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So are you - otherwise you'd be arguing that we need to abolish the U.S. military.
Anyone who thinks that they can protect themselves without police needs to move to Somalia and see how that works out.
Even if there is not a policeman AT YOUR HOUSE, they protect you EVERY SINGLE DAY. Just the fact that they EXIST provides a huge measure of protection and prevents "Somalia" from happening here.
Ken
You should get your facts straight before posting. Somalia has 50,000 police officers. Obviously it hasn't prevented "Somalia" from happening there.
What you are saying is that if you intend to commit suicide or murder a family member; that having a means to do so will more likely result in you using that means.
Guns are inanimate objects and are completely incapable of reason, morality, or malice because they are not alive. Guns don't talk to people and say, "You know how your wife was bugging you. I can make she never does that again. Ha ha ha ha ha ha!"
So unless someone is suicidal and/or homicidal what you just said doesn't apply to gun owners.
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And is it just me or has the quality of the gun control advocates on this forum really gone downhill over the past couple of months? The previous ones used to at least link stats and studies. Granted, they were flawed and only told half the picture, but these guys are so bad that I almost think that one of the gun rights advocates has created a bunch of strawman accounts to give us opponents that even the most inbred redneck can outsmart.
In a couple specific threads here, yea, the "quality , of the anti firearms crowds arguments has really been sad. They are leaning , really hard, on this "having a gun=you will be killed by that gun" thing. Well, a firearm is a weapon. Shooting , particularly self defense type shooting, is a martial art. So, does that mean, if one learns Karate, Aikido, any one of dozens of disciplines, that these resources are more likely to hurt you, than an attacker? If you have any of the dozens of weapons that other martial disciplines use, will that weapon be your undoing, just by its being at your disposal?
In addition to my firearms., I carry a few other options, at any given time. I consider these LTL options, but they are weapons, associated with various martial arts. I hold no rank in any discipline, other than firearms, but I can HSE these options with confidence. Does that mean their being there puts me in more danger, than if they weren't?
By the logic applied by the ones reliant on "social construct", pacifism is the only "safe" course. Run, roll over and beg, submit, give them what they want, nothing is worth your (or their) life. Really?! I beg to differ. Since I have a little insight, in that area, j know that if the criminal had just "gotten what they wanted", if the victim did survive, there wouldn't have been any "life" left, worth living. I rather get a cold chill thinking about that. Someone who is willing to attack you, on the street, in your home, whatever, they "want" a lot of things, I'm sure. In any case, its more than I, personally, am willing to give.
My assumption is, that what they want, is to inflict pain and death, for their own, perverted, pleasure and gain. They want to take, by force, everything I hold dear, because they think they can. That feeling of power, control, and these animals feed on fear. We should submit to that? Hope that the police will be along to take our fear away, and deal with the wolf at the door? It doesn't work out well, when you go that route, and the unthinkable happens. It can't. It defys an immutable law of nature. It amounts to a ragged hope, that the lion will release you, after he's drug you down and has you by the throat, because there may be a park ranger, with a gun, nearby. The mind of a violent human predator, is no less (probably more) vicious and merciless, than that lions.
To think otherwise, to think that violent criminals are governed by any type of rationale that has empathy and mercy in it, anywhere, is just nonsensical. I'll take my changes with this "statistic", that says my being armed puts me in more danger than attack by a violent criminal does. If that train of thought governed my life, and that of someone dear to me, we would have been another type of statistic. That isn't something my brain can wrap around. There are "people" in this world, quite likely you are within their reach, who want nothing more than to take from you. To take by violent force, everything you hold sacred. They thrive on the power they think they have, to make you afraid, to fear THEM, and that feeling is what they live for. Would anyone REALLY want to give them "what they want", and think that doing so buys you anything? I don't recommend living by such an ethos, and I don't. I WON'T. I refuse to think that way, and have more than ample experience to tell me Im better off to be that way.
Sorry Frank..don't mean to preach to the choir by quoting you. This is just an extension of what you said...aimed at the Rabbit Breed, who would see us cowering in holes, or shivering in a cage, waiting for the farmers axe. For that is what "social construct" is. A cage, full of fat rabbits, waiting to be food. It being one of those rabbits is "higher evolution", I will stay in the Pleistocene.
I have homeowners insurance and a phone to call 911. Unless someone is specifically targeting me they are looking to rob my house not kill me. Stuff in your house is only junk not worth killing over.
