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So what exactly are you suggesting? What is YOUR solution for all these shootings? Take away people's guns? Stop gun trade? It is easy to call other people's solution non-sense when you yourself have none.
Quit making stuff up. I have called no one's solution non-sense. I thought this thread was for discussion and that's what is happening.
In my OPINION it's going to take more than one approach to turn things around. Changes can't just come from one area like gun control or in the mental health field. Everything needs to be put on the table for discussion where it counts...with our lawmakers barging in good faith without the influence of lobbyists sticking their noses in. It's too complicated an issue for just one solution.
Quit making stuff up. I have called no one's solution non-sense. I thought this thread was for discussion and that's what is happening.
In my OPINION it's going to take more than one approach to turn things around. Changes can't just come from one area like gun control or in the mental health field. Everything needs to be put on the table for discussion where it counts...with our lawmakers barging in good faith without the influence of lobbyists sticking their noses in. It's too complicated an issue for just one solution.
Agreed. Many severely mentally ill people can pass the criminal
background check.
I understand where you are coming from completely. The person who killed my favorite family member, was not only a druggie but severely mentally ill. He did not get the help he needed, because he thought everyone else had a problem not himself.
He thought everyone and everybody, was ought to get him. I heard one of his family members tried to get this manic the help he needed. But the medical facilities would not take him, without his consent. Needless to say this person was on the Streets, and free to murder my family member in cold blood and do the most horrendous things to her body thereafter he killed her.
I understand where some are coming from about the gun. The person pulled the trigger. If those who are severely mentally ill got the professional help needed to them and medication, most likely half of them would not have killed. But they don't and they walk along side with us, never knowing the person next to
you can explode at anytime.
I understand that there are thousands of mentally ill walking the streets, not getting any professional help at all. This is wrong. We can help others, but we cannot help our mentally ill, something wrong here..
His parents KNEW he was mentally ill, yet, they allowed him to get guns? Why is that?
Do you know for a fact that his parents knew that he bought the guns?
He was 22. An adult. Fully capable of purchasing firearms without a parent's permission.
He was not deemed mentally ill by any criteria that would preclude him from purchasing firearms.
He was not deemed a danger to himself or to others.
While much of what he spewed prior to his murderous rampage was disgusting and very disturbed, people say equally disgusting and dangerous things on a daily basis and never act on their impulses.
He was in treatment. And unless/until someone in treatment shows actual, literal violent tendencies, there is absolutely nothing that can or should be done to prevent them from living as full-fledged contributing members of society.
We can moan for days about how having access to guns made it easier for him to fulfill his goals, but, the fact remains, he could have killed just as many people with his car alone.
As for his father, he is grief-stricken and needs to have some tangible something that he can grab onto to make some kind of sense of a completely senseless episode. Again, he can blame the culture that makes it easy to get guns and glorifies their use everywhere one turns, but, at the end of the day, the only one to blame is his kid who should have known better.
BTW, how many people out of this nation of 310,000,000-plus people, wrote manifestos declaring their undying hatred of XXXXX and their aim to kill every last one of them.... and who then did NOT act on their writings? And never will? They just left them as local files on their hard drive, and never accessed them again?
Greater than zero, I'd guess. Possibly dozens, or even a hundred or more. More than a few are probably gun owners.
They are guilty of nothing more than writing stupid stuff. And that isn't even a crime. It certainly hurts no one.
If we locked up every person who did that, how many completely innocent people would we wind up imprisoning?
And the payoff question: How do we tell them, from the occasional Elliot Rodger who actually IS going to grab a gun and start shooting? Before he grabs the gun?
We don't know enough about "mental illness" to predict someone's behavior. If we (meaning psychologists, behavioral therapists etc.) start locking up everyone who acts weird and writes lurid manifestos, we'll prosecute far more innocents than guilty.
And then the "Better a thousand guilty go free than one innocent man be condemned" crowd will be on our case.
What should we do?
Sure, we know NOW that Elliot Rodger was murderously insane. But we didn't know it before last weekend. We just knew he was weird, scary, and maybe insane.
Could we have justified locking him up, say last Friday? Then we'd never know if he was a real threat... because he would never have committed any crime whatsoever. And neither would his other manifesto-writing brethern, who we'd have to lock up at the same time, and who in fact would never have done anything even if we left them free.
I understand where you are coming from completely. The person who killed my favorite family member, was not only a druggie but severely mentally ill. He did not get the help he needed, because he thought everyone else had a problem not himself.
He thought everyone and everybody, was ought to get him. I heard one of his family members tried to get this manic the help he needed. But the medical facilities would not take him, without his consent. Needless to say this person was on the Streets, and free to murder my family member in cold blood and do the most horrendous things to her body thereafter he killed her.
I understand where some are coming from about the gun. The person pulled the trigger. If those who are severely mentally ill got the professional help needed to them and medication, most likely half of them would not have killed. But they don't and they walk along side with us, never knowing the person next to
you can explode at anytime.
I understand that there are thousands of mentally ill walking the streets, not getting any professional help at all. This is wrong. We can help others, but we cannot help our mentally ill, something wrong here..
Mental illnesses were grossly misunderstood. There is also a stigma associated with mental illness.
The first thing mental health care providers tell you when you are dealing with a mentally disturbed person is to take away their firearms. But if they really want to kill themselves or others, they will find another way to do it.
"Had the officers sensed something awry during their April 30 visit, they might have searched Rodger’s home. They would have found his three semiautomatic handguns, dozens of rounds of ammunition and a draft of his 137-page memoir-manifesto. They would have read about his plot for a “Day of Retribution” — when, as Rodger wrote, he planned to “kill everyone in Isla Vista, to utterly destroy that wretched town.”
But the deputies did not look. They concluded that Rodger seemed “quiet and timid . . . polite and courteous,” Santa Barbara County Sheriff Bill Brown said Sunday on CBS’s “Face the Nation.”
I understand where you are coming from completely. The person who killed my favorite family member, was not only a druggie but severely mentally ill. He did not get the help he needed, because he thought everyone else had a problem not himself.
He thought everyone and everybody, was ought to get him. I heard one of his family members tried to get this manic the help he needed. But the medical facilities would not take him, without his consent. Needless to say this person was on the Streets, and free to murder my family member in cold blood and do the most horrendous things to her body thereafter he killed her.
I understand where some are coming from about the gun. The person pulled the trigger. If those who are severely mentally ill got the professional help needed to them and medication, most likely half of them would not have killed. But they don't and they walk along side with us, never knowing the person next to
you can explode at anytime.
I understand that there are thousands of mentally ill walking the streets, not getting any professional help at all. This is wrong. We can help others, but we cannot help our mentally ill, something wrong here..
I have to wonder why the NRA always gets blamed! None of the other gun/shooting organizations get blamed for anything...
No, I am not an NRA member.
Nor am I a member of any of the others.
YET!
The NRA is always blamed, as it is a convenient scapegoat for the left. To face the real causes and facts in this case would cause some uncomfortable introspection.
1. Whackjob liberal parents
2. a kid in "therapy" since age 8. Gee, I don't remember any kids in "therapy" where I grew up in the 60s.
3. lack of parental guidance
4. a father in the film industry with a hobby of photographing women's posteriors
5. lack of faith in the family
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Seems like you have a solution. Please do tell.
