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Poster was asking about staying a term of 10 yrs in Europe.
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No worries! I think you missed - The plan is to alternate 90-day stays in Schengen and non-Schengen countries, staying at each rental for at least 1 month.
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Originally Posted by pipersville_carol
Thank you for the thoughtful responses to our plan to bounce around Europe starting at age 60, settling down again in the U.S. at age 70. I was hesitant to share it because my husband and I have gotten some negative reactions from a few people in real life.
Here's how I arrived at the $5k/month budget. Let me know if I missed anything!
Storage unit in the US = $100
Phone/tech memberships/digital storage = $100
Airbnb @ $50/night = $1500
Food, entertainment @ $60/day = $1800
Health insurance = $1000
Car/train/plane tickets when needed = $500
Total = $5000
The plan is to alternate 90-day stays in Schengen and non-Schengen countries, staying at each rental for at least 1 month. Part of our time will be spent taking intensive language lessons in French, Italian, and German.
The journey will hopefully begin by sailing on the Queen Mary 2 from NYC to the U.K., and then spending two months in London getting our footing.
If we find that we're miserable after a year, we'll do something different. That's the beauty of it. Total flexibility.
No. Some countries in EU are more expensive than some cities in USA, and the same is true the opposite direction. Groceries are generally similar in cost, cheaper for some things but it evens out. There are often local cafes in neighborhoods away from tourist centers with affordable meals, especially for lunch. If you like Turkish food you're pretty much guaranteed to have a place nearby where a good meal can be had for cheap.
One way to eat cheap in Europe is take advantage of full service delis that more and more modern supermarkets have. Pre-made salads, rotisserie chickens, sandwiches/wraps, soups, selection of locals dishes sold by the kilo, etc. It's easy to get a meal for under five euros each, and some even have a small area to dine in.
This also has the advantage of being authentic local food. From my experience it's what the locals eat.
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kavm
No worries! I think you missed - The plan is to alternate 90-day stays in Schengen and non-Schengen countries, staying at each rental for at least 1 month.
got it... I have kept 'extra travel cars' in different locations for 30 yrs while traveling between, It is possible to do.
I don't do 'urban', and when in Europe, stay 90% in agritourismos / rural villages. As mentioned 'urban' works for some, rural for others. Do what best suits your needs.
It can be handy in Europe to keep a car in a lessor expensive country (for car / insurance, registration costs). After all... it is usually only a few hours train ride between countries. And in some destinations you do not want a car. When living in Europe I took my LHD vehicle to UK, not a great idea (ferry + tough to pass on 2 lane. In the future I would have a (2) cars in correct 'country specific' configurations. Used cars are CHEAP in most Europe countries (Locals prefer new).
I have friends that keep 'extra car / campervan in NZ, and Europe friends who do so in USA. (To a bit further extreme, but very viable / good idea based on their travel objectives.)
There are groups of travelers who share vehicles in foreign countries. 4-5 couples will buy a foreign based vehicle and travel / use it at different times.
Car / camper rental has been a huge % of travel expense for us, and appeared to be for Poster who inquired (if they plan on renting when needed).
If you are currently living in the USA, have you considered retiring outside of the US? If so, where and why? Thank you!
I plan to continue living in the US as long as I don't need a nursing home. If I do get to the point of needing that (which would be only in case of major neuro disability such as a paralyzing stroke, or dementia), my family has instructions to bring me over to a specific nursing home in Thailand (I discussed it with that nursing home as well - they are always able to offer an emergent admission to a shared room while being waitlisted for a private room. The cost of total care (eg, for immobile/incontinent patient, or severely demented) is equal to about $2,000 per month at this nursing home (yes, two thousand US$!). The place is not luxurious, but it is clean, comfortable, has a physician available in-house 24 hours a day, daily physical therapy, and of course 24/7 nursing care. If I get to the point of needing a nursing home, I will also be DNR, and will want only comfort measures, no major medical interventions, so will not need health insurance (ie, the minimal medical care that would interest me if I should get seriously neurologically disabled, or demented, can be easily covered out of pocket in Thailand. Btw, the quality of medicine in Bangkok is comparable to the US, but as I said, that is not even important to me, because I would move to Thailand only if I needed assistance with basic functions, at which point I would no longer want any medical care except relief of pain and simple comfort measures).
Actually, I am in Thailand right now, for one of the many repeat visits :-). Lovely country, nice polite people, very familiar with Westerners and their needs.
Sure and you can eat cheap in the USA at McDonald's, deli's and supermarket rotisserie chickens. Personally, I love Wendy's salads. However, sooner or later, it becomes unhealthy and rather depressing.
Deli food isn't necessary unhealthy, and you issues with depression because of food doesn't validate the claim that one must spend $60/day a day to east in Europe.
I plan to continue living in the US as long as I don't need a nursing home. If I do get to the point of needing that (which would be only in case of major neuro disability such as a paralyzing stroke, or dementia), my family has instructions to bring me over to a specific nursing home in Thailand (I discussed it with that nursing home as well - they are always able to offer an emergent admission to a shared room while being waitlisted for a private room. The cost of total care (eg, for immobile/incontinent patient, or severely demented) is equal to about $2,000 per month at this nursing home (yes, two thousand US$!).
Have you looked into the cost of transporting you to Thailand when you have had a paralyzing stroke or the like? You may be surprised how expensive that would be, especially if a private medical flight is needed.
