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so your logic is it's OK to apply stereotype for one group (i.e. all Asians are nerdy antisocial socially inept) but it is not OK for another group (i.e. all black people want to be the next Snoop Dog)?
When I said "Asian applicants" in my other post, I wasn't talking about Asian-Asians, I was talking about Asian-Americans.
I didn't say anything about stereotypes in my response to you....
I also have a post history that includes me stating that people often stereotype Asian Americans just like other groups of people are stereotyped in this country.
However, what I stated is still true - if you don't get into Harvard you can go to another college and do well. It's not that big of a deal and not many people even go to Harvard.
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Originally Posted by Open-D
Kinda like asking what the definition of "is", is.
So I take it you don't know the definition of "intelligence."
FYI - intelligence is the "ability to acquire and apply knowledge and skills."
No matter someone's IQ they have the ability to learn and apply their knowledge and skills unless they are severely mentally/developmentally disabled.
An IQ test is a measurement of specific knowledge and skills. Those specific skills and knowledge are based upon a certain view of what is important in a country/society. The things measured by IQ tests do not measure everything that all people value in regards to skills/knowledge, which is why it is not some end all/be all for learning or "success." Success also depends on the person who defines the term.
FWIW "is" can be defined as a third person present of "be" which in its simplest form means to exist
And the ability to be educated depends on your IQ.
Actually it doesn't. People were being educated and learning things for millenia before IQ was even known. IQ is only a test that measures what Europeans felt were important in their society in the 19th century. Europeans colonized the world and their views from the 19th century are very prominent today. IQ test primarily measure verbal and pattern recognition skills.
Actually it doesn't. People were being educated and learning things for millenia before IQ was even known. IQ is only a test that measures what Europeans felt were important in their society in the 19th century. Europeans colonized the world and their views from the 19th century are very prominent today. IQ test primarily measure verbal and pattern recognition skills.
Sure it does. IQ existed before it was measured because intelligence existed. Not all humans have the ability to learn the same because their IQs vary.
Pattern recognition is the core measure of intelligence. It defines intelligence. It is what allows for novel thoughts, better models of the world, and problem solving. Everything else is memory and articulation of that memory (processing speed in accessing memory and motor control). There is no escaping that, no matter how the "all cultures and minds are equal" crowd would like to redefine it to place higher or eradicate the measurement.
Sure it does. IQ existed before it was measured because intelligence existed. Not all humans have the ability to learn the same because their IQs vary.
Pattern recognition is the core measure of intelligence. It defines intelligence. It is what allows for novel thoughts, better models of the world, and problem solving. Everything else is memory and articulation of that memory (processing speed in accessing memory and motor control). There is no escaping that, no matter how the "all cultures and minds are equal" crowd would like to redefine it to place higher or eradicate the measurement.
what the iq of bacteria? they seem to recognize patterns if they form the same patterns every time
I always say there is not much of a difference between a redneck and a hood rat. I've seen it up close and personal.
Rednecks commit orders of magnitude less violent crime as a large group.
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Politicians in general promise alot and don't deliver on everything. Now, you can say what you will about Democrats. Go ahead. It isn't going to make more Blacks and Hispanics vote for Republicans. This is how I see it in general terms. Democrats will tell Blacks and Hispanics what they want to hear but not deliver on everything.
True. They are caste oppressors. The oppression mechanism works because of the irresistible buy in for the large group.
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Basically, it's pick the party who tells you what you want to hear versus the party who either ignores you or talks down on your ethnicity/about your ethnicity like you're a burden on society. Why would I pick someone who views me as a burden?
Assuming your frame for a moment, look at it this way:
Conservatives see you as a burden because they do not well tolerate the dysfunction that your large-group wants to escape (because it is their caste role to police it), and as a result they want you to be better to the point that the group is not a burden. They tend to be the group that geographically borders on your caste, sometimes with a slight further population buffer. Your caste improvement improves the crime rate, lowers their death rate from policing that crime, and lowers the victimization rate of their family members. Of course they are going to be hard on you: until you rise in caste as a group. If you want a taste of what it is to be in that higher caste without waiting for the large group to rise, then become a police officer or a prosecutor.
They want you to rise in caste, are willing to demonstrate the cultural tools to accomplish that feat. They are honest in regard to their relationship to you, and would not mind if you rose in caste. Are they harsh on lower caste crime and do they have a distaste for the lower castes? Yep. That's their caste role.
Compare with the following: (even higher caste) progressives also see you as a burden, but do not wish you to rise in caste. Instead, they feed the large group social values and limited crippling support that will assure that the large group forever wallows (is locked into) the lower caste. This is why and how caste oppression works. They do it with a hug and a smile of approval and so you vote for them and adopt their easy values. I can't think of anything more tragic: that you can be bought off with simple demeanor and a promise of easy values over correct values at the cost of sitting forever at the bottom as a large group.
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By the way, Jews and Asians tend to vote Democrat alot.
Not in their home countries. Only when they feel they have something to gain by politically agitating against the majority as minorities. In Israel, Jews are so far right that they unapologetically keep most of their minority locked up in an open air prison. Most Jews in the United States either rationalize that if not zealously support it. They aren't liberal. They are highly ethnonationalist and act merely according to self-interest.
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Whites in Utah support Republicans alot, and so do Whites in West Virginia. Guess who is poorer? West Virginia.
