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My crystal ball says it was the business partner. I read he kept on asking them for money, he was always broke. They were going to be evicted from their apartment in Oceanside and they bought a $315K house in Fallbrook with $100K. They had bad credit so don't know how they could do that.
This case is a mess, with so many twists. I also heard the biz partner said to the husband, 'Shut your wife's mouth or I'll shut it for her'. What does that relate to... was she blabbing about underhanded practices... arguing with the partner on another matter... going to involve the police with the biz partner? Their choices almost seem incomprehensible. Facing eviction, but have $ for a house? Maybe they were just scamming free rent? The wife also had a scam mortgage operation, so perhaps she was able to manipulate documents?
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All of a sudden they show up with all of this money. Then weeks before their disappearance they are googling if children need passports into Mexico, as if they had planned to take off to Mexico. I think they were being threatened. The last phone call was to his partner for a minute. Usually, the murderer involves someone close to the person.
One theory, according to the interview with Rick, is they may have gone to MX for 1-yr, then come back & were killed. I'd say unlikely since their money was untouched in the bank. I suppose forensics should be able to tell how long they've been buried. Hopefully soon.
The book just arrived so I will read it this weekend, and will listen to the interview. I know there are many twists and turns but I hope after doing both I will at least have a grasp on what might have happened in this very sad case.
If the detectives have not solved it, I don't know why I think I will based on this "evidence" but at least I will know more than I do now. I think it is the fact that the kids were involved that I have a hard time letting go of this one. Who does that to young, innocent children? Even if you hate or are enraged with an adult, who kills an innocent child, and in this case two innocent children? I can't wrap my mind around that one.
I still can't even handle the fact they left their dogs with no food or water. That is why I think they were kidnapped or where ever they went, they ran into major harm, right away. They had planned to come right back home.
You mentioned Brittany Killgore earlier, that too was a horrific case but at least they found the involved parties right away. And it was hard to even type her last name with what happened to her. Creepy...
The book just arrived so I will read it this weekend, and will listen to the interview.
You mentioned Brittany Killgore earlier, that too was a horrific case but at least they found the involved parties right away. And it was hard to even type her last name with what happened to her. Creepy...
I know, it's all awful. And, further, I'm such a scaredy-cat, I can't read the books. They're too disturbing & often provide too many details. I also don't want to see crime scene photos, as are listed in some books.
I can listen to interviews, because if they become too gruesome I turn them off. If it's a book, I started it, invested hours in it, so want to finish it, no matter what. Not good for successive days of repeated nightmares & trying to sleep with a light on... especially with those serial killer books. Still, I think the interest in some of these cases is like you, with children or young girls involved, I just feel the world has righted itself in a way when the killers finally end up in jail.
The Vanishing McStays
What About...
Posted: 21 Nov 2013 03:07 PM PST
What about the alleged Bobcat dirt mover tracks that Mike McStay found? Why would the graves only be "1-2 feet deep" if a Bobcat was used? Do you think that LE had already observed these tracks, being that they had been at the scene for a week?
What about the FBI taking over the case in April? Why do you think they would arbitrarily do this?
What about the "alleged" dirt bike rider? I have talked to four law enforcement sources who tell me that have no idea the identity of this person, that he is a ghost. If he exists, why has he not been identified?
What about the statement from LE on Anderson Cooper that it is possible that the family left and then came back?
What is it about these preceding four statements that smells, just a bit?
I know, it's all awful. And, further, I'm such a scaredy-cat, I can't read the books. They're too disturbing & often provide too many details. I also don't want to see crime scene photos, as are listed in some books.
I can listen to interviews, because if they become too gruesome I turn them off. If it's a book, I started it, invested hours in it, so want to finish it, no matter what. Not good for successive days of repeated nightmares & trying to sleep with a light on... especially with those serial killer books. Still, I think the interest in some of these cases is like you, with children or young girls involved, I just feel the world has righted itself in a way when the killers finally end up in jail.
I couldn't wait until the weekend so started the book. Only half way though, been working 12-hour days, not much time to read. Very interesting with many twists and turns. It is not scary, no bad photos, just a photo of the house, some family photos.
I find the part about his brother very interesting. When the Father who lives in Texas was asking Mike the brother to check on the family, Mike claimed he was "too busy" and "didn't have time". Mike claimed to the Father he had gone to house on February 10th, but he had not. (They went missing on February 4th).
