Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
People seem to always use Pauls teachings concerning the works of the law verses grace to justify laziness in following Christ.
If you read the teachings of Christ (as found in Matthew for instance) you can come to no other conclusion than that certain works are essential. For example, Christ told the rich young man that he needed to keep the commandments to gain eternal life. When the man said that he did, Christ told him that he must sell all he has and give to the poor and follow him. Then he would have eternal life. Christ made it perfectly clear what was expected and the sacrifice required by this man to enter heaven included a willingness to give all. If we cannot learn to place our whole hearts on the alter, we will not be worthy either.
You will find that the early Christians were communal. They were expected to sell all that they had and give the proceeds to the church. One couple died for not complying (see Acts 4:32 thru Acts 5:10)
"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven."
By denying the need to make personal sacrifices, we deny the very teachings that Christ sacrificed so hard to make known. Christ sacrificed all to save us and though we are imperfect, we must become worthy of that sacrifice by turning from a life of apathy and sin to an active faith in Christ.
This is difficult to do. That is why God placed apostles and prophets to help us (see Ephesians 4:11-14)
Like--seem like nice people overall. Most of the Mormons I've met have been very polite and friendly. I also like the understanding of humans as the children of God, where our souls are like droplets of God.
You already stated one of the best things to like, so I'll have to pick another.
Like: Nobody "burns in hell for eternity." Nor are they snuffed from existence as some other religions see it. Sinners who defy and reject God in this life are going to end up in a paradise of some degree or another, after they pay the price for what they've done wrong. (The notion of an infinite punishment for a finite amount of sin has never sat right with me and Mormonism also rejects that notion.)
Dislike: Mormon Sheeple. No different than any other religion really, but a good many of them need to learn to think for themselves more.
Mormonism is one of the most complete world-view and eternal-view religions out there. This is commendable because far too many religions just throw out "God works in mysterious ways" and expects you to think that's a good answer when it isn't. Whether you agree or disagree, Mormonism is much more likely to have an actual answer to any given question than most religions.
Dislike- their practice of polygamy and child marriages
90sman, one thing I really enjoy is digging around and finding out what's really going on. Here's what I found out on this issue:
Polygamy was definitely practiced by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints from 1842 till 1890 when it was officially stopped. In 1904, it became an excommunicatable offense to have multiple wives.
Several decades passed, then a number of tiny breakoff groups renewed the practice (and upon discovery were excommunicated.) Ever since then, you've had these tiny groups -- cults really -- that claim to be the "real Mormon Church." Currently the largest of these is the FLDS Church, claiming to have 10,000 members. The FLDS is the one that seems to make news headlines the most, along with their leader Warren Jeffs. If you hear about "Mormon Polygamy" happening anytime in the past 100 years, it's either the FLDS or another similar group. Due to their tiny membership and bizarre world-view, marriages are often forced upon underaged girls. They also have a bit of an inbreeding problem - most often cousin marrying cousin or uncle marrying niece, etc. Also, they actually drive young men out of their religion for spurious reasons in order to ensure that there are always more women than men and polygamy can continue. In these aspects, they really are their own animal as a religion -- the main body of the LDS church never practiced anything quite like that.
Now to put it into perspective, the official numbers of LDS -- the ones that abandonned polygamy 120 years ago -- that group claims an official membership of 14 million. That means they are 1400 times bigger than the FLDS led by Warren Jeffs who you keep seeing in news headlines. Of the religions springing from the teachings of one Joseph Smith 98% of them are the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints - who don't practice polygamy and haven't in 120 years, 2% are associated with the RLDS (which didn't practice polygamy at all). The tiny fraction that does practice plural marriage is significantly less than 1%, and because of their cult-like isolationist behavior, you will probably never meet one in your entire life. (My wife and I lived in Utah for a few years, we never met one.) So when you make the statement that "Mormons practice plural marriage/child marriage/etc" it's not really accurate. I know it's plenty confusing though, so it's understandable that people draw the wrong conclusions after watching Big Love, etc.
So why the confusion?
A.) Because the group says they're Mormons when interviewed - because they believe they're the real Mormons.
