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Those are very interesting details about your friend, Ani. One of the things which struck me upon reading them was the enormous time investment he puts into his creation of food from his own property. From a financial point of view, one could get a part-time job, buy one's food, and come out ahead time-wise. Of course I understand that he ENJOYS what he does and derives pleasure from his pursuits. It must be satisfying to create so much of one's own sustenance, although that sort of thing would not interest me personally. Perhaps I was turned off by being forced to work a lot in our family vegetable garden as a child! LOL. But for folks who enjoy gardening per se, it's a win-win; grow some veggies in addition to and/or in place of flowers.
Although I'm a gardener - the gardening thing in terms of feeding myself isn't my cup of tea. And I'm not especially handy either.
But - if anyone is interested in the former - picking the right area/land is important. In terms of the crops you want to grow - what you can grow where the land is - what those crops need - how expensive those needs (ranging from fertilizer to irrigation) are. Etc. Also check into things if you want to hunt. I have about 3/4 acre - but most of it is hopeless in terms of growing food type things (except for herbs in barrels - and I"m really good at that). And I'm not allowed to shoot the deer either!
My county is about 2/3 or more agricultural in terms of land use - and the 2 major crops here are cabbage and potatoes. They're probably not the most popular things that people eat - and potatoes are also kind of fickle.
Note that my area gets hard freezes - just enough to kill stuff like most citrus - but doesn't get the chill hours necessary for things like most fruit trees. It's also hot as blazes in the summer. We can get tons of rain - or next to none. So irrigation is important (especially for commercial growers). OTOH - a week of bad rain during potato harvest season can wipe out 75%+ of the crop. A lot of our soils are mucky - and very alkaline. IOW - if I wanted to feed myself off my land - this is far from the first place I'd consider. If you ever try to grow your own food - in any way shape of form - you will develop a great appreciation of farmers. I think most people are better off learning the best places to shop in their areas - learning how to use coupons - and learning how to cook. Robyn
Although I'm a gardener - the gardening thing in terms of feeding myself isn't my cup of tea. And I'm not especially handy either.
But - if anyone is interested in the former - picking the right area/land is important. In terms of the crops you want to grow - what you can grow where the land is - what those crops need - how expensive those needs (ranging from fertilizer to irrigation) are. Etc. Also check into things if you want to hunt. I have about 3/4 acre - but most of it is hopeless in terms of growing food type things (except for herbs in barrels - and I"m really good at that). And I'm not allowed to shoot the deer either!
My county is about 2/3 or more agricultural in terms of land use - and the 2 major crops here are cabbage and potatoes. They're probably not the most popular things that people eat - and potatoes are also kind of fickle.
Note that my area gets hard freezes - just enough to kill stuff like most citrus - but doesn't get the chill hours necessary for things like most fruit trees. It's also hot as blazes in the summer. We can get tons of rain - or next to none. So irrigation is important (especially for commercial growers). OTOH - a week of bad rain during potato harvest season can wipe out 75%+ of the crop. A lot of our soils are mucky - and very alkaline. IOW - if I wanted to feed myself off my land - this is far from the first place I'd consider. If you ever try to grow your own food - in any way shape of form - you will develop a great appreciation of farmers. I think most people are better off learning the best places to shop in their areas - learning how to use coupons - and learning how to cook. Robyn
One more thing to consider about raising your own food is that you are not always going to be young, strong and energetic. It takes a lot of work, some of it backbreaking. Not that is isn't good exercise but you will reach a point when you can't do very much of it anymore. Sooner or later you'll find that the best thing to do is to be a good shopper and/or to go out to the farms at harvest time and buy in bulk. Here, you can buy lots of onions that you lay in the sun to cure and, stored properly, the can last most of the winter. You can get large supplies of carrots, winter squash and other vegetables that keep well.
Same goes for most do it yourself projects. You can save a lot of money when you're young enough by mowing your own lawn, trimming your shrubs, painting your house (inside and out), and making various repairs. But the point will come when you can no longer manage and you have to pay someone to do all these things for you. It's sad, but too true.
Rather than my whining about what hubby and I are dealing with, I should perhaps share what I have learned thus far.
We were on track to be well-situated in retirement. The net assets sheet looked great. Husband is older than I (7 years) so the idea was for him to work til I became eligible for Medicare, at which time we would be completely debt free and a nice retirement cushion. I will always work (as long as I am physically able) b/c I enjoy what I do.
