "Gateway to the West"? That's a new one...

Apparently the history curriculum was greatly lacking.

[wanderlust76]

Actually the old towns along National Road route 40 such as Cumberland, MD, Uniontown, PA and then Wheeling were considered the gateway to the west but Pittsburgh definitely was part of that as well throughout history. It can't emphatically be called the one and only official gateway to the west though. Route 40 was the first road to run east to west for hundreds of miles. Fort Henry was partially built by men from Fort Pitt and at the time it was the new frontier. The Ohio River was always extremely important in relation to the Atlantic coast and the Baltimore/D.C. area. Eventually the modern day I70 was built that goes from Baltimore to Denver. I wrote papers on all of this stuff in skool.

[Herodotus]

Originally Posted by wanderlust76

Actually the old towns along National Road route 40 such as Cumberland, MD, Uniontown, PA and then Wheeling were considered the gateway to the west but Pittsburgh definitely was part of that as well throughout history. It can't emphatically be called the one and only official gateway to the west though. Route 40 was the first road to run east to west for hundreds of miles. Fort Henry was partially built by men from Fort Pitt and at the time it was the new frontier. The Ohio River was always extremely important in relation to the Atlantic coast and the Baltimore/D.C. area. Eventually the modern day I70 was built that goes from Baltimore to Denver. I wrote papers on all of this stuff in skool.

There were many Gateways To The West. These varied with regard to time, and to the origins, and destinations of those heading west. If you were coming from NY, or New England, Buffalo played that role. That said, St. Louis is without doubt, the place that holds the greatest claim to that title, as it served for many years as the key jumping off point for travelers heading into the true American West.

[srsmn]

Originally Posted by doo dah

Folks, I give you "Minnesota Nice".

I guess I spent too much time living in Pittsburgh

[srsmn]

Ok, so...to those calling me out on my "Gateway to the West" comment:

I was mostly just being catty because of my less-than-productive conversation with Katiana. I actually consider Pittsburgh to be the original American city, in a lot of ways (lots of people say Cincinnati is, but I'd contend Pittsburgh). Pittsburgh essentially exists because of the French and Indian War, a conflict in which colonists primarily participated. Pittsburgh's official founding (1792) coincides nicely with the birth of the nation. And I understand that Pittsburgh-- at the headwaters of the Ohio-- was an important starting point for river traffic.

The ethos of my comment, though, is that if you ask most people-- like, 99% of them-- where the "Gateway to the West" is, they'll say St. Louis. You can make an argument for Omaha or Kansas City, too...some people might say Cincinnati or even Chicago. Some would even say St. Paul. But St. Louis definitely has the most thoroughly staked claim on "Gateway to the West," so let's not pretend like it's a nickname that Pittsburgh really claims, or something that it's historically that famous for.

Personally, I think the Gateway to the West is probably actually Rock Island. That's where the first rail crossing of the Mississippi was, and if you know the history, you also know that Rock Island was essential in establishing Chicago as the preeminent "Western" market over St. Louis (to spare a lot of the details, a steamboat crashed into the bridge, St. Louis's elite sued the railroad company, the RR won (with Abraham Lincoln acting as an attorney on the defense team) and this precipitated the land-grant system that RR companies still enjoy, and the opening of the West to transcontinental traval).

[srsmn]

Originally Posted by Tinare

Apparently the history curriculum was greatly lacking.

I guess I deserve that

Although, I did earn a Bachelor's Degree in History. Ask me anything about Richmond, VA in the Reconstruction Era. I dare you. I wrote a capstone on it

[Herodotus]

Originally Posted by srsmn

Ok, so...to those calling me out on my "Gateway to the West" comment:

I was mostly just being catty because of my less-than-productive conversation with Katiana. I actually consider Pittsburgh to be the original American city, in a lot of ways (lots of people say Cincinnati is, but I'd contend Pittsburgh). Pittsburgh essentially exists because of the French and Indian War, a conflict in which colonists primarily participated. Pittsburgh's official founding (1792) coincides nicely with the birth of the nation. And I understand that Pittsburgh-- at the headwaters of the Ohio-- was an important starting point for river traffic.

The ethos of my comment, though, is that if you ask most people-- like, 99% of them-- where the "Gateway to the West" is, they'll say St. Louis. You can make an argument for Omaha or Kansas City, too...some people might say Cincinnati or even Chicago. Some would even say St. Paul. But St. Louis definitely has the most thoroughly staked claim on "Gateway to the West," so let's not pretend like it's a nickname that Pittsburgh really claims, or something that it's historically that famous for.

Personally, I think the Gateway to the West is probably actually Rock Island. That's where the first rail crossing of the Mississippi was, and if you know the history, you also know that Rock Island was essential in establishing Chicago as the preeminent "Western" market over St. Louis (to spare a lot of the details, a steamboat crashed into the bridge, St. Louis's elite sued the railroad company, the RR won (with Abraham Lincoln acting as an attorney on the defense team) and this precipitated the land-grant system that RR companies still enjoy, and the opening of the West to transcontinental traval).

