Bay Bridge Protesters Blaming thr rest of us for Slavery & Racism? (2015, lawyers)

[zitsky]

Originally Posted by jade408

No it doesn't make that assumption at all. Opening up seats to more people doesn't mean there are none for you.

You are mixing up all sorts of concepts here. Diversity can mean any number of things. You are also mixing in privilege.

The concept of privilege doesn't mean that all white people start at the same place, but being white doesn't make you lose points like being a person of color can in many circumstances (or being female, or disabled....)

This video does an excellent job of explaining how privilege is quite layered.

There are definitely scenarios where minorities are disadvantaged. But the African American son or daughter of an African American doctor or lawyer has more privilege than a Caucasian who grew up in the projects or the trailer park. But I guess the question becomes, if my theoretical African American and Caucasian get stopped by the police, who will get better treatment.

[jade408]

Originally Posted by zitsky

There are definitely scenarios where minorities are disadvantaged. But the African American son or daughter of an African American doctor or lawyer has more privilege than a Caucasian who grew up in the projects or the trailer park. But I guess the question becomes, if my theoretical African American and Caucasian get stopped by the police, who will get better treatment.

Sort of. Definitely on many levels. But when that black person walks in the room no one will make that assumption. Again privilege is layered. Like the video I shared. And there are forms of privilege beyond race: height, ability, gender, size, class and education all play a part.

[HockeyMac18]

Originally Posted by zitsky

There are definitely scenarios where minorities are disadvantaged. But the African American son or daughter of an African American doctor or lawyer has more privilege than a Caucasian who grew up in the projects or the trailer park. But I guess the question becomes, if my theoretical African American and Caucasian get stopped by the police, who will get better treatment.

This is probably debatable and highly situational-dependent. What happens when the white kid and black kid are in a new area together - and people are meeting them for the first time? There are inherent/physiological things that occur in daily life that happen to black people that just never happen to white people. This is what the word "privilege" is getting at.

You're probably right that the black kid will have more opportunity with their greater wealth, more educational opportunities, etc. (you didn't use these words, but I think this is the point you were trying to make) - but that doesn't necesarilly mean that all of the other things re: privilege/subconscious judgments in life go away for that person.

[ringwise]

Originally Posted by jade408

No it doesn't make that assumption at all. Opening up seats to more people doesn't mean there are none for you.

You are mixing up all sorts of concepts here. Diversity can mean any number of things. You are also mixing in privilege.

The concept of privilege doesn't mean that all white people start at the same place, but being white doesn't make you lose points like being a person of color can in many circumstances (or being female, or disabled....)

This video does an excellent job of explaining how privilege is quite layered.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hD5f8GuNuGQ

Then stop calling it "white" privilege. Because I can GUARANTEE that I, a white woman, have lost "points" to black people of privilege.

[HockeyMac18]

Jade: I completely agree with the goals of BLM and agree with the statements the protesters were trying to make. And, if blocking a bridge would work in getting more people to discuss these issues, I'd agree with that, too.

But, I have to say that this demonstration technique is a bit destructive to their goals. And that can simply be seen in this thread: instead of us talking about the real issues that matter (working to change the systemic issues in our society that work against minorities), most of this thread has been spent discussing why they protested the way they did - and even some people have mentioned how it has literally angered/upset them.

I know they (the protesters) want to do something disruptive that gets people's attentions, but I do think something like a protest in Washington, at some government buildings, or against some other entity that has power in this world would do a lot more good than blocking a freeway - which really just serves to inconvenience people's lives (most of whom probably agree with the cause and can't do much to really enact any major change).

I get what they're doing - and I support their cause very much - I just wish the conversation was where it should be, and it isn't - and that's mostly because the protesters chose poorly in how to demonstrate (even if their hearts are in the right place, of course).

[zitsky]

Originally Posted by HockeyMac18

This is probably debatable and highly situational-dependent. What happens when the white kid and black kid are in a new area together - and people are meeting them for the first time? There are inherent/physiological things that occur in daily life that happen to black people that just never happen to white people. This is what the word "privilege" is getting at.

You're probably right that the black kid will have more opportunity with their greater wealth, more educational opportunities, etc. (you didn't use these words, but I think this is the point you were trying to make) - but that doesn't necesarilly mean that all of the other things re: privilege/subconscious judgments in life go away for that person.