We had a robust savings account in 2009, but we used a big chunk of it over the last years to pay off medical debt as it occurred and renovate our mountain cottage as well as some spiff-ups to our primary home (with an eye to resale at retirement). Meanwhile, we socked away every penny into employer-matched 401Ks. I put a small % (tiny amount) into a Roth account. We have a few stocks but they don't amount to a lot of money.
Now we have a major health crisis and hubby can no longer work.
So . . . cut expenses and sell the primary residence. We had planned to do that anyway - just not right now. We were going to sell that house, take part of the proceeds and pay cash for an addition onto the mountain cottage (hard for hubby to get around in that tiny space w/ a walker, much less a wheelchair).
Things would be much easier for us if we had kept more LIQUID ASSETS at our disposal.
If I had it to do over, I would have paid off the primary house, worked out payment plans over time on the medical bills (instead of writing out checks immediately), insisted our kids take out student loans for a big chunk of their educational costs, and instead of funneling every penny into TSAs, kept more cash in a money market account. And I would have gotten a HELOC and built on to the mountain cottage so that house was "move-in" ready, rather than planning to do that at hubby's retirement, AFTER our primary residence was sold.
I would suggest keeping a balance of $75-100K in a money market account -- rather than tying it up in CDs, IRAs, TSAs, etc.
In addition to hubby's medical situation, we have spent about $36K in the last few years on such things as hearing aids and dental work. To be frank, these are things we simply had not considered in our master plan. And hubby needs another dental implant ($4K) . . . and his audiologist advises he should consider another set of hearing aids - at a cost of about $7K. So I would suggest keeping money set aside for eventual unexpected dental and audiology expenses.
And never, ever have a financial plan that takes things right down to the wire with an assumed retirement date AFTER 65. Too many things can go wrong.
When you plan for retirement . . . you plan assuming that you will be enjoying those years with your companion. It all becomes rather meaningless when you realize the chances are very high that you will be alone for the majority of those future years.
My memory is not as good as it used to be - but it hasn't deserted me totally yet.
I'm sorry to hear about your husband's medical issues (you have perhaps mentioned them here before - but they are kind of new to me).
With what I recall about your mountain cottage - perhaps it's not the best place for the 2 of you to wind up now? I can't recall anything about your primary residence - but perhaps that's not the best place either. Have you thought of selling both - and winding up in a third place that might work better? I'm not recommending anything - and I don't care if you don't respond - just suggesting stuff you might think about. Sometimes - when the world turns "upside down" - it's best to step back - take a deep breath - and consider all the options.
A word about dental implants (from a really dentally impaired person ). Often - if you start to lose teeth as you get older - the immediate impulse is "I have to have all of them". IMO - if the bad teeth that have to be removed are either of the 2 back molars in any quadrant - there is no need to replace them. With expensive dental implants or bridges or anything. Removing the 2 back molars in any quadrant won't affect your smile - your ability to eat - etc. Also - if it's only a single tooth at/near the front - perhaps you don't need an implant to support a new bridge (OTOH - the bridge is usually much more expensive than the implant).
Also WRT hearing aids - I'm not that familiar with them. But my father (95) - after all of us kids beat him over the head - finally got hearing aids. With the aid of my tech-savvy brother - he got a pair of very sophisticated Siemens hearing aids (which my brother told me were the best) that cost him - with the remote - about $5500. Perhaps your husband has some condition that requires something more expensive. Perhaps not. Get a good doctor and make sure your husband gets what's best for him and doesn't overpay for something that might be inferior.
Finally - if you have to pay for all this stuff - get a new credit card where you get a great bonus (like 50k FF miles) for something like a $3k spend. If we have to pay for all this unexpected medical stuff - we might as well get something like a couple of free airline tickets out of it. There are all kinds of life skills. Some people are good at growing food. I am good at getting free FF airline tickets . Best of luck to you, Robyn
Few "families" can manage it today, because most women would rather go out and work, putting their kids in daycare, than to put up with a MIL or GMIL in the same house day in and day out.
This may sound sexist, but I do believe that men get along better with their MILs than women do with theirs.
I am 66 and retired. Only my 95 year old father is still alive. I could not have lived with any parents or in-laws in my house. The women would have tried to take over everything (and criticize everything I do from here until next Sunday) - and the men would have insisted (would insist in the case of my father) that I wait on them 24/7 (because that's what their wives/mothers did). Perhaps the mileage in other families varies. Robyn
I think it differs among the socioeconomic classes and, of course, ethnic groups. I don't know anyone who would prefer to put his or her child in day care, but I realize there are parents who would choose to do so.
