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It is unclear what the OP is really looking for since he seems to want to work at startups but has IT skills instead of the software skills that are what startups want.
Yes, I am saying that right now all you need to get a "lucrative, upwardly mobile career in tech" in silicon valley that pays very well is the 2 thing in my post (something to get your resume past recruiters, able to code). You and jade408 make it seem like you have to be a specialist with a certain personality and connections. I think that is misleading to anyone reading this forum as companies lately are so desperate for programmers, that is simply not true.
You need to be special enough for people to both find and read your resume. Many companies do not even have humans do the first resume screen. This is where connections help you. A real person will glance at your resume. Secondly, it is really really hard to represent on a resume that you are good at a wide variety of duties. Even when you are. This is where having a standout skill, school or certification comes in handy.
Do no underestimate the role of cultural fit. There is no one version, every company is different. But for most small stage startups, being a good work goes hand in hand with wanting coworkers they want to go to happy hour with. This is another place where connections help you a lot, you have been pre-vetted as fitting in. It is not unlike high school, but every company has a different personality. It takes about 150 people for the happy hour test to become less important. Being likable (and having the right interests) goes a long way in getting a job here.
Fellow Northeaster here who is also trying to get to the Bay Area. Also an immigrant. Also hate the weather out here. Also love tech. Etc. Etc. I want to try and offer you a balanced perspective.
First, "follow your dreams" is dangerous, naive advice—and I say this as an optimist. It should be "follow your dreams, but...". That said, if you are 100% committed to making this move and making it work, it is possible. You can fight the odds and win, and I think almost everyone on this thread want you to succeed and hope you're an exception.
However, you are still, after all these pages, drastically underestimating what is involved in your plan(s). You characterized it earlier as being "flamed," and I strongly encourage you to re-think that. People are not trying to flame you, they're trying to get through to someone who does not have a realistic grasp of life in the Bay Area. And I know this as an outsider! I am a risk-taker, but would not make the move in your shoes.
OK, still adamant about proceeding? Here's what you can do:
1. APPLY FOR JOBS NOW. If you get a lot of bites, then that's a great indicator that the market wants you. You don't even necessarily need to take a job—apply, do Skype & phone interviews, get flown out for in-person interviews etc and see what people are saying. Keep in mind that "being qualified" (I've learned this the hard way) has so, so little to do with getting a job. You are going to find job ads that look like 100% matches; hell, it could almost be a copy-and-paste of your current job description. It could straight up ask for someone exactly like you in every way. And you will still hear nothing back. But, prove us all wrong and get very strong leads remotely as a way to test the waters. Either this leads to a real job or is just great practice & research.
2. Do way more research. Crime stats, neighborhood info, etc is all online. Use Padmapper and/or Craigslist to get a sense of not just rental costs, but check often to also note how fast they're being filled. Be sure you're accounting for fees, deposits, upfront rent, etc. Open Google Maps or anything else and actually plot out your commute—Google even lets you check exact times, e.g. arriving by 9am on a Tuesday. Take Google's estimates and cross-reference with BART or other local transportation. You really need to map out your entire life there. If you don't have spreadsheets piling up, then get crackin'. You (and I) are looking at a massive life change and I think what a lot of people here have been reacting to is your generally flippant attitude about it.
3. Use cost-of-living calculators. Use multiple to get a sense of averages, and compare that with what you need to maintain your standards. Or, the standards you're willing to go down to. As everyone's been trying to get through to you, housing is going to punch you in the face hard, but you can almost assuredly look forward to slightly cheaper utilities. And fruit. (Good luck with those making up for the housing increase.)
Anyway, sorry if this is a downer and if you feel attacked. I'm just in a very similar situation to you and cannot believe how closed off you are to advice. To make this move, you can't just be "realistic," you have to be downright pessimistic so that you can really account for all contingencies. Then, be pleasantly surprised. California has been a siren song for two hundred years now—learn from the millions who've gone before you.
