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Nice, while I don't agree with canceling the parade (I think the subversive elements infiltrating the repubs marching could have been handled differently)
I like(sarcasm) how the whole convo has been skewed...
How about some discussion on the topic of why they thought it would be ok to even march with the
Republican paradees-
like really thats how far the GOP has gone?: its ok for neoNazi/ KKK sympathizers to walk openly with them in something as innocuous as a Rose Parade in one of the most diverse (racially ) parts of Portland?
(from the concurrent thread running in the Portland Forum Poster Metlakatla states:
"the iii percenters and others of their ilk were planning on being a part of the parade under the guise of the Mutnomah County Republican Party."
(not sure how to double quote)
"The enemy of my enemy is my friend" even if temporarily. Good enough for the US itself, good enough for anyone who gets threatened with "protest" (like hell it was going to remain peaceful).
All of those groups are there to protect people who are threatened by antifa. It does not mean that all of these Republicans agree with those groups.
In Berkeley on the 15th, the rally was for Trump supporters, but the other groups showed up to offer protection because they knew that antifa was going to come along and disrupt. And they did. Would you like some video of them barreling right on over the barricades that the police put up, right in to the rally side?
The groups are there so that the other can continue to peacefully rally or march or whatever it is that they want to do. The Proud Boys, Identity Evoropa, The Oathkeepers, and all of those other organizations were not there to rally for Trump, they were not there to be part of a parade, they were not going to Berkeley to listen to Ann Coulter.
Every time, they go so that the people continue to have their right to free speech since the police are continuously told to stand down.
THAT is why they were going.
Nothing would happen if antifa just protested. But they don't just protest.
Of course that was going to happen during the parade despite the so called promises that they would "just block people" which is also violating peoples rights to free movement.
Plenty call Trump a Fascist. My problem is you trying to blame all of this on "Conservatives". Vast generalizations never make a good argument.
Correct me if I misread.
You totally misread. I am saying that conservatives, and I am speaking as a conservative, would do big wonders to label the Anti-fa for what they really are; Communists and Anarchists, rather than using the distracting and mildly confusing slur of fascists.
My point is that if you call them what they really are, you open the book to the history of their hellish ideologies. Calling them fascists just makes it seem as though only fascists and Nazis suppressed free speech, but Commies and Anarchists have been doing this all throughout the 20th century and this is exactly what they do to groups who they deem as "reactionary"; they violently suppress them.
If we called them Communists and Anarchists and told people that this is what they do, they'll pick up a history book and read on the Cultural Revolution, the Anarchist collectives of pre-Civil War Spain and the zealously and violent suppression of the church, liberals and all people they deemed reactionary.
You totally misread. I am saying that conservatives, and I am speaking as a conservative, would do big wonders to label the Anti-fa for what they really are; Communists and Anarchists, rather than using the distracting and mildly confusing slur of fascists.
OK, fair enough there. Fascist has become a catch all for not having a better argument.
Quote:
My point is that if you call them what they really are, you open the book to the history of their hellish ideologies. Calling them fascists just makes it seem as though only fascists and Nazis suppressed free speech, but Commies and Anarchists have been doing this all throughout the 20th century and this is exactly what they do to groups who they deem as "reactionary"; they violently suppress them.
If we called them Communists and Anarchists and told people that this is what they do, they'll pick up a history book and read on the Cultural Revolution, the Anarchist collectives of pre-Civil War Spain and the zealously and violent suppression of the church, liberals and all people they deemed reactionary.
A lot of people have been doing it but in the argument that calling them Fascist is a cheap way out for a better argument, I agree.
If you want to disagree with another person's position, fine disagree. You want to get violent in that disagreement? Simple solution... Constitutional carry.
When it starts to get violent, give them their much needed and deserved vaccination of high velocity lead poisoning. Problem solved.
Last edited by KS_Referee; 04-27-2017 at 03:09 PM..
heres the link (from the Willamette Week, I hope its a good enough source.. we certainly use it around here/ but what would actual Portlanders know, huh?)
plenty of blame to go around,
although I see the Republicans were going to bow out of the parade, but then changed their minds (and were still going to include the iii percenters?, et cetera)-
and then the fringe elements - RIGHT as well as LEFT jumped on the bandwagon to conflict.
Sounded like it could have been nasty, and definitely not "family friendly"-
Good article although still a bit skewed.
and their only 'evidence' of this alleged infiltration is... a quote from someone from direct action
If you want to disagree with another person's position, fine disagree. You want to get violent in that disagreement? Simple solution... Constitutional carry.
When it starts to get violent, give them their much needed and deserved vaccination of high velocity lead poisoning. Problem solved.
A solution that will land the owner of the trigger finger in jail, too. No one goes to shooting in public for any cause and escapes the long arm of the law in this country just yet. Bullets carry consequences the instant they leave a gun barrel.
Argue self-defense rights all you want, but when deadly force is used, it will be accounted for in our courts.
Just like we had the Womens March.
Peacefulness could have carried the day, extremists be damned(using this word grammatically, not as an expletive).
I agree, but I don't live there. I think Portlanders should decide for themselves.
I know a little about Portland, as I have relatives there and have visited several times. I tend to think the parade will go on, but I may be proven wrong.
No one knows from the tidbit that was presented here just how serious the threat may be. That's something the Portland police wouldn't necessarily make public, one way or the other, until they had their own firm assessment of the possible dangers.
But even if the dangers were real and serious, I tend to think some Portlanders would parade anyway. Outsiders might think Portland is a tender place, where feelings are easily hurt, but that's a false impression.
The Portland I know is chock full of tough and rowdy Oregonians, lumberjacks and fishermen alongside their hi-tech kids, and Portland has always been a hardcase town that was quick to go to blows. The town has changed over the past 20 years, but not that much.
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