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The issue I see is, What are these voter ID laws actually doing as far as ensuring the intergrety of the voting system?
As I said, Hawai'i imposed a voter ID but it it is to ensure the intergety of the Hawai'i voting system. That ensures that voters are leaglly 18 or over. It ensures that the voter is a US citizen eligable to vote. AND, the main purpose is to ensure that the person voting has the legal right to vote in that Hawai'i election district. The last item is something US giovernement identifications do not do and that is why on Hawai'i, your passport or militray ID or anything like that is not enought and you must have pre-verified your residency or prove it at time of voting.
I think many voter ID laws really will not prevent fraud on the scale they could because the focus is on "illegals" voting or keeping certain classes from voting. Like on Hawaii'i, the greatest number of illegal fraudulent voters were military or wealthy ping-pongers. That is why the so called right-wing, or conservatives, or reprublicans, or whatever you want to call them are the vocal group against hHwai'i's voter ID law because it makes no illusion as to who the fraud voters are and it makes sure the core reason needed for ID is being addressed by the ID requirment.
It also has no political message attached and that is hard for many to understand. I mean how can you sday a US Passport isn;t good enough to establish your rightt o vote? The answer is it proves only your a us citizen of age and not that you legal reside within the election district your voting. That is the part of Hawai'i's law that reduces the fraud that really occurs in elctrions all over the US. Think about it, you register to vote in Missisipi, go to Alabama and resigeter, how does those two states know your regiostered soemwhgere else? Or you live and reside in Texas but registered to vote in Hawai'i because you stay there there in Sept - November. So yuo walk into a Hawaii polling place after registering and show your passport for ID, is that supposed to be enough? Whats to stop you from doing a mail in ballot in an election in TX at the same time? truth si, that is such a common voter fraud and occurs probably 1,00,00 times to everytime some ilegal alien voted. yet the emphasis is on the us citizenship not the legality to be voting where they are voting. Fortunetely, on Hawai'i, thats what is being addresses so they are doing everything to catch these fraudulent voters.
Actually, the reason Hawaii's voter ID law has not been challenged is because they are not subject to the VRA. That's why you only see Southern states being challenged by the DOJ. That's the rub, really. The Southern states didn't dream this up...it's simply become a supposed discrimination thing because Southern states have started passing these laws as well.
You all realize how rediculous this whole voter ID thing is right?
Come on people, let's put on our thinking caps for just one
minutes.
To commit in person voter fraud, which is what this whole stupid
thing is about, ONE must
1. Show up at voter polls and pretend to be a registered
voter using his or her legal address.
2. Know when the voter is going to show up that they are
impersonating, so they don't show up right after the real
person.
3. Risk being charged with a Federal Voitng Fraud charge which
carries a 5 year prison sentence.
So, who do you think is going to do this?
Really? Who will risk a 5 year prison sentence to
IMPERSONATE a registered voter?
Do you see how ridiculous this whole thing is?
What a stupid law, a waste of time, trying to
drive a bigger wedge between Americans who I can't
believe are really falling for this load of crap.
Location: Just transplanted to FL from the N GA mountains
3,997 posts, read 4,145,129 times
Reputation: 2677
Quote:
Originally Posted by PacificFlights
The issue I see is, What are these voter ID laws actually doing as far as ensuring the intergrety of the voting system?
As I said, Hawai'i imposed a voter ID but it it is to ensure the intergety of the Hawai'i voting system. That ensures that voters are leaglly 18 or over. It ensures that the voter is a US citizen eligable to vote. AND, the main purpose is to ensure that the person voting has the legal right to vote in that Hawai'i election district. The last item is something US giovernement identifications do not do and that is why on Hawai'i, your passport or militray ID or anything like that is not enought and you must have pre-verified your residency or prove it at time of voting.
I think many voter ID laws really will not prevent fraud on the scale they could because the focus is on "illegals" voting or keeping certain classes from voting. Like on Hawaii'i, the greatest number of illegal fraudulent voters were military or wealthy ping-pongers. That is why the so called right-wing, or conservatives, or reprublicans, or whatever you want to call them are the vocal group against hHwai'i's voter ID law because it makes no illusion as to who the fraud voters are and it makes sure the core reason needed for ID is being addressed by the ID requirment.
It also has no political message attached and that is hard for many to understand. I mean how can you sday a US Passport isn;t good enough to establish your rightt o vote? The answer is it proves only your a us citizen of age and not that you legal reside within the election district your voting. That is the part of Hawai'i's law that reduces the fraud that really occurs in elctrions all over the US. Think about it, you register to vote in Missisipi, go to Alabama and resigeter, how does those two states know your regiostered soemwhgere else? Or you live and reside in Texas but registered to vote in Hawai'i because you stay there there in Sept - November. So yuo walk into a Hawaii polling place after registering and show your passport for ID, is that supposed to be enough? Whats to stop you from doing a mail in ballot in an election in TX at the same time? truth si, that is such a common voter fraud and occurs probably 1,00,00 times to everytime some ilegal alien voted. yet the emphasis is on the us citizenship not the legality to be voting where they are voting. Fortunetely, on Hawai'i, thats what is being addresses so they are doing everything to catch these fraudulent voters.
Excellent post.. and one that needs to be addressed. We have sort of a similar situation, being FL residents, yet traveling as we do... Heck I lived in 5 different states last year. I guess I could have legally gone down and registered to vote in each one? Then, being a traveler, I could request an absentee ballot and vote 6 times. Once in each of my "lived in states" and of course my home state of FL. HHHmmm.. wonder if they would question my FL drivers license or if they'd just take the... I just moved here and haven't changed my license yet reason? Food for thought...
You all realize how rediculous this whole voter ID thing is right?