Why would Mike lie to their Father? Mike finally went to the house on February 13th. That was a Saturday and even then he told his Father he did not want to report they were missing until February 15th even though the clues in the house were that they left suddenly. Mike called the police that day and the deputies immediately called homicide detectives because the length of time they were missing and the condition of the house. They had been missing 11 days when it was reported.
Meanwhile someone who used to work with Joseph began hacking Joseph's accounts on Saturday, February 6th he withdrew $2,000. $2,000 more on February 15th and $3,000 on February 18th transferring money from Joseph's account into his. Mike called this person "Dan the Hacker". How did "Dan the Hacker" know that Joseph was missing (and most likely dead) on February 6th and start withdrawing his money? This was two days after they had left and even the family did not know they were missing or so the story goes.
There is a lot about Summer's background. Was involved in mortgage modifications and it turned out that the company was a complete fraud. Collected money up front and did nothing to modify the mortgage and the people ended up being foreclosed on. The guy that ran the company was arrested two days before Summer disappeared, but not for all mortgage scam business, but for stalking an ex-girlfriend. I don't think Summer knew this guy was a fraud until the end. Since she had a real estate license she said she was going to try and help her clients short sale their homes. I don't see any of this info related to the killings.
Summer had about ten aliases. A real hot-headed temper. Sent her husband horrible e-mails full of threats and in my opinion she bullied him. He was a laid-back surfer type and for whatever reason seemed very level-headed and put up with her craziness. I know her family hated this stuff coming out, but the e-mails she wrote were really bad, but so far I don't tie them into murder.
There is much more but the brother's strange behavior and the former associate hacking and stealing the money two days after they went missing are the most troubling things I have read so far. Most siblings would be very frantic if an entire family was missing and he was not. The stealing of the money and the timing, very creepy too.
Thanks for taking the time for updates, Shelby & Happy. I haven't read the book & I'm saying this on gut instinct only (which is an assumption & probably wrong)... but, my instinct is not to like/trust Summer. However, it seems there are all kinds of shady folk surrounding the entire family. Either they were naive, the same or incredibly unlucky & careless.
I couldn't wait until the weekend so started the book. Only half way though, been working 12-hour days, not much time to read. Very interesting with many twists and turns. It is not scary, no bad photos, just a photo of the house, some family photos.
I find the part about his brother very interesting. When the Father who lives in Texas was asking Mike the brother to check on the family, Mike claimed he was "too busy" and "didn't have time". Mike claimed to the Father he had gone to house on February 10th, but he had not. (They went missing on February 4th).
Why would Mike lie to their Father? Mike finally went to the house on February 13th. That was a Saturday and even then he told his Father he did not want to report they were missing until February 15th even though the clues in the house were that they left suddenly. Mike called the police that day and the deputies immediately called homicide detectives because the length of time they were missing and the condition of the house. They had been missing 11 days when it was reported.
Meanwhile someone who used to work with Joseph began hacking Joseph's accounts on Saturday, February 6th he withdrew $2,000. $2,000 more on February 15th and $3,000 on February 18th transferring money from Joseph's account into his. Mike called this person "Dan the Hacker". How did "Dan the Hacker" know that Joseph was missing (and most likely dead) on February 6th and start withdrawing his money? This was two days after they had left and even the family did not know they were missing or so the story goes.
There is a lot about Summer's background. Was involved in mortgage modifications and it turned out that the company was a complete fraud. Collected money up front and did nothing to modify the mortgage and the people ended up being foreclosed on. The guy that ran the company was arrested two days before Summer disappeared, but not for all mortgage scam business, but for stalking an ex-girlfriend. I don't think Summer knew this guy was a fraud until the end. Since she had a real estate license she said she was going to try and help her clients short sale their homes. I don't see any of this info related to the killings.
Summer had about ten aliases. A real hot-headed temper. Sent her husband horrible e-mails full of threats and in my opinion she bullied him. He was a laid-back surfer type and for whatever reason seemed very level-headed and put up with her craziness. I know her family hated this stuff coming out, but the e-mails she wrote were really bad, but so far I don't tie them into murder.
There is much more but the brother's strange behavior and the former associate hacking and stealing the money two days after they went missing are the most troubling things I have read so far. Most siblings would be very frantic if an entire family was missing and he was not. The stealing of the money and the timing, very creepy too.
More later gotta finish the book...
Just out of curiosity, how did they say all of these private emails from her to her husband have gotten out? Who provided a copy of all these emails?
Just out of curiosity, how did they say all of these private emails from her to her husband have gotten out? Who provided a copy of all these emails?
Hiya ER... Nice to see you. I'll wait for Happy's reply, but wanted to add the following. The computer was confiscated by police. The writer of the book, Rick petitioned a lot of info under the Freedom of Info Act.
Maybe when Happy gets to that part, she'll let us know about anything potentially deleted from the computer. Apparently (according to the interview posted), the biz partner or brother (I always forget) stole the computer from their home, either the day of or after they disappeared, had it for 1-wk before the police discovered it & demanded he return it immediately or face arrest for interfering with an ongoing investigation.
Later, when Rick asked the biz partner or brother what the police had said (knowing full well, as he had petitioned their records), he lied & said they were in no hurry & understood why he took it. That comment & a few other lies from him made Rick decide something was wrong & he went full force into investigating the case. Of course, at that point, he felt they were alive & the partner/brother were covering for them... not necessarily that he'd killed them.
I wonder who could be cold enough to kill children? It just doesn't seem possible someone could be so cold hearted.
Just out of curiosity, how did they say all of these private emails from her to her husband have gotten out? Who provided a copy of all these emails?
Wow you two are up late! Everything I am posting is from the book. I want to read the book first then listen to the interview. I know the interview will have more up to date info, but I want to read the book then hear the interview so I am sort of a at home detective working my way through this very sad case.
First some background of the brother from the book: Mike claimed he was close to his brother which was disputed by some of Joseph's friends who believed that Mike had always to some extent been jealous of Joseph. Mike had a hard time financially and had been turning to his brother for assistance. Summer claimed to her sister that Mike had borrowed $10,000. Summer had more than one major confrontation with Mike about "habitual borrowing with no intent of ever paying it back." This is per Summer's family.
Joseph had been gone only one month when Mike transferred $5,000 our to Joseph's account. Then Mike began to intercept his receivables. It is worth noting that Joseph and his Dad (Patrick) were close but Mike and his Dad were not.
Mike took Joseph's computer and Mike's claims for only one day or two before law enforcement realized it was missing. The author thinks if Mike took the computer on February 6th and then returned it on February 15th he had plenty of time to get into his e-mails. Joseph had a habit of e-mailing himself his passwords. Mike had access of all of Joseph's accounts from Paypal, business, and banking accounts.
Not before they disappeared, but after! A few months after they disappeared Mike went to the house loaded up all of their possessions and sold everything on Ebay and Craig's List. He made conflicting statements to the media about this.
Rick says the reason he wrote the book was when he interviewed Mike on his radio show he had at the time, he felt Mike was withholding information, he had remade himself into the victim, instead of his brother and his family.
Patrick (the Father) provided hundreds of pages of evidence to Rick from police reports which included the information from the e-mail accounts. Early on Patrick and Rick spoke by phone almost daily. But Patrick did not reveal everything.
Finally after many months Rick learned that Patrick had withheld certain documents from him, including e-mails, trying to protect the family and their professional relationship ended. He said Patrick wanted him to write a book that showed the family as the "Brady Bunch" and withheld documents that would show otherwise.
At that point the family stopped working with Rick. He was contacted by an investigative group who had hundreds of pages of documents related to this case, unknown except to law enforcement and the family.
It does not say it but I believe they must have gotten the info from the freedom of information act.
Early on the book says Patrick believed the family was dead or else they would have contacted him. Joseph used to contact his Father almost daily. That was why Patrick was demanding Mike check on his brother. The fact that Mike said he had when he had not, and then wait a few extra days to report them missing to the police, to me is a giant red flag. Rick the author was convinced they had left on their own and had an agenda. Sadly Patrick was right all along.
I am off today, will finish the book. Will write anything else I think is major but so far it is follow the money. The brother and "Dan the hacker" were stealing from Joseph. But to have the level of hate to murder the family, that still does not make sense.
I had read somewhere else they filed for bankruptcy a few back, but then paid 325k cash for the house in Fallbrook. Not to mention 100k in the bank. He installed water fountains? Not an expert by any means but how would they get all the money in only a few years?
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I haven't read the book & I'm saying this on gut instinct only (which is an assumption & probably wrong)... but, my instinct is not to like/trust Summer. However, it seems there are all kinds of shady folk surrounding the entire family. Either they were naive, the same or incredibly unlucky & careless.