However, based on my professional experience, it seems that it is the husband's mother who tends to cause conflict. I don't know why, but for some reason, mothers of sons seem to have more difficulty (to put it nicely) letting go. (I try to be extra careful not to give "motherly advice" to my sons and/or sons' significant others, but sometimes it just happens and I have to quickly backtrack.)
Modern day multigenerational housing is designed to allow for privacy among the different generations. I think it's a wonderful idea.
I really think the mileage varies from family to family. In my case - my late MIL was easier to deal with in terms of personality stuff than my late mother. OTOH - my late MIL was a slob - and my late mother always thought I didn't do enough around the house (because I don't do everything and my husband actually does stuff around the house). My idea of inter-generational housing is having parents live somewhere else . Robyn
My memory is not as good as it used to be - but it hasn't deserted me totally yet.
I'm sorry to hear about your husband's medical issues (you have perhaps mentioned them here before - but they are kind of new to me).
With what I recall about your mountain cottage - perhaps it's not the best place for the 2 of you to wind up now? I can't recall anything about your primary residence - but perhaps that's not the best place either. Have you thought of selling both - and winding up in a third place that might work better? I'm not recommending anything - and I don't care if you don't respond - just suggesting stuff you might think about. Sometimes - when the world turns "upside down" - it's best to step back - take a deep breath - and consider all the options.
A word about dental implants (from a really dentally impaired person ). Often - if you start to lose teeth as you get older - the immediate impulse is "I have to have all of them". IMO - if the bad teeth that have to be removed are either of the 2 back molars in any quadrant - there is no need to replace them. With expensive dental implants or bridges or anything. Removing the 2 back molars in any quadrant won't affect your smile - your ability to eat - etc. Also - if it's only a single tooth at/near the front - perhaps you don't need an implant to support a new bridge (OTOH - the bridge is usually much more expensive than the implant).
Also WRT hearing aids - I'm not that familiar with them. But my father (95) - after all of us kids beat him over the head - finally got hearing aids. With the aid of my tech-savvy brother - he got a pair of very sophisticated Siemens hearing aids (which my brother told me were the best) that cost him - with the remote - about $5500. Perhaps your husband has some condition that requires something more expensive. Perhaps not. Get a good doctor and make sure your husband gets what's best for him and doesn't overpay for something that might be inferior.
Finally - if you have to pay for all this stuff - get a new credit card where you get a great bonus (like 50k FF miles) for something like a $3k spend. If we have to pay for all this unexpected medical stuff - we might as well get something like a couple of free airline tickets out of it. There are all kinds of life skills. Some people are good at growing food. I am good at getting free FF airline tickets . Best of luck to you, Robyn
Thank you for your wise and measured words! Yes, we have thought of these things . . . and it would probably be wise to just sell everything and buy something else, but I am very emotionally attached to this mountain house and don't want to let it go. Plus, I am only 7 minutes or so from my son. Our primary residence is a 2 story Georgian and impractical now that hubby has issues with the stairs. For now, we will create a bedroom downstairs in what is now the living room . . . just not sure what we will do about that arrangement when we put it on the market. We are waiting to see if he will have surgery in the coming weeks. If he has a heart transplant (doubtful) there are a lot of considerations about where he will be recovering and for how long.
Yes, many differences in hearing aids. This is hubby's third pair. He has nerve damage and he works closely with a group of audiologists. Not much we can do about the cost. We found we can get prescription eyeglasses cheaper through Costco, but unfortunately, we can't work with them on the hearing aids.
We have two credit cards that reward FF miles and you better believe - we take advantage of them. Sadly, we have tickets booked right now for a trip in February but are in the process of trying to cancel everything, due to hubby's health situation.
Thank you for your thoughts and for caring about our situation.
One more thing to consider about raising your own food is that you are not always going to be young, strong and energetic. It takes a lot of work, some of it backbreaking. Not that is isn't good exercise but you will reach a point when you can't do very much of it anymore. Sooner or later you'll find that the best thing to do is to be a good shopper and/or to go out to the farms at harvest time and buy in bulk. Here, you can buy lots of onions that you lay in the sun to cure and, stored properly, the can last most of the winter. You can get large supplies of carrots, winter squash and other vegetables that keep well.
