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Obama was, is, and will always be the problem. The debt ceiling is just the next opportunity for him to show just how stupid the people are who voted for him. You going to the party?
It took 230 years to go from 3.9 million to 320 million in population. It took 230 years for average incomes to go from about $100 a year to ~$60,000 a year.
Next, Obama didn't create the deficits. Had McCain won in 2008, those deficits would be about the same. The economic downturn created those deficits, not anything Mr. Obama did.
I feel like a professor teaching the same material to the same students who aren't paying attention.
Whats the population have to do with the debt, other than the fact that it proves liberal policies are unsubstainable.
Furthermore, whats the average income of person A, have to do with the debt of the federal government?
Its like discussing apples, on a discussion of international affairs. Pretty soon, people tune you out because its obvious you dont know what the hell you're talking about.
Tell me why do you keep posting charts that have already been proven wrong? Maybe its the teacher that needs to learn something rather than you repeating nonsense thats laughable.
Actually Bush managed to spend as much as the nation had spent in 240 years before him. Yes, it was irresponsible considering the fact that we were riding on good economic times and there was absolutely no need reason for it. The money was spent on handouts: unfunded tax cuts, massive expansion of medicare, no-bid contracts, and corporate welware. The need for emergency spending didn't kick in until 2008, which is when the current policies were started.
What I am seeing now is GOP and WH agreeing on some significant ideas, and that should be a good start.
What the hell are you talking about? Why is it no liberal has a dam clue..
Dont remember 911, and the recessions, and the need to bail out the airline industry because the economy was crashing?
Hey Finn, if the tax cuts caused the problems, then why the hell did revenues climb?
Those "pretty pictures" represent numbers and facts (something people who blurt out mere opinions lack.)
But I guess you missed the overall point, namely, when one says that Bush lowered taxes and revenue went up, one has to look at the numbers. What the numbers say is that revenue immediate went down and coincidentally years later went up. Then one has to ask, "was that revenue years later due to those tax-cuts?" To answer that question, one has to look at other factors happening at the same time. What were those facts? One was inflation and another was population growth. So, removing those factors gives us a view of what the tax-cuts alone did. When we do remove those factors we see revenue did not rise due to the tax-cuts and would likely be far higher if they didn't lower taxes.
Really, anyone can make assertions about what happened but only looking at it the way a scientist would look at it yields the truth.
Whether Obama was president went certain things happened doesn't mean he was responsible for those things happening -- no more than Bush, who was President on 9/11/01 is responsible for the terrorist attack.
First, most of the data is a projection so it's not fact.
Second, the largest piece is the Bush-era tax cuts. Only Bush has been gone for four years. And Obama fought tooth and nail to extend them.
When you claim that revenue went up because there were tax-cuts, but the increase in revenue was really due to increases in the population and inflation, that's a lie.
Those "pretty pictures" represent numbers and facts (something people who blurt out mere opinions lack.)
Those pretty pictures, represent liberal stupidity and their inability to face reality.. The only thing more surprising that you guys dont understand economics, is the fact that you arent embarassed to continue posting them, while you whine that no one listens to you.. haha
Not satisfied with causing America's first ever credit downgrade, Republicans are once again threatening to sabotage our national economy by forcing the United States into a voluntary default on its debts if they don't get their way in making draconian cuts to popular social programs like Social Security and Medicare.
The debt ceiling was raised 18 times under Reagan and 7 times under Bush. It has never been a political issue. Everyone understands that playing with America's credit is a dangerous gambit that leaves no winners... but apparently not today's Tea Party run Congress. The money needed from the ceiling raise is to service debt already incurred by Congress. By refusing to raise the ceiling, Congress is basically saying they will not pay the bills they already racked up. That's like going on a shopping spree with your credit card then simply refusing to pay the bill when it comes. Just as that would have disastrous consequences for your personal credit, so would not raising the debt ceiling have disastrous consequences on the credit rating of the United States of America.
