[momnh]

So what I don't understand though is why housing values are staying high compared to more prosperous NH. NH also has a fair share of 2nd home owners (from MA instead of NY), and nearly everyone came from somewhere else (like Chittenden County). But housing prices are taking deep dives while VT is relatively stable. When you think of basic supply and demand theory, the demand in VT must still be high enough to keep things stable. And all of those subdivision houses in Williston, Essex, South Burlington, etc, in the 300-500k range are not vacation homes. So there must be a good enough economy to support those right? Foreclosures are unheard of (unlike in NH where there are almost 300 just in Manchester alone!).

[arel]

I'm no expert on this, and I'm writing from Windham County in southeastern Vermont, not Chittenden County.

But I have been told that there was very little, if any, real estate bubble here, so when prices later fell, they fell only about 7% or so.

[momnh]

Thanks. It's just interesting to me that prices got so high even without a "bubble". My home in Manchester, NH is now only worth $300k, which is what we paid 6 years ago, and the same house in Burlington is easily over 400k. And Manchester has low unemployment and is within commutable distance to Boston so it's not a job/economy thing.

[GraniteStater]

Originally Posted by momnh

Thanks. It's just interesting to me that prices got so high even without a "bubble". My home in Manchester, NH is now only worth $300k, which is what we paid 6 years ago, and the same house in Burlington is easily over 400k. And Manchester has low unemployment and is within commutable distance to Boston so it's not a job/economy thing.

Maybe Burlington is just "perceived" as a more desirable place to live and work compared to Manchester? Also, Burlington has Lake Champlain while Manchester has the Merrimack River.

I also think it probably has something to do with supply and demand. Vermont has some pretty stringent zoning laws which can create relative scarcity in supply compared to demand.

[Brave Stranger]

Originally Posted by momnh

So what I don't understand though is why housing values are staying high compared to more prosperous NH. NH also has a fair share of 2nd home owners (from MA instead of NY), and nearly everyone came from somewhere else (like Chittenden County). But housing prices are taking deep dives while VT is relatively stable. When you think of basic supply and demand theory, the demand in VT must still be high enough to keep things stable. And all of those subdivision houses in Williston, Essex, South Burlington, etc, in the 300-500k range are not vacation homes. So there must be a good enough economy to support those right? Foreclosures are unheard of (unlike in NH where there are almost 300 just in Manchester alone!).

It's simple, really. Vermont's building codes and environmental regulations are so brutal that it forces up the price of housing.

[Flashback]

Originally Posted by Brave Stranger

It's simple, really. Vermont's building codes and environmental regulations are so brutal that it forces up the price of housing.

And the town listers keep raising values!!!!

[quickdraw]

Originally Posted by GraniteStater

Maybe Burlington is just "perceived" as a more desirable place to live and work compared to Manchester?

You can't really compare Burlington and Manchester as Manchester is more of a bedroom community (if not a suburb) and Burlington is much more isolated.

Who is perceiving Burlington as a more desirable place to live other than people in Burlington? It has nothing to do with one town being better than the other, Burlington just offers a different type of lifestyle. I'd be willing to bet most Americans would choose Manchester over Burlington. Most people would be bored silly in Burlington and Vermont in general.

As much as I like the Manchester area, and I do a lot, it wasn't what I was looking for when I moved. Just read the posts here and it's the same old story - people from expensive crowded areas tired of the hussle and bussle of suburbs. Yes Manchester has a lot of Boston area transplants, but they're folks who have moved from the middle of suburbs to the cusp of suburbs. It's a little different here, suburban and city folks who move to the Burlington area have taken it a step farther and really isolated themselves, some more than they were hoping for.

Burlington is really a unique city on the east coast, a rare thriving old medium sized city thanks to the rich out of state kids and their parents at the University of Vermont. Throw in the natural beauty and there really aren't too many, if any cities in this part of the country like Burlington.

As for the cost of living here, it's just deceivingly expensive. You can sit down and work the numbers all you want, but the salaries are ridiculously low and the weather and state politicians hit you much harder than you'd anticipate. Read these boards, it's the same old story. Our houses may be more expensive, but look around at the cars in Burlington and you'll see more luxury cars during one day in Manchester than you'll see here in a month. Get ready to see more Subarus than you can imagine.

Since it's a unique place, the housing market doesn't really compare to other places. People in NY, NJ, Long Island Washington, Chicago can still
sell their expensive homes, even in this crappy market, and move here.
It will usually be the same old story though, like mine. I'm really enjoying my time here. I think it's a one of a kind place and I don't mind doing with less material stuff (not to mention I've got the same cars I had when I moved here and can't really afford a new one) for the great vibe and natural beauty. But I'm saving no money and not feeling great about my retirement years at the moment

Of all the places I lived it's my favorite, so I'm enjoying the heck out of it.
But when my mom is no longer around, requiring me to be on the east coast, I'll move to Wisconsin within five years or so.

Anyone who moves to Vermont better buy into the whole magical, mystical
vibe, because you can't put down on paper what you're paying for and that's exactly what you're paying for. It helps to have a lot of money too when you get here, because in Vermont, the way to end up with a small fortune is start out with a large fortune.

[chrismpv]

Some of the housing may be high as a lot of people move to Vermont from States with very high housing cost. So when they sell their small ranch house at 500,000 and arrives in Vermont; they don't think twice in spending a lot for a house.

[momnh]

Yeah, I get that. But then I'd imagine there would just be pockets of highly valued houses in highly desired areas, such as in Charlotte's case. But there can't be enough people moving in to support the whole county having such a high real estate market. The state's population is shrinking, after all, and many people have made the point that new jobs aren't being created.

[quickdraw]

Originally Posted by momnh

Yeah, I get that. But then I'd imagine there would just be pockets of highly valued houses in highly desired areas, such as in Charlotte's case. But there can't be enough people moving in to support the whole county having such a high real estate market. The state's population is shrinking, after all, and many people have made the point that new jobs aren't being created.

When I look in the paper, I see a lot of houses in towns I couldn't have afforded five years ago that I could afford now. I recently saw a fairly reasonably priced home in Richmond that I would have bought when I was looking. I looked at dozens of homes, but my realtor never brought me to Richmond because there wasn't a single house I could afford. I understand what the statistics say about prices in Vermont, but the housing prices in Chittenden county sure seem cheaper to me. I don't even like to look at the prices because I worry about the value of my home. It seems to me that there a lot more decent 300k homes than when I was looking.