I say that cause my house got 200K worth of damage in Sandy and I lost all the cars, kitchen, kids videos when they were kids, furniture and we made the mistake of being home. Guess what come morning when water went down after being trapped on third floor as bottom two floors were in water all night I could care less. I bought new cars, new furnance, new oil tank, new kitchen, new bathroom, new shrubs on and on. Cant imagine shooting and killing someone over a stupid car. It is insured and I only have a $500 buck deductible, someone trying to rape my young daughter or kill my wife I will fill you full of bullet homes. But folks shooting folks trespassing or trying to take a car radios are really just looking to kill someone
yeah, trendy. Not really. The entire reason for society is assured protection. That is why the first villages and social constructs were created. Its not trendy. That is why we have police, soldiers, etc. To provide a protection service.
and, FYI, its very successful in every western country. Your chance of being killed in a homicide is insignificant, especially if your not a criminal/participating in a drug trade.
So trendy - no. Long term established social contract - YES.
I rely on the social construct every day. I never have to call anyone. I mean the fact that homicides in the event of house robberies are insignificant (less than 200 a year in US). . and anything bad is that the social construct worked. I don't live in a world where there is any significant chance of me being assaulted at work, home, or the way home.
That doesn't mean anything, in itself. you too benefit from the same social construct. even with your guns, the chances are you will never have any of these situations happen to you. I mean you can move to Compton and setup a marijuana dispensary i suppose if you want to really get a chance to "test your metal" but chances are the only difference between you and I is that your a blowhard, and i'm realistic.
my whole f'n point. If it never happens, and is unlikely to happen, why buy a gun? Especially if, rolling the dice, that gun is more likely to hurt your family than to help it. Where is that logic?
Why risk your family for something that has no real chance of happening. I'm sure it happens. everything happens. Yet i'm not walking down the street wearing a helmet to protect from tripping, and i'm sure as hell not avoiding skiing. . . so why would I worry about something far more unlikely then either of these things?
Once again, just more blow hard nonsense. Look, you can buy a gun. If we were going to bet if that gun was going to be used on a family member or a criminal, the bookie would give odds to it being used on your family. If you want to risk your family safety on some illusion that someday someone will attack you - its your choice.
but don't fault others for not being so stupid.
I take the stance of better to have and not need it than to not have it and need it. I tend to be proactive than reactive, in society it's not if but when. I had my house in N. Mexico broken into......twice. The second time the suspects nearly died. What stopped them from dying was watching the burglars cowering in fear in front of my 10 gauge and listening to the begging.
I don't normally talk about that but this instance is different. Believe it or not.
Nope. Gun ownership makes one more likely to shoot oneself or friend/family If one is t a criminal. It also provides a means of protection. Gun ownership isn't without flaws in terms of safety to oneself and loved ones.
You hoplophobes will cling to a study that has been completely and repeatedly discredited. The truth is that you could care less about actual facts and are completely ready to support your agenda by blatant and very tired lies.
I have homeowners insurance and a phone to call 911. Unless someone is specifically targeting me they are looking to rob my house not kill me. Stuff in your house is only junk not worth killing over.
How do you know? Will you ask them? I'm sure this woman offered the nice man her TV and jewelry but he decided to have "fun" with her.
You should get your facts straight before posting. Somalia has 50,000 police officers. Obviously it hasn't prevented "Somalia" from happening there.
The Somali police force essentially ceased to exist during the 1990's civil war. The country is in the process of trying to re-build it but they've got a longgggg way to go. Much of the country is STILL lawless.
How do you know? Will you ask them? I'm sure this woman offered the nice man her TV and jewelry but he decided to have "fun" with her.
If she just offered him hot cocoa while sitting down for a chat, she would have found out that he was just down on his luck and she owed him her possessions as reparations for her years of privilege.
Not true at all. A huge percent of our prison population are there due to their lifestyle and never hurt or even threatened anyone.
Fair enough.
That's doesn't change the fact that you are protected from all those BAD people currently in prison. Nearly 50% of all prison inmates are there for VIOLENT crimes (by far the biggest category). That's nearly THREE QUARTERS of a MILLION "violent" offenders you are protected from.
Another 15% or so (a QUARTER OF A MILLION) are there for property crimes.
So tell me again how police don't protect you from criminals?
Do you really think you'd be just as safe with those 1 MILLION people out on the street?
Really?
REALLY?
The whole "the police don't protect you" argument is about as STOOOOPID and IGNORANT as arguments get.
Ken
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Run, roll over and beg, submit, give them what they want, nothing is worth your (or their) life. Really?! I beg to differ. Since I have a little insight, in that area, j know that if the criminal had just "gotten what they wanted", if the victim did survive, there wouldn't have been any "life" left, worth living. I rather get a cold chill thinking about that. Someone who is willing to attack you, on the street, in your home, whatever, they "want" a lot of things, I'm sure. In any case, its more than I, personally, am willing to give. 