Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Not trying to start but debate but how can we understand Good without first knowing evil?
I agree. This is why I believe that it was God's intention for Adam and Eve to sin to teach them about goodness and evil, to teach them what was right and wrong, and to teach them the consequences of sin, for example. I believe that they also learned many things about God that they did not know before they disobeyed.God bless.
i thought on this and got this awhile back ;
if god would have lets say burnt lucifer to a pile of ashes after he found out he was saying to everyone that he could run the universe better and wanted to exalt himself as king, then all the other beings/ angels would have thought whoa! dont even think of going against god or you'll be a pile of ashes!!
then they would not have been free!! and god would have a rule by fear thing going on and that is not what he wanted, so he said o.k. lets see what you can do here's a planet show us what you can do and we see what we've got and so does the whole universe/principalities and powers ect... it is free choice that he has given us and it is dangerous indeed. for some can choose to dump pollutiuon in our water. some can choose to put mercury in our vaccinnes and fillings, some can choose to ignore that apricots kernals and laetrile can cure cancer and eventry to hide it so they can profit from chemo that does'nt work. some can put raymond rife and his work into a place where noone can use it some can hide the work Tesla and the free energy he tried to give us. Indeed what if...
i thought on this and got this awhile back ;
if god would have lets say burnt lucifer to a pile of ashes after he found out he was saying to everyone that he could run the universe better and wanted to exalt himself as king, then all the other beings/ angels would have thought whoa! dont even think of going against god or you'll be a pile of ashes!!
then they would not have been free!! and god would have a rule by fear thing going on and that is not what he wanted, so he said o.k. lets see what you can do here's a planet show us what you can do and we see what we've got and so does the whole universe/principalities and powers ect... it is free choice that he has given us and it is dangerous indeed. for some can choose to dump pollutiuon in our water. some can choose to put mercury in our vaccinnes and fillings, some can choose to ignore that apricots kernals and laetrile can cure cancer and eventry to hide it so they can profit from chemo that does'nt work. some can put raymond rife and his work into a place where noone can use it some can hide the work Tesla and the free energy he tried to give us. Indeed what if...
Thats easy. God did create satan. He is a created being just as we are, and just as any other angel. God created satan, but God did NOT create satan evil. Satan chose to disobey God and BECAME Evil. We chose to disobey God and became wicked.
As I said before I do not believe God 'Created' evil in the sense that your saying. I think God created free will and evil RESULTED from not obeying God. That to me is different than actually creating evil outright.
We disobey God and evil things may happen. Is that God's fault? IMO NO!
Or If we disobey God and we get a Punishment. Is that God's fault for having to punish us for something we did wrong? IMO NO!
Sorry, but this doesn't explain the scriptures in the least. God does credit Himself for creating evil and good in Isaiah 45:7. He credits Himself for creating everything, causing everything to happen.
If there is such a thing as free will, there would be extreme amounts of boasting in Heaven, because we decided to believe. The opposite is truth though, God is the author and finisher of our faith. In Him we live and move and have our being. God creates vessels of honor and dishonor.
The lamb of God was slain before the very foundation of the world according to Revelation. We are clay in the Potter's hand, and He weilds the axe according to the bible. We are tools in His hand. In the end, Jesus did everything we couldn't do to be saved.
Our response to that is from God Himself, the faith to rest in Jesus' finished work is what gives us a special sense of our salvation. But God blinds many to that realization, just take a look at the churches today. They all point to their own way to salvation, and hilariously no one even in those churches can meet their own standards to salvation.
But we have a bigger problem, if God is not in control of His own creation, then where is this peace and joy that the bible says comes with the spirit? Are you comfortable with the out of control God?
This is a trustworthy statement deserving of full acceptance of which we both labor and suffer reproach. We serve the living God, savior of all men and especially of those that believe. Command and teach these things. - 1 Timothy
Sorry, but this doesn't explain the scriptures in the least. God does credit Himself for creating evil and good in Isaiah 45:7. He credits Himself for creating everything, causing everything to happen.
If there is such a thing as free will, there would be extreme amounts of boasting in Heaven, because we decided to believe. The opposite is truth though, God is the author and finisher of our faith. In Him we live and move and have our being. God creates vessels of honor and dishonor.
The lamb of God was slain before the very foundation of the world according to Revelation. We are clay in the Potter's hand, and He weilds the axe according to the bible. We are tools in His hand. In the end, Jesus did everything we couldn't do to be saved.