Remember - the calculators are all wrong, all of them. They significantly understate the difference in housing costs, I'm not sure why, I think it varies from calculator to calculator.
That's why it's easiest to look at raw numbers of housing sales and rental prices. Basically, most people shouldn't move here unless they are sure they can get on a path of progressive career growth. Merely becoming a developer, and staying static in your skill set is a recipe for topping out at a low level, an an inadequate one to raise a family on. If you already have a family, and you've come home from work, can you spend evenings expanding your skill set and ignoring your children?
If you top out at 100k, you absolutely need a partner earning that same amount to have a middle class lifestyle. If you stay single at 100k, you're fine, of course. But ignoring all this is a recipe for pain down the road. Many people do give up and leave, typically those without family here or without the career progression.
Remember - the calculators are all wrong, all of them. They significantly understate the difference in housing costs, I'm not sure why, I think it varies from calculator to calculator.
That's why it's easiest to look at raw numbers of housing sales and rental prices. Basically, most people shouldn't move here unless they are sure they can get on a path of progressive career growth. Merely becoming a developer, and staying static in your skill set is a recipe for topping out at a low level, an an inadequate one to raise a family on. If you already have a family, and you've come home from work, can you spend evenings expanding your skill set and ignoring your children?
If you top out at 100k, you absolutely need a partner earning that same amount to have a middle class lifestyle. If you stay single at 100k, you're fine, of course. But ignoring all this is a recipe for pain down the road. Many people do give up and leave, typically those without family here or without the career progression.
Honestly, if you plan that whole 2 kids thing with a partner, and you want a commute under about an hour with decent middle class schools, you really need to up that household income to about $300k. And if you want an upper class lifestyle or commute under 30 minutes that number looks a lot more like $400k. This is not an exaggeration. I have plenty of 2 income household friends here with kids and each partner making $100K+ and as newcomers they cannot afford to buy a home. If you have some family wealth to fall back on our family home here in the Bay Area with lots of equity you might have some space to lower those margins. As it stands today, incomes do not line up with housing costs in about 85-90% of the Bay Area. People who currently live in most places could not afford the housing costs if they had to get in right now. They would need triple the median income, or more in many places.
Honestly, if you plan that whole 2 kids thing with a partner, and you want a commute under about an hour with decent middle class schools, you really need to up that household income to about $300k..... I have plenty of 2 income household friends here with kids and each partner making $100K+ and as newcomers they cannot afford to buy a home.
Jade, quick question, since I'm in that boat. I think that it's possible to afford a home - in the 750k to 900k range, with an income of 225k to 250k, if you have a down payment, can bid strategically, and are flexible on where you go. (i.e. some properties come up in places like San Ramon, Walnut Creek, or Fremont, or San Rafael - though none is really less than an hour and all 3 are competitive right now. I watch prices, nobody has to write in and correct me.) There are only a small number of cities where this is possible, of course. (Of course 300k is much safer and offers some actual choices, but forget that for now, since I don't for.)
I'm curious about your friends, the ones who can't afford a house right now. Are they making closer to 200k than to 250k, and do they have 20% down, or are they struggling or waiting to save that 20%? You can send me a personal message if you don't want to respond.
Or are these ones focused on certain towns that they're priced out of, or have they struggled to learn how to bid and gotten dispirited and gave up after too many failures?
I hope I'm not too far off, we're closer to 230k, but need to save more. If by then we've had several more years of appreciation, we actually might have to leave, which is not a happy decision.
People have no freaking idea how serious all of this is, they blithely move somewhere and think, ah, I'll make enough, I'll make sure that that happens, I'll get equity, I'll get rich, I'm a great coder, whatever, etc etc.
Jade, quick question, since I'm in that boat. I think that it's possible to afford a home - in the 750k to 900k range, with an income of 225k to 250k, if you have a down payment, can bid strategically, and are flexible on where you go. (i.e. places like Walnut Creek, or Fremont, or San Rafael - though all 3 are competitive right now. ) There are only a small number of places where this is possible, of course. (of course 300k is much safer and offers some actual choices, but forget that for now.)