Come on people, let's put on our thinking caps for just one
minutes.
To commit in person voter fraud, which is what this whole stupid
thing is about, ONE must
1. Show up at voter polls and pretend to be a registered
voter using his or her legal address.
2. Know when the voter is going to show up that they are
impersonating, so they don't show up right after the real
person.
3. Risk being charged with a Federal Voitng Fraud charge which
carries a 5 year prison sentence.
So, who do you think is going to do this?
Really? Who will risk a 5 year prison sentence to
IMPERSONATE a registered voter?
Do you see how ridiculous this whole thing is?
What a stupid law, a waste of time, trying to
drive a bigger wedge between Americans who I can't
believe are really falling for this load of crap.
A guy registered his dog. It went through. There is no verification on voter registration. He made up a birth date and an SS and got issued a card.
What's preventing people from doing that ?
http://articles.nydailynews.com/2012...voting-process
“I made up a birthdate and I made up a Social Security number, and I had a voter registration card in my hand for Buddy two weeks later,” he told the TV station after receiving the card in the mail on Wednesday.
A guy registered his dog. It went through. There is no verification on voter registration. He made up a birth date and an SS and got issued a card.
What's preventing people from doing that ?
Man registers dog to vote to test system - New York Daily News
“I made up a birthdate and I made up a Social Security number, and I had a voter registration card in my hand for Buddy two weeks later,†he told the TV station after receiving the card in the mail on Wednesday.
Not to mention, illegals used to do that all the time before e-verify came along in order to work. Or they would buy a SSN from a prisoner. That was a common practice. My husband is a landscaper and would see these types of scams all the the time. It wasn't until e-verify that he could actually protect himself and ensure he was only hiring legals.
You all realize how rediculous this whole voter ID thing is right?
Come on people, let's put on our thinking caps for just one
minutes.
To commit in person voter fraud, which is what this whole stupid
thing is about, ONE must
1. Show up at voter polls and pretend to be a registered
voter using his or her legal address.
2. Know when the voter is going to show up that they are
impersonating, so they don't show up right after the real
person.
3. Risk being charged with a Federal Voitng Fraud charge which
carries a 5 year prison sentence.
So, who do you think is going to do this?
Really? Who will risk a 5 year prison sentence to
IMPERSONATE a registered voter?
Do you see how ridiculous this whole thing is?
What a stupid law, a waste of time, trying to
drive a bigger wedge between Americans who I can't
believe are really falling for this load of crap.
1. Pick an address from the phone book or while driving by.
2. Register to vote in a fictitious name at the same address.
3. Show up at the poll and vote.
This method is extremely difficult to detect. I could theoretically have my vote counted four or five times just by registering in precincts all around me. I could vote in person easily.
Actually, the reason Hawaii's voter ID law has not been challenged is because they are not subject to the VRA. That's why you only see Southern states being challenged by the DOJ. That's the rub, really. The Southern states didn't dream this up...it's simply become a supposed discrimination thing because Southern states have started passing these laws as well.
No, Hawai'i's law has never been challenged because there is absolutely nothing in the law that can be challenegd for any legitimate reason. Hawai's ensures that the person voting is infact legally allowed to vote, legally allowed to vote in that district and their identity is shown to be who they say they are. There is NO REQUIEMENT that that be done only via a goverment issued photo identification card. You can have your Auntie who everyone at the voting place knows is Auntie and she can vouch for your identity so long as the evidence can not be disputed. The requirment is that you prove your identity and right to vote IN THAT POLLING PLACE, something not all governmenet issued id cards can do. Being over 18 does not prove you have the legal right to vote in that polling place. Being able to prove you are a US Citizen does not prove you have the legal right to vote in that polling place. You need to prove your legal right to vote as a Hawai'i resident in that polling place and that you are infact yourself. Is that what these other laws are doing or is it all just a political ball for soundbites and voter woeing, with no real protection to the voter system?
If I needed a copy of my birth cert it would cost $35 and take 3-4 weeks to get. For people to say it's nothing to get the documents you need for State ID, you spread BS.
No, Hawai'i's law has never been challenged because there is absolutely nothing in the law that can be challenegd for any legitimate reason. Hawai's ensures that the person voting is infact legally allowed to vote, legally allowed to vote in that district and their identity is shown to be who they say they are. There is NO REQUIEMENT that that be done only via a goverment issued photo identification card. You can have your Auntie who everyone at the voting place knows is Auntie and she can vouch for your identity so long as the evidence can not be disputed. The requirment is that you prove your identity and right to vote IN THAT POLLING PLACE, something not all governmenet issued id cards can do. Being over 18 does not prove you have the legal right to vote in that polling place. Being able to prove you are a US Citizen does not prove you have the legal right to vote in that polling place. You need to prove your legal right to vote as a Hawai'i resident in that polling place and that you are infact yourself. Is that what these other laws are doing or is it all just a political ball for soundbites and voter woeing, with no real protection to the voter system?
I can't speak for every state, but for South Carolina, that's precisely what they're trying to do. The rationale for the Voter ID in SC is that the correct voter, at the correct age, and at the correct precinct votes. That's it. That's why I haven't really gotten the huge hubbub over it all. Using a state issued ID is simply a method to ensure uniformity.
Of course there's no fraud. They don't verify anything.
Look at that guy that registered his dog to vote.
He only got caught because he spoke up.
If you're NOT checking you'll never find anything wrong.
Sure, Mikey Mouse can be REGISTERED but not show up to vote. Nobody has shown that actual voter fraud is a problem. The issue is suppressing real voters so the GOP can win elections. They intend to keep five million real voters from voting and, it seems, GOP apologists have no problem with that. It's all about your side winning.
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