Chick-fil-A Opening in the Bay Area? (San Francisco, Oakland: middle-class, salon, income)

[sav858]

Originally Posted by 04kL4nD

this Yelp argument is retarded

the number of people who use Yelp in Oakland is going to be way higher than a city like Omaha. I really shouldn't have to explain why

I don't really see why that matters since it was being used just to see how many specific type of establishments there were, not anything having to do with review or users.

Either way I agree it's not a good source since I'm not sure how they determine their geographic boundaries for a search over a larger area like an entire city.

[04kL4nD]

i get your point, i just thought it was a terrible metric

i think as anti-fast food as people in the bay area claim to be, I'm surprised there are ANY fast food franchises in the city limits of sf/oak/berkeley...

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by 04kL4nD

i get your point, i just thought it was a terrible metric

i think as anti-fast food as people in the bay area claim to be, I'm surprised there are ANY fast food franchises in the city limits of sf/oak/berkeley...

They're what's left over of a bygone era. The McDonald's on the Berkeley/Oakland border on San Pablo, The one on University and Shattuck in Berkeley and the Carl's Jr. on Market st. in SF tend to be filled with homeless people or people near homelessness. The Carl's on Telegraph and West MacArthur in Oakland is never busy. People in these areas really aren't into fast food. I got a little more into it after living in San Diego for a long time. McD's for breakfast but Carl's any other time and then only about once a month or so.

[04kL4nD]

Yeah but by the same token, the Taco Bell on Telegraph/W Grand is usually pretty busy- esp after 2am when everyone is drunk and coming home from the bar

I think the main thing is that poor people generally consume more fast food than any other demographic. Poor people really can't afford to be 'foodies', even if they happen to live in the Bay Area

[jade408]

Originally Posted by 04kL4nD

Yeah but by the same token, the Taco Bell on Telegraph/W Grand is usually pretty busy- esp after 2am when everyone is drunk and coming home from the bar

I think the main thing is that poor people generally consume more fast food than any other demographic. Poor people really can't afford to be 'foodies', even if they happen to live in the Bay Area

I don't know about that. The Bay Area is weird. Shop at Whole Foods in Berkeley or Oakland, and you'll see a huge spectrum of income levels. Of course, whole foods in Walnut Creek, San Ramon, and Los Gatos are really different. I think if my first WF experience hadn't been the Berkeley one, I probably would shop there at all. Many WF stores feel very snooty.

And let's not forget about the people on food stamps going to Whole Paycheck, Trader Joes and the farmers market.

Some of my friends are "foodies" and they are at the low end of the income scale. Albeit they are singles, but they buy mostly organic/free range/etc and make $30k/yr.

I find, that in the Bay Area, more people across income levels are very concerned about the food they eat. There are natural grocers, CSAs etc in West Oakland. And they aren't targeting the "hipsters" and "artists" that are moving into the area. Also, Kaiser runs farmers markets at many of their locations for their workers and the community that are cheaper than the popular ones like Grand Lake/Ferry Building/Temescal, that are much more expensive.

[sav858]

Originally Posted by 04kL4nD

I think the main thing is that poor people generally consume more fast food than any other demographic. Poor people really can't afford to be 'foodies', even if they happen to live in the Bay Area

Exactly, which is why I mentioned demographics when I said parts of Oakland have plenty of fast food and the rest of the inner east bay.

[sav858]

Originally Posted by jade408

I don't know about that. The Bay Area is weird. Shop at Whole Foods in Berkeley or Oakland, and you'll see a huge spectrum of income levels.

How do you know the income levels of strangers in a WF store?

I find, that in the Bay Area, more people across income levels are very concerned about the food they eat.

By "Bay Area" do you mean primarily Berekely and Oakland? I never really noticed many lower income people in Vallejo, Concord, Pittsburgh, or Antioch too concerned with eating organic or healthy or being anything that resembled a foodie.

I just find it interesting that some of you that live in the Oakland/Berekely area always talk about your experiences in that area and apply it to the rest of the region.

[jade408]

Originally Posted by sav858

How do you know the income levels of strangers in a WF store?
By "Bay Area" do you mean primarily Berekely and Oakland? I never really noticed many lower income people in Vallejo, Concord, Pittsburgh, or Antioch too concerned with eating organic or healthy or being anything that resembled a foodie.

I just find it interesting that some of you that live in the Oakland/Berekely area always talk about your experiences in that area and apply it to the rest of the region.

Berkeley and Oakland are the "trend setters" in these sorts of things but they filter out to the more suburban parts as well. Backyard gardening is exploding. My parents, who live near Lodi, are now on the organic bandwagon after clowning on me about for years. Now they grow about 60% of their own produce because it is cheaper and reminds them if what they got when growing up ie tastier. (they are retired and in a fixed income). Their neighbors do the same thing and try all trade produce. This is obviously very far from the Berkeley and Oakland in attitude an lifestyle.

My parents are decidedly not foodies but they have some foodie tendencies.

Regular groceries like Safeway and Lucky's wouldn't be adding organics and local produce if there wasn't interest from "mainstream" America.

And almost every city or town in the bay area has a farmers market. And kaiser runs them at almost every one of their locations. Not just the ones in Oakland. The one in south Hayward is huge. Not exactly a high income area.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by 04kL4nD

Yeah but by the same token, the Taco Bell on Telegraph/W Grand is usually pretty busy- esp after 2am when everyone is drunk and coming home from the bar

I think the main thing is that poor people generally consume more fast food than any other demographic. Poor people really can't afford to be 'foodies', even if they happen to live in the Bay Area

Perhaps busy to local standards but the following quote still seems to hold more truth:

Originally Posted by jade408

I don't know about that. The Bay Area is weird. Shop at Whole Foods in Berkeley or Oakland, and you'll see a huge spectrum of income levels. Of course, whole foods in Walnut Creek, San Ramon, and Los Gatos are really different. I think if my first WF experience hadn't been the Berkeley one, I probably would shop there at all. Many WF stores feel very snooty.

And let's not forget about the people on food stamps going to Whole Paycheck, Trader Joes and the farmers market.

Some of my friends are "foodies" and they are at the low end of the income scale. Albeit they are singles, but they buy mostly organic/free range/etc and make $30k/yr.

I find, that in the Bay Area, more people across income levels are very concerned about the food they eat. There are natural grocers, CSAs etc in West Oakland. And they aren't targeting the "hipsters" and "artists" that are moving into the area. Also, Kaiser runs farmers markets at many of their locations for their workers and the community that are cheaper than the popular ones like Grand Lake/Ferry Building/Temescal, that are much more expensive.

Lower income people around here still want to eat as good as they can I've noticed. Maxx Value Food on MacArthur in Laurel gets shoppers from all over East Oakland, a good number of them lower income. They have an organic produce section and many of the lower income people there shop in that section. To the point where one lady told me to pick my vegetables out there because it was better since it was organic. People up here just seem to know no matter the income level. Similarly, Wrigley's in San Diego serves a similar demographic and unless things have changed recently, they have no organic section. Just the stables most lower income folks in most places shop for.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by jade408

Berkeley and Oakland are the "trend setters" in these sorts of things

Berkeley,Oakland and SF set the trends for just about everything here. They are as close to geographic center as it's possible to get. For better or for worse they are collectively the cultural center of the Bay Area. What most people think of or stereotype the Bay Area as, like it or not. Of course it all starts here. Anyone who doesn't realize this is completely out of touch with this area.