Draconian Gun Legislation Proposed (drugs, politicians, money, abuse)

[Senno]

Originally Posted by yeahthatguy

Talk about nutbag govt., please refer to the 2nd amendment. It's funny that you think some clown bags in federal govt. can ignore the constitution.. Not challenge the merits of the 2nd amendment right and draft idiotic gun laws and invoke supremacy clause and roll into states and do as they please.

The only reason most states comply w/ a lot of federal laws is because the federal govt. uses a loophole to threaten to withhold funding to states that do not comply. States have an immense amount of power and can resist a great number of federal legislations.

If you think otherwise, I suggest you read about the laws that govern this country and pick up a history book.

No less an august constituionalist as Antonin Scalia said that the 2nd amendment may be regulated. The fight is over how much to regulate.

Resist away but they will lose in court.

http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/project...preemption.htm

A little blurb on the Supremacy Clause as you seem to believe that States can draft gun legislation outlawing feds from enforcing federal laws.

Originally Posted by Gentoo

It's sort of the same thing that is happening with the legalization of pot and to a lesser extent the now infamous AZ immigration law.

Arizonas law was gutted. The feds still raid here in CA ya know. Just not that much. They don't have the resources to police CA that completely. But arrest a fed for enforcing federal gun laws and watch out.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by Senno

No less an august constituionalist as Antonin Scalia said that the 2nd amendment may be regulated. The fight is over how much to regulate.

Resist away but they will lose in court.



Arizonas law was gutted. The feds still raid here in CA ya know. Just not that much. They don't have the resources to police CA that completely. But arrest a fed for enforcing federal gun laws and watch out.

They still raid and CA is ill equipped to fight them on it. Now you have WA and CO who have fully legalized it.

[Senno]

Originally Posted by Gentoo

They still raid and CA is ill equipped to fight them on it. Now you have WA and CO who have fully legalized it.

CA can sue in Federal court. But it's a loser of a case to take up. Which is why I think they don't sue in the first place.

Yah, and the feds can decide if they will enforce the marijuana laws in CO and WA. /shrug

Which they probably won't unless they fall in their laps or get really overboard. Something like every marijuana drug dealer moves to CO, lol. We can watch from here in CA and see how they do with legalized marijuana.

The laws in both states prescribe some limits though. It's not "fully legalized".

[yeahthatguy]

Originally Posted by Senno

No less an august constituionalist as Antonin Scalia said that the 2nd amendment may be regulated. The fight is over how much to regulate.

Resist away but they will lose in court.

The Supremacy Clause and Federal Preemption

A little blurb on the Supremacy Clause as you seem to believe that States can draft gun legislation outlawing feds from enforcing federal laws.



Arizonas law was gutted. The feds still raid here in CA ya know. Just not that much. They don't have the resources to police CA that completely. But arrest a fed for enforcing federal gun laws and watch out.

Besides the academic pipe dreaming, If you seriously think a federal govt. that cannot even enforce current simple regulation is going to somehow pull a 180* and enforce even more stricter regulation, you must be breaking the federal law against marij. and smoking it heavily.

As a shareholder of several gun Manuf.'s I am quite confident and put my money where my mouth is that I don't think a single piece of meaningful legislation will come out of Washington restricting guns.

You can keep dreaming though.... You do have that right.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by Senno

CA can sue in Federal court. But it's a loser of a case to take up. Which is why I think they don't sue in the first place.

Yah, and the feds can decide if they will enforce the marijuana laws in CO and WA. /shrug

Which they probably won't unless they fall in their laps or get really overboard. Something like every marijuana drug dealer moves to CO, lol. We can watch from here in CA and see how they do with legalized marijuana.

The laws in both states prescribe some limits though. It's not "fully legalized".

Ok back to the 2nd amendment;

It will never be repealed or overturned whether through another amendment or Supreme Court decision. Even if you're not a gun owner, there's no logical reason to get rid of guns altogether. Just the ones designed to kill people during war.

You're not aware that states can nullify federal laws are you?

[Senno]

Originally Posted by yeahthatguy

Besides the academic pipe dreaming, If you seriously think a federal govt. that cannot even enforce current simple regulation is going to somehow pull a 180* and enforce even more stricter regulation, you must be breaking the federal law against marij. and smoking it heavily.

As a shareholder of several gun Manuf.'s I am quite confident and put my money where my mouth is that I don't think a single piece of meaningful legislation will come out of Washington restricting guns.

You can keep dreaming though.... You do have that right.

Dude, the argument is over whether states can trump federal law. They can't.

You are the one that thinks states will arrest federal agents...

I know the House won't pass anything. /shrug We are talking about CA law are we not?

Originally Posted by Gentoo

Ok back to the 2nd amendment;

It will never be repealed or overturned whether through another amendment or Supreme Court decision. Even if you're not a gun owner, there's no logical reason to get rid of guns altogether. Just the ones designed to kill people during war.

You're not aware that states can nullify federal laws are you?

I agree the 2nd amendment won't be repealed.

Thus the fight is over regulation at the state and federal level.

We have a very long history of regulating gun rights in this country. Sorry, but I'm with Scalia here.

Good luck with the nullification...

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by Senno

Dude, the argument is over whether states can trump federal law. They can't.

Have a nice day.

You are the one that thinks states will arrest federal agents...



I agree the 2nd amendment won't be repealed.

Thus the fight is over regulation...

We have a very long history of regulating gun rights in this country. Sorry, but I'm with Scalia here.

Good luck with the nullification...

First of all, there's a difference between "trump" and nullification.

Second, nothing in a free society is ever "over". Once we start thinking that way, we start losing our civil liberties as most will feel there's not much they can do...oh wait

[aslowdodge]

Originally Posted by roadwarrior101

Draconian? In my opinion, this doesn't go nearly far enough.

The 2nd Amendment was written in a time where the only guns available were muskets. There were no high-powered weapons. More notably, this was also to protect Americans (recent colonialists) from the British. Think of it as a guerrilla warfare strategy.

Fast forward to the 21st century where too many crazies have high powered weapons and these mass killings seem to be a regular occurrence.

I think the 2nd Amendment should be overturned and all guns should be confiscated, except for those used by law enforcement and the military. I'm not even a big fan of hunting. In general, its a cruel sport and endangers wild animals. When used to control populations, specific guide led expeditions should be held on rare occasions.

For the life of me, I just cannot comprehend the obsession with guns that many Americans have and the brainwashing they have that this may actually protect them.

By the same logic there was not the same media today as back then for free speech. All kinds of radical ideas, thoughts etc are spread in ways our forefathers never conceived. Paparratzi invade peoples lives all the time in the name of free speech. Some people say the original concept of free speech has been stretched too far, so should we ban facebook because a few people are misusing it? Should we then overturn the first ammendment because of this?

[Senno]

Originally Posted by Gentoo

First of all, there's a difference between "trump" and nullification.

Second, nothing in a free society is ever "over". Once we start thinking that way, we start losing our civil liberties as most will feel there's not much they can do...oh wait

Nullification is a nice theory, that was tried and rejected by the Supreme Court.

Try it out again on the right case.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nullifi...._Constitution)

I know there's a difference. You mixed up my response to YTG with my response to you. Nice try though.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by Senno

Nullification is a nice theory, that was tried and rejected by the Supreme Court.

Try it out again on the right case.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nullifi...._Constitution)

I know there's a difference. You mixed up my response to YTG with my response to you. Nice try though.

Defensive much? Jesus you act like I stabbed you in the heart or something.

Glad to know you believe things can be "settled" in a free society.