Cincy is the first American city. The first major city founded after the revolution, and the first true boomtown located away from the coast.

Pittsburgh was officially founded in 1758, although you could legitimately claim 1754 as it's founding date, and George Washington as it's founder. Pittsburgh was the last major American city, founded by the British. St. Louis dates to 1764, but was founded by the French.

[srsmn]

Originally Posted by Herodotus

Cincy is the first American city. The first major city founded after the revolution, and the first true boomtown located away from the coast.

Pittsburgh was officially founded in 1758, although you could legitimately claim 1754 as it's founding date, and George Washington as it's founder. Pittsburgh was the last major American city, founded by the British. St. Louis dates to 1764, but was founded by the French.

I was looking at incorporation dates (1794 for the borough of Pittsburgh predates Cincinnati). You are right, though, Pittsburgh was chartered and founded long before that.

In honesty, though, I don't consider Pittsburgh to be "founded by the British," certainly not in the sense that Boston or Baltimore were. Pittsburgh really wasn't a colonial effort on the part of the British Empire....Pittsburgh grew because American colonists-- many of them soldiers or soldiers' families-- came west from the Eastern Seaboard, really in the first great wave of American pioneering. Cincy was founded by American Revolutionaries after the War, in much the same way that Pittsburgh grew after the Point was taken from the French in the French and Indian War. I believe that the French and Indian War was the first truly "American" military conflict, hence my contention that Pittsburgh is the first real American city...

[SammyKhalifa]

Yeah, I'd probably consider it as the beginning of the "Second Wave" of settlements of sort.

[Katarina Witt]

Originally Posted by srsmn

Whoa....ad hominums are fun...

Ok....so....I'm pretty confident that I got a MUCH better education in Minnesota than you did in Pennsylvania (or wherever), since the experts have been ranking Minnesota's education system at or very near the top every year for oh, the past thirty years or so....so let's address the rest of your post:

From a Midwesterner's perspective, Denver is not in the Midwest. I repeat, Denver is not in the Midwest.

From a Midwesterner's perspective, Denver is in the mountains. I know you have that cute little plain and foothills and whatever, but let's be honest, if you're that close to the mountains, you're in them. At least, if you ask a Midwesterner. Not everybody would say Pittsburgh is in the mountains either, but if you're coming from Minnesota or Illinois....those are mountains, plain and simple.

From a Midwesterner's perspective, Pittsburgh is not in the Midwest either.

How do I know this? I'm actually from the Midwest, unlike everybody else on this thread (thus far).

I'm unclear on why your Denver friends want to be in the Midwest so bad that they delude themselves into thinking they are, but...yeah...they're not. They're just not, and....sorry, I guess?

You didn't get a great geography education if you think Denver is in the mountains. Period. I don't care how high MN is supposedly ranked in education, and by gosh, they think they're the best in everything, have the "only" this, that, the other, Denver is not in the mountains.

Is Denver in the Rocky Mountains?

Originally Posted by Herodotus

There were many Gateways To The West. These varied with regard to time, and to the origins, and destinations of those heading west. If you were coming from NY, or New England, Buffalo played that role. That said, St. Louis is without doubt, the place that holds the greatest claim to that title, as it served for many years as the key jumping off point for travelers heading into the true American West.

Also Omaha.

Originally Posted by srsmn

Ok, so...to those calling me out on my "Gateway to the West" comment:

I was mostly just being catty because of my less-than-productive conversation with Katiana. I actually consider Pittsburgh to be the original American city, in a lot of ways (lots of people say Cincinnati is, but I'd contend Pittsburgh). Pittsburgh essentially exists because of the French and Indian War, a conflict in which colonists primarily participated. Pittsburgh's official founding (1792) coincides nicely with the birth of the nation. And I understand that Pittsburgh-- at the headwaters of the Ohio-- was an important starting point for river traffic.

The ethos of my comment, though, is that if you ask most people-- like, 99% of them-- where the "Gateway to the West" is, they'll say St. Louis. You can make an argument for Omaha or Kansas City, too...some people might say Cincinnati or even Chicago. Some would even say St. Paul. But St. Louis definitely has the most thoroughly staked claim on "Gateway to the West," so let's not pretend like it's a nickname that Pittsburgh really claims, or something that it's historically that famous for.

Personally, I think the Gateway to the West is probably actually Rock Island. That's where the first rail crossing of the Mississippi was, and if you know the history, you also know that Rock Island was essential in establishing Chicago as the preeminent "Western" market over St. Louis (to spare a lot of the details, a steamboat crashed into the bridge, St. Louis's elite sued the railroad company, the RR won (with Abraham Lincoln acting as an attorney on the defense team) and this precipitated the land-grant system that RR companies still enjoy, and the opening of the West to transcontinental traval).

Is everything that happens on this forum my fault? Good grief!