B.) Because "Joe Mormon marries one wife" doesn't make the news. "Joe Mormon marries his 16th wife" is news! People are morbidly fascinated by the idea. Some people are disgusted. Feminists are completely scandalized by it all. Some men are thinking "hey sign me up" but don't dare say it where their wife can hear them. But Mormon Polygamy never fails to sell newspapers, movies, tv shows, etc.
In the end I have to put it into perspective. I don't like the fact that Catholicism hunted down and murdered everyone who disagreed with them for several centuries. I don't like that the Southern Baptist Church was founded primarily to protect the institution of slavery. I don't like that Christian Spain and Portugal massacred millions of Native Americans. But in the end, bad things happened at the hands of Christians. Mormonism practicing polygamy for 50 years in the 1800's is small potatoes by comparison, at least in my book. And the good news is all of the above are history, gone, and in the distant past. (Now if somebody could please do something about Warren Jeffs and his little cult ...)
Last edited by godofthunder9010; 05-16-2011 at 09:24 PM..
like-family values, family togetherness-it's nice to see kids who make good choices-makes for a positive educational experience
dislike-one mormon family moves in a small community and soon after only mormons are moving in-nothing wrong with new families but do schools, banks and clinics have to be influenced by lds money? Also, yes, lds values are more morally correct but us "non-Mormons" are not evil and by all means not terrible unclean people.
90sman, one thing I really enjoy is digging around and finding out what's really going on. Here's what I found out on this issue:
Polygamy was definitely practiced by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints from 1842 till 1890 when it was officially stopped. In 1904, it became an excommunicatable offense to have multiple wives.
There still is a type of polygamy in the main Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints today. Couples are married for eternity in LDS temples, so their marriage will continue after this life. If the woman dies, the man can marry another woman for eternity also. So, in the afterlife, he will have two wives forever. However, if a man dies, the woman cannot marry another man for eternity; if she marries, it can only be for this life only. That way, men living now can have multiple wives in heaven, but women can only have one husband for eternity.
Also, although president of the LDS Church Wilford Woodruff publicly said that the practice of allowing new polygamous marriages had ended in 1890, the practice continued at least until 1904, when a second Manifesto was issued against polygamy by church president Joseph F. Smith.
"D. Michael Quinn and other Mormon historians have documented that some church apostles covertly sanctioned plural marriages after the Manifesto. This practice was especially prevalent in Mexico and Canada because of an erroneous belief that such marriages were legal in those jurisdictions. However, a significant minority were performed in Utah and other western American states and territories. The estimates of the number of post-Manifesto plural marriages performed range from scores to thousands, with the actual figure probably close to 250. Today, the LDS Church officially acknowledges that although the Manifesto "officially ceased" the practice of plural marriage in the church, "the ending of the practice after the Manifesto was ... gradual."
Rumors of post-Manifesto marriages surfaced and were examined in detail during a series of congressional hearings on whether the United States Senate should seat Mormon Apostle Reed Smoot, who was elected by the Utah legislature in 1903. The hearings began in 1904 and continued until 1907, when the Senate finally voted to seat him.
In response to the hearings, church president Joseph F. Smith issued a "Second Manifesto" in 1904 which reaffirmed the church's opposition to the creation of new plural marriages and threatened excommunication for Latter-day Saints who continued to enter into or solemnize new plural marriages."
Please do not post if you cannot respond to both questions. Let's see if we can keep this thread open for more than a couple of hours.
1. Name one thing you like about Mormons or admire about their religion.
2. Name one thing you dislike about Mormons or object to concerning their religion.
I like mormons they are very nice people
what I dont like about mormon is when people talk bad about them
I cant say anything negative about them
Many of my family members are LDS. I love them dearly! They are very kind people and I love the importance they place on family. My one cousin has 6 children and she's a WONDERFUL mother! Her children are very well behaved. I like the traditional views of marriage and family they have.
What I dislike...well, I'll just say most of the Mormon doctrine. I also dislike like that I can't attend their wedding ceremony. Every non-lds in our family is upset that we can only go to the reception. We love them and it's hard to not be able to actually see them get married.
1. I like their family activities night. Great idea.
2. I don't like that they have fallen for easily the biggest religious con of the past 1400 years, and then impose their will of homophobia, racism and misogyny on legislatures outside of Utah.
Last visit I had from Mormons the minister was more concerned about angrily proving that he is white than anything else. Not a good impression!
Somehow, nothing in this post makes an ounce of sense.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
