MARTA eyeing major expansion up Georgia 400 corridor (Atlanta, Sandy Springs: movers, condo)

[jsvh]

Ug. I am so tired of paying for other peoples roads. We need to stop this. Let private companies build toll roads. Thanks for that Born 2 Roll.

[Born 2 Roll]

Originally Posted by wxjay

Comparing the 'Brain Train' to the CalTrain is a very poor comparison. First, consider the population density along CalTrain vs. Brain