I get your point in how people perceive people differently. But I would argue if you took a black and white kid and dressed them both up like rappers or put both in a suit and tie, you might get different reactions. Add an Asian or Latino kid in the mix, maybe you'd get the same reaction. But to your point, do I think the police may react to African Americans a certain way, then yes I guess I would agree. But it's not like whites automatically get off any time they are stopped by police.

When those white and black kids apply to Harvard, and the black kid's parents went to school there, I'm pretty sure they will have more doors open than a poor white kid who lives in a trailer park who can barely afford the money for the application.

Now imagine they are both at a job interview. Sure, I will agree, maybe there is some bias, and some interviewers might prefer the white candidate. But you forgot that the company has diversity goals and is trying to increase the pool of minority candidates. That black candidate might have a leg up, maybe not. It was said before that hiring isn't a zero sum game, but if a company is looking to fill only one position and they are trying to find diversity candidates, then how likely is it that they hire the white candidate instead of a minority? But we should be honest that sometimes a white candidate gets what they want, and sometimes it's the diversity candidate.

My personal experience doesn't make me bitter, in fact I like to think it makes me more sympathetic to minorities. I just hate when we pretend that whites have all the privilege and power in this country.

I did watch the video that the other poster shared. It was interesting, and I probably would have been near the back of the room.

[Lockdev]

Originally Posted by SocSciProf

It is hard out there, for blacks, whites, and non-black non-whites. Still, do you really believe that one black president means blacks can't be held down? Do you really believe the 98% non-black Senate has absolutely NOTHING to do with laws in the U.S.? Do you really believe that the 495 non-black CEOs out of the Fortune 500 have NOTHING to do with economic distribution in the U.S.?

If you believe any of those things, I have a bridge I'd like to sell you.

I believe all of them.

Do you believe that those 98% whites and 495 non-black CEOs look out for their own race?

If you believe that, I have a better bridge to sell you.

They look out for themselves.

We have black doctors, black lawyers, successful black businesmen, black senators, black congressmen, black governors, black actors, black athletes, black CEOs, black EVERYTHING.

Stop believing that race is a limiting factor in the US.

Blacks support these stupid campaigns because they want it easier than the rest of us.

It already is.

If you don't believe me, try applying to med school as a white male. It's MUCH easier to get in as a black female.

[Lockdev]

Originally Posted by jade408

No it doesn't make that assumption at all. Opening up seats to more people doesn't mean there are none for you.

You are mixing up all sorts of concepts here. Diversity can mean any number of things. You are also mixing in privilege.

The concept of privilege doesn't mean that all white people start at the same place, but being white doesn't make you lose points like being a person of color can in many circumstances (or being female, or disabled....)

This video does an excellent job of explaining how privilege is quite layered.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hD5f8GuNuGQ

The concept of "privilege" is stupid.

It should be labelled "excuses for why I can't succeed in life".

My generation(I'm 33) loves to blame everyone else for their problems.

Blame yourself.

My parents were poor. I slang boxes at Wal-Mart, flipped burgers, worked a full-time job as a cable guy and put myself through college at the same time.

I worked my ass off for years before finally making my way in this world.

It sickens me when I hear people blame their skin color, or their background, or their parents, for why they can't succeed in life.

[jade408]

Originally Posted by ringwise

Then stop calling it "white" privilege. Because I can GUARANTEE that I, a white woman, have lost "points" to black people of privilege.

I haven't used that term in this thread. As I have said several times privilege is layered. Or to use the current word: intersectional.

[jade408]

Originally Posted by Lockdev

The concept of "privilege" is stupid.

It should be labelled "excuses for why I can't succeed in life".

My generation(I'm 33) loves to blame everyone else for their problems.

Blame yourself.

My parents were poor. I slang boxes at Wal-Mart, flipped burgers, worked a full-time job as a cable guy and put myself through college at the same time.

I worked my ass off for years before finally making my way in this world.

It sickens me when I hear people blame their skin color, or their background, or their parents, for why they can't succeed in life.

Guess what, it is a blocker. I have "succeeded" in life but I meet "helpful" people who tell me I will succeed if I go to college or whatever because they assumed I haven't. I meet people who are "surprised" I have a well paying job because it doesn't meet their stereotype. Other people are in "awe" because I am not a first generation college student.

I have done all the right things, it doesn't block people from assuming that I work in a low-level support role at first glance vs a manager job. Because you know black people aren't supposed to be managers in tech.

Privilege is real, and I have seen examples of it many many times over the years. I still have to be better to get the same results.