True, but I'm unsure of the point that you are trying to make. All heath land, or forested wasteland, regions are poorer (across the world) because the land does not support either farming or port access (the two foundational sources of wealth). Manufacturing comes and goes. Mountain regions tend to do slightly better, and more so if military is present, but SLC is no powerhouse.
In the end, I and most people would rather be a West Virginia Redneck in a lower crime town with lots of space than locked into an inner city ghetto in a "rich" coastal city. All economies are regional, and in cities that applies block-to-block.
Sure it does. IQ existed before it was measured because intelligence existed. Not all humans have the ability to learn the same because their IQs vary.
Pattern recognition is the core measure of intelligence. It defines intelligence. It is what allows for novel thoughts, better models of the world, and problem solving. Everything else is memory and articulation of that memory (processing speed in accessing memory and motor control). There is no escaping that, no matter how the "all cultures and minds are equal" crowd would like to redefine it to place higher or eradicate the measurement.
I never said all cultures and minds are "equal" I said different societies value different skills and knowledge bases.
IQ didn't exist until it was created....same as the wheel lol.
You and others in the thread seem to be heavily influenced by 19th century European standards (and there is nothing wrong with that) and what you consider to be important in regards to "intelligence." I'm not as invested in your view because I don't value your view over other people's POV, that's all.
I do agree that pattern recognition is an important skill for all people; however, a majority of the tests that are given in America that measure IQ are not primarily based on this skill. They also are given in a rather foreign environment, especially for children and there is literature about the fact that children often do poorly on IQ assessments due to the practitioner giving the assessment. IQ assessments also are not routinely done anymore in school settings and most of these discussions are based upon other standardized tests that are more about academic skills rather than IQ.
FWIW I remember when I was tested as a young child - one of my main "skills" over other people is that I had (still have to this day) is a very good memory - my parents told me a few years ago that when I was 1-2 years old, I told them I remembered being born!!! LOL. I don't remember being born today, but I actually do believe that at 2 years old, I probably did remember being born. I do remember an injury I got when I was 8 months old - my mother was shocked that I remembered it. And I heavily remember my childhood from age 3 on up - even the thoughts I used to have - I was a very introverted child. When I was 3 years old I was put through a battery of tests in Head Start - I was a poor, black kid sent to Head Start at 3 because I was suspected of needing extra enrichment due to my pediatrician thinking I showed signs of mental retardation.... I remember I had two ladies who tested me. They were my teachers for a while in a small Head Start class. I remember thinking the other kids in the class - there were 4 of them, I thought they were dumb and I used to do things to trick them and then would feel bad about it - I seriously remember thinking how my grandmother wouldn't like me being mean to those "dumb kids" in my mind lol. I was put through a lot of tests but didn't do the tests all in one day. They were very nice teachers and I still remember their names. I think because I was so comfortable with them, unlike my doctor who I remember kind of hating and thinking negative things about him, I opened up to these ladies and I had fun playing their "games" which I knew was a test lol. Due to my excellent memory and my enthusiasm, I did very well on the assessments. Most people lose IQ points as they get older and I've never been tested again after that - I was referred to our gifted education program after my test results came in and taken out of the class with the dumb kids, I remember my mom telling me they said I was a genius and her discussing with my dad - they were not married BTW - if she should let them put me in kindergarten when I was 3 years old. They had a lot of debate about that and I got sick of listening to them and went outside and played.
what the iq of bacteria? they seem to recognize patterns if they form the same patterns every time
"Seem to" and "recognize", heh? Before we get to bacteria, perhaps consider a test?
Did you wish to have an actual conversation in regard to your suggestion that bacterial colonies imply an intelligence equivalent between them and the creators of the breadth of human technology, philosophy, and creativity?
"Seem to" and "recognize", heh? Before we get to bacteria, perhaps consider a test?
Did you wish to have an actual conversation in regard to your suggestion that bacterial colonies imply an intelligence equivalent between them and the creators of the breadth of human technology, philosophy, and creativity?
Let me know.
I think it went over your head. Point is that bacteria have been observed to create patterns. They have "learned" to do it over many billions of years.
Hence, intelligence has been around way before IQ tests and it is not just limited to the human species.
You seem to get too invested in "equal" and "equivalence" when the poster never said that, just like I never said it. You need to use your intelligence (i.e. memory and pattern recognition skills) and realize that when people don't reference a particular word/term (like equality/equivalence) they are not speak of said word/term.
equality of outcome is very easy. dumbing down to the lowest common denominator is the only way to accomplish equality of outcome, however. Averaging up is not possible.
Last edited by texan2yankee; 11-29-2018 at 01:00 PM..
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I remember I had two ladies who tested me. They were my teachers for a while in a small Head Start class. I remember thinking the other kids in the class - there were 4 of them, I thought they were dumb and I used to do things to trick them and then would feel bad about it - I seriously remember thinking how my grandmother wouldn't like me being mean to those "dumb kids" in my mind lol. I was put through a lot of tests but didn't do the tests all in one day. They were very nice teachers and I still remember their names. I think because I was so comfortable with them, unlike my doctor who I remember kind of hating and thinking negative things about him, I opened up to these ladies and I had fun playing their "games" which I knew was a test lol. Due to my excellent memory and my enthusiasm, I did very well on the assessments. Most people lose IQ points as they get older and I've never been tested again after that - I was referred to our gifted education program after my test results came in and taken out of the class with the dumb kids, I remember my mom telling me they said I was a genius and her discussing with my dad - they were not married BTW - if she should let them put me in kindergarten when I was 3 years old. They had a lot of debate about that and I got sick of listening to them and went outside and played.