Same goes for most do it yourself projects. You can save a lot of money when you're young enough by mowing your own lawn, trimming your shrubs, painting your house (inside and out), and making various repairs. But the point will come when you can no longer manage and you have to pay someone to do all these things for you. It's sad, but too true.
This is an excellent point. For example.
Our tree guys were out here today. Excellent tree service in terms of the big deal stuff. Sculpturing the landscape (in my words). But they're not into picking up all the little branches and the like. So I try to set a good example - by helping to pick up the little deal stuff. And they do more than they would normally watching me work - but I can barely move tonight. And there's more to pick up in the coming weeks that all of us left behind.
My husband was our lawn guy until last year - when his MS got the better of him (and I'm sure many homeowner "lawn guys" wouldn't have lasted to age 68 with or without MS).
I think a lot depends on what your standards are - and what you can do without killing yourself. Robyn
One more thing to consider about raising your own food is that you are not always going to be young, strong and energetic. It takes a lot of work, some of it backbreaking. Not that is isn't good exercise but you will reach a point when you can't do very much of it anymore. Sooner or later you'll find that the best thing to do is to be a good shopper and/or to go out to the farms at harvest time and buy in bulk. Here, you can buy lots of onions that you lay in the sun to cure and, stored properly, the can last most of the winter. You can get large supplies of carrots, winter squash and other vegetables that keep well.
Same goes for most do it yourself projects. You can save a lot of money when you're young enough by mowing your own lawn, trimming your shrubs, painting your house (inside and out), and making various repairs. But the point will come when you can no longer manage and you have to pay someone to do all these things for you. It's sad, but too true.
The old man loves to garden. The stooping, bending, carrying, lifting, etc has put his arthritis of 10 years ago into complete remission (along with his spartan diet). Every year he's like a kid ordering seeds. He refuses to use a rototiller, he turns each garden bed lovingly with a shovel and hoe. Takes FOREVER to get his beds planted. I watch from the window and shake my head. For what the garden costs in terms of expensive seeds and fertilizers and mulch, we are losing money. It's just the two of us and for the little we eat, what we buy for $15/week at the local farmers' market is enough. I can't bring it up though, because I'm convinced his health is at stake. All that exercise along with his hiking is what's going to keep him going long after I've gone.
The old man loves to garden. The stooping, bending, carrying, lifting, etc has put his arthritis of 10 years ago into complete remission (along with his spartan diet). Every year he's like a kid ordering seeds. He refuses to use a rototiller, he turns each garden bed lovingly with a shovel and hoe. Takes FOREVER to get his beds planted. I watch from the window and shake my head. For what the garden costs in terms of expensive seeds and fertilizers and mulch, we are losing money. It's just the two of us and for the little we eat, what we buy for $15/week at the local farmers' market is enough. I can't bring it up though, because I'm convinced his health is at stake. All that exercise along with his hiking is what's going to keep him going long after I've gone.
Why does this always makes me laugh??? Does he call you his Old lady?
I am a strong believer in "use it or lose it"
I had an elderly neighbor lady from Latvia that had beautiful gardens (flower and veg) and did all the work herself - with a heart condition. She lived into her 90s (I had long moved away). Couch potatoes beware.
Given family health history and DNA there is a reasonable probability I will work until I die. More a case of early death than say, working until very advanced in age.
Should that not occur, we are going to likely end up in a moderately stretched situation. I am part of the infamously squeezed middle management. In real terms I make less than I did 10 years ago. We are house poor by choice as we bought during a better growth period but due to being in an area that is favored by global elites and that has little buildable land left, has held / risen in value. Between our house and our traditional retirement investments we will probably be able to get by after we cash out of the house.
Timing will be everything. If we see signs of a secular decline in real estate values in our area we may have to expedite cashing out.
After we cash out we will have to relo to a lower COLA area.
This is our plan, pathetic as it is.
Then there is always the S&W .44 mag, however the life insurance people would not look favorably at that. I don't want any loss of benes for Ms. Hillbilly.
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). Often - if you start to lose teeth as you get older - the immediate impulse is "I have to have all of them". IMO - if the bad teeth that have to be removed are either of the 2 back molars in any quadrant - there is no need to replace them. With expensive dental implants or bridges or anything. Removing the 2 back molars in any quadrant won't affect your smile - your ability to eat - etc. Also - if it's only a single tooth at/near the front - perhaps you don't need an implant to support a new bridge (OTOH - the bridge is usually much more expensive than the implant).
. Best of luck to you, Robyn