Our response to that is from God Himself, the faith to rest in Jesus' finished work is what gives us a special sense of our salvation. But God blinds many to that realization, just take a look at the churches today. They all point to their own way to salvation, and hilariously no one even in those churches can meet their own standards to salvation.
But we have a bigger problem, if God is not in control of His own creation, then where is this peace and joy that the bible says comes with the spirit? Are you comfortable with the out of control God?
This is a trustworthy statement deserving of full acceptance of which we both labor and suffer reproach. We serve the living God, savior of all men and especially of those that believe. Command and teach these things. - 1 Timothy
I've always thought of the Isaiah 45:7 verse you've mentioned as being a reference to God being in control of all things. I think if he didn't acknowledge his hand in allowing evil to exist, he would essentially be stating that he had no control over it. Refer to the following verse.
Romans 8:28 And we know that God causes all things to work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose.
So even in his allowance of evil to exist, God still is working towards the good of those who love him.
IF there is a god, and if he created evil as well as good, that makes him both good and evil, the source of both.
If there is a god who claims to be all good, all loving, but allows evil and does not stop it, he is a contradiction, which is much better explained as he doesnt exist.
IF there is a god, and if he created evil as well as good, that makes him both good and evil, the source of both.
If there is a god who claims to be all good, all loving, but allows evil and does not stop it, he is a contradiction, which is much better explained as he doesnt exist.
Just my take.
If God would stop every evil thing you or I did, we would be robots.
If God would stop every evil thing you or I did, we would be robots.
I don't think we'd be robots per say, as God has stated there will be no more sin in his presence after we get transformed bodies. I doubt you'll have many robots in the afterlife, seeing as how as it is written "when we see him we will be like him" and if we become like him, then that means we won't be robots - but fully autonomous righteous beings.
This is really a difficult question to answer. To me the only real way to answer it scripturally is with the above scripture of God working all things for the good of those who love him. Everything else after that really just becomes speculation.
I've kind of speculated(my own opinion) that the reason as to why God allowed evil, is because he looked through all the possible scenarios, and defined this course of action to be what Love was, or specifically he decided that the allowance of others to work against him was the most Loving thing to do. All just my opinion.
The simple answer is that God didn't create evil. He allowed free will.
Man has a talent for corrupting anything no matter how good. Man has another talent. That talent is for pointing the finger of blame at anyone or anything other than himself.
I am a believer in Karma. Not in the higher power bringing good or bad karma idea. More like how Buddhist see it. We create gor own good or bad Karma through our actions. In other words if you do mean and rotten deeds sooner or later someone will visit upon you a measure of revenge, no one will trust you enough to have any dealings with you.
An example would be a child molestor goes to prison. While there he is pimped out for cigarettes. That is Karma.
An example of good Karma would be The neighborhood good guy. Has never failed to buy candy from kids, never failed to stop when he see's a neighbor in trouble. His car breaks down in the middle of a thunder storm. He not only gets a ride home, but another neighbor tows his vehicle to the local garage for him. Thats Karma..
Evil is an invention made by man. Its that simple.
The simple answer is that God didn't create evil. He allowed free will.
Man has a talent for corrupting anything no matter how good. Man has another talent. That talent is for pointing the finger of blame at anyone or anything other than himself.
I am a believer in Karma. Not in the higher power bringing good or bad karma idea. More like how Buddhist see it. We create gor own good or bad Karma through our actions. In other words if you do mean and rotten deeds sooner or later someone will visit upon you a measure of revenge, no one will trust you enough to have any dealings with you.
An example would be a child molestor goes to prison. While there he is pimped out for cigarettes. That is Karma.
An example of good Karma would be The neighborhood good guy. Has never failed to buy candy from kids, never failed to stop when he see's a neighbor in trouble. His car breaks down in the middle of a thunder storm. He not only gets a ride home, but another neighbor tows his vehicle to the local garage for him. Thats Karma..
Evil is an invention made by man. Its that simple.
Well I agree in the concept of Karma to a limited extent, as we each will receive back the bad/good we do either in this life or the next. I think we need to understand though that "good" and "evil" exist outside of man. We do indeed have an invisible adversary as well as a present Savior. The biggest lie the Devil ever told was to make people think he didn't exist. We have to understand that evil does indeed exist outside of our ability to control it, and that we have a Savior who has freed us from being in bondage to it who's name is Jesus Christ. This is the story of the bible, about God trying to save man from an ultimate evil fate.
Edit. Agree with the top line. About free will. Thanks
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
what if