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
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I keep my application filled out and ready to a USA SNF that is $1600/month. (In case I can't get to Thailand, Malaysia, Philippines, other USA medical refugee / tourism countries).
Deli food isn't necessary unhealthy, and you issues with depression because of food doesn't validate the claim that one must spend $60/day a day to east in Europe.
Maybe because I am in NY - an hour outside of NYC, food is expensive here. It is probably the same costs as Rome, Milan or Florence. My organic food prices are similar to Italy's big city food prices.
For two people, I spend $250 a month at Trader Joes, and probably another $600 a month or $20 per day at my local supermarket. Figure, I spend about $850 a month or $28 per day on average. If I go to my butcher more, obviously the average is higher.
If I have dinner out once a week, that is $400 per month for a very middle-of-the-road restaurant. I hardly eat out, but in a new city where everything is new and different, I would be more temped to eat out more. If I am sightseeing and away from home, I'll eat lunch out which is even more money.
If I go to a cafe while walking around a new city - even just to use a bathroom - it is $10 to $20. So twice a week, it is $40 to $80 a month. A couple of coffees and water in St. Marco's Square in Venice is $60 so I am talking about a hole-in-the-wall cafe.
I am up to $44 dollars a day.
This leaves $15 a day for sightseeing, museum fees, gelato or language classes.
In the 1970's, my parents took us to Italy using Arthur Frommer’s “Europe on 5 Dollars a Day.” Europe was still recovering from WWII which was only twenty five years early and its economy was still suffering. It isn't like that anymore.
What is cheaper is wine, bottle water (restaurants in Europe do not serve tap water, only bottle water) and rent.
I found this to be interesting
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Which countries in Europe are the cheapest to visit?
A good rule of thumb? The cost to travel to Europe’s most popular countries decreases as you go from North to South.
Less expensive countries include Poland, Portugal, Spain, and most of The Balkans. Albania, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Macedonia, and Bulgaria are particularly inexpensive. *Slovenia, Croatia, and Montenegro are significantly more expensive than the rest of the Balkans.
*These estimates are based on the average costs for food/accommodations/activities/transportation in the areas that tourists typically visit. Countries like Croatia, Greece, and Italy are much more affordable when you venture off the beaten track.
Last edited by YorktownGal; 11-12-2019 at 09:10 PM..
We are planning on moving to Italy during retirement. We are staying close to my husband's family town which is in southern Italy. He speaks Italian and the dialect of this region so we aren't depended on finding other English speakers.
Italian apartment leases usually are for three years. I am hoping to find one with a garden for way less than $1,000 per month. Having an apartment will be our cheapest option.
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Trip to Europe Cost for Accommodations
Accommodation is a huge chunk of the budget when figuring out any trip to Europe cost. In the cheaper countries, you’ll always be able to find a nice hotel for $40/night. During peak months in the more expensive countries, you’ll find very little for under $150/night.
Type of Accommodation Cost (total 1 person)
Hostels $15 – $35 for a dormitory bed
Budget Hotels $25 – $70/individual room
Mid-range Hotels $75 – $150
Air Bnb (entire apt) varies greatly by country (from $20/night- $150+/night)
Luxury Hotels $150 – $350+
*Costs are averages across Europe as of August 2018. The cheapest countries will see average accommodation costs on the far low end of these ranges, while the most expensive will hover around the high end.
We are planning on much more for food. This article says $30 per person, per meal is too low for anything but lunch. Dinner out with a bottle of water and a bottle of wine is more like $70 per person.
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Trip to Europe Cost of Food
In Europe’s cheapest countries, you’ll find yourself holding a check for $10 after a three-course meal and a carafe of wine. In the most expensive countries? You might be able to get a crepe in France or a bowl of fish soup in Helsinki for around the same price.
Needless to say, food prices are some of the greatest variances in a trip to Europe cost. On average, expect to spend between $5-$10 per meal in the cheaper countries and $15-$30 in the more expensive countries.
We will get a Eurorail pass so this doesn't really apply
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Trip to Europe Cost: Buses and Trains
Buses and trains are also popular options for traveling between European countries. Passes (namely Eurail) offer great discounts for youth passes (adults 27 years old and younger). Here are some of the average costs for transportation in Europe:
Inter-country Buses Starting as low as $5 with an average cost of $20, depending on distance
Metro costs: Varies greatly – from under $1/ride (Poland, Czech, Romania) up to $8+ (Sweden, UK, Denmark)
After three years, we'll have dual citizenship and will return back to the US. We'll see, but that's the plan for now.
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
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I found the raw / bulk food in rural Italy to be very affordable in Food Co-ops. (Cheap, as a matter-of-fact)
Eating while living in a country is far different the being a tourist without a kitchen! (dependent on eating out).
We ate out 3x (fancy / over $50 USA) during our last 1 yr RTW we did in 2016. We ate well as locals, very different pricing based on locations. Europe was generally as cheap as USA if using Grocery stores or "meat / cheese/ bread shops" (where there were no supermarkets).
We seldom eat an evening meal. Just a light late Breakfast (often at a 'fresh market) and a light late lunch (or Tapas / Happy hour)
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Be sure to understand your plans for EuroRail.
AFAIK, True Eurorail passes cannot be bought when 'in-country', only overseas or at a Military Commissary. (if you are so privileged / allowed to buy there)
There are also quite a few restrictions and for more than one person we have usually found it to be cheaper to buy local / resident fares.
I'm sure your local family has the best stats on options. Should be a nice plan for you.
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