That is why I support the President in using whatever options available to him under the Constitution to preserve the full faith and credit of the United States of America. This includes employing the 14th Amendment and ignore the ceiling or minting the Platinum coin. America MUST repay her debts. The fact that this is even a debate shows just how crazy today's Republicans are. What part of conservative principles include not paying your debts?
step 1, enforce the requirement that the senate pass a budget?
What the hell are you talking about? Dont remember 911, and the recessions, and the need to bail out the airline industry because the economy was crashing?
It's nice to have an excuse, but it doesn't change the facts.
"The need to bail out industries....." So, now we should bail out industries whenever someone thinks there is a need for it. I guess this line of thinking was the problem with many liberal Bush supporters such as yourself.
Last edited by Finn_Jarber; 01-10-2013 at 05:43 AM..
It took 230 years to go from 3.9 million to 320 million in population. It took 230 years for average incomes to go from about $100 a year to ~$60,000 a year.
Next, Obama didn't create the deficits. Had McCain won in 2008, those deficits would be about the same. The economic downturn created those deficits, not anything Mr. Obama did.
I feel like a professor teaching the same material to the same students who aren't paying attention.
People tend to ignore lies. Unless you're a democrat. Then you believe whatever the msm tells you to believe.
What the hell are you talking about? Why is it no liberal has a dam clue..
Dont remember 911, and the recessions, and the need to bail out the airline industry because the economy was crashing?
Hey Finn, if the tax cuts caused the problems, then why the hell did revenues climb?
You are correct.
Follow this exchange......from dem debate in 2008 It is absolute proof of obama's "fairness" ideology trumps the truth.
You lefties can simply ignore this....it's above your mental capacity.
GIBSON: All right. You have, however, said you would favor an increase in the capital gains tax. As a matter of fact, you said on CNBC, and I quote, "I certainly would not go above what existed under Bill Clinton," which was 28 percent. It's now 15 percent. That's almost a doubling, if you went to 28 percent.
But actually, Bill Clinton, in 1997, signed legislation that dropped the capital gains tax to 20 percent. OBAMA: Right. GIBSON: And George Bush has taken it down to 15 percent. OBAMA: Right. GIBSON:And in each instance, when the rate dropped, revenues from the tax increased; the government took in more money. And in the 1980s, when the tax was increased to 28 percent, the revenues went down.
So why raise it at all, especially given the fact that 100 million people in this country own stock and would be affected? OBAMA:Well, Charlie, what I've said is that I would look at raising the capital gains tax for purposes of fairness.
We saw an article today which showed that the top 50 hedge fund managers made $29 billion last year -- $29 billion for 50 individuals. And part of what has happened is that those who are able to work the stock market and amass huge fortunes on capital gains are paying a lower tax rate than their secretaries. That's not fair.
And what I want is not oppressive taxation. I want businesses to thrive, and I want people to be rewarded for their success. But what I also want to make sure is that our tax system is fair and that we are able to finance health care for Americans who currently don't have it and that we're able to invest in our infrastructure and invest in our schools.
And you can't do that for free. OBAMA: And you can't take out a credit card from the Bank of China in the name of our children and our grandchildren, and then say that you're cutting taxes, which is essentially what John McCain has been talking about.
And that is irresponsible. I believe in the principle that you pay as you go. And, you know, you don't propose tax cuts, unless you are closing other tax breaks for individuals. And you don't increase spending, unless you're eliminating some spending or you're finding some new revenue. That's how we got an additional $4 trillion worth of debt under George Bush. That is helping to undermine our economy. And it's going to change when I'm president of the United States. GIBSON: But history shows that when you drop the capital gains tax, the revenues go up. OBAMA: Well, that might happen, or it might not. It depends on what's happening on Wall Street and how business is going. I think the biggest problem that we've got on Wall Street right now is the fact that we got have a housing crisis that this president has not been attentive to and that it took John McCain three tries before he got it right.
And if we can stabilize that market, and we can get credit flowing again, then I think we'll see stocks do well. And once again, I think we can generate the revenue that we need to run this government and hopefully to pay down some of this debt.
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So, now we should bail out industries whenever someone thinks there is a need for it. I guess this line of thinking was the problem with many liberal Bush supporters such as yourself.