I think that is a fairly reasonable income for that price range, but the pesky cash buyers and trade-up people are making it hard.
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I'm curious about your friends, the ones who can't afford a house right now. Are they making closer to 200k than to 250k, and do they have 20% down, or are they struggling or waiting to save that 20%?
Or are these ones focused on certain towns that they're priced out of, or have they struggled to learn how to bid and gotten dispirited and gave up after too many failures?
It is a mix of things. My married with kids friends all work in South Bay, and even a commute from Fremont is too far for them. They are willing to compromise on somethings but not much on school quality and commute time. They are also priced out of the areas nearest to their jobs. And we are all in agreement, so many of these things are just so overpriced, since so many people have let's call it "free money" and are willing to pay the ridiculous prices for very modest properties. They'd rather wait it out so they can afford the lifestyle they want. Renting is a better deal for them right now and they'd rather do that. 2 of them also have "investment" properties in cheaper metros and they are cashflow positive.
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I hope I'm not too far off, we're closer to 230k, but need to save more. If by then we've had several more years of appreciation, we actually might have to leave, which is not a happy decision.
People have no freaking idea how serious all of this is, they blithely move somewhere and think, ah, I'll make enough, I'll make sure that that happens, I'll get equity, I'll get rich, I'm a great coder, whatever, etc etc.
Honestly, I'd love to buy something too, but I am not partnered. And things are just way to out of scale with incomes, no way is it sustainable at the current pace. I am waiting for the bust. Because the current prices are not even remotely based on fundamentals. I think if you can find something and still pay that 25-30% of your income for your mortgage it is good, otherwise you might as well wait and save up. Sadly the cost of family life here is so ridiculous, it might make more sense to leave once you have kids.
Honestly, if you plan that whole 2 kids thing with a partner, and you want a commute under about an hour with decent middle class schools, you really need to up that household income to about $300k. And if you want an upper class lifestyle or commute under 30 minutes that number looks a lot more like $400k. This is not an exaggeration. I have plenty of 2 income household friends here with kids and each partner making $100K+ and as newcomers they cannot afford to buy a home. If you have some family wealth to fall back on our family home here in the Bay Area with lots of equity you might have some space to lower those margins. As it stands today, incomes do not line up with housing costs in about 85-90% of the Bay Area. People who currently live in most places could not afford the housing costs if they had to get in right now. They would need triple the median income, or more in many places.
I think this is only true if you are commuting to jobs in the South Bay (and even then, you can probably do it for less if you're willing to cross the Dumbarton). If you are commuting to SF (or even better, Oakland), there are a lot better, more affordable housing options. Cities like Benicia, Martinez, Pleasant Hill, Castro Valley, and Alameda all have good schools and less expensive housing than comparable places in the South Bay. You could find a 3 bed SFH in some of these places for $600-700k. You could do it for less than $500k in parts of the East/North Bay if you are willing to put up with mediocre (not bad) schools.
Cities like Benicia, Martinez, Pleasant Hill, Castro Valley, and Alameda all have good schools and less expensive housing than comparable places in the South Bay. You could find a 3 bed SFH in some of these places for $600-700k. You could do it for less than $500k in parts of the East/North Bay if you are willing to put up with mediocre (not bad) schools.
I know all these places well. The thing is, unless you are very secure that you can peg yourself to the SF market, (I am not and doubt I will be) it is unwise to buy in a place that is only accessible to SF.
Most people who are either new here or don't live here have no idea that the south bay and santa clara county have far more tech jobs than SF, and that won't change. SF can't build enough to really compete, even if they build out all available land. Points south are growing, too. Also, the jobs in the south are spread apart, which further complicates things. Bad planning, really.
This thread makes SD real estate seem like an absolute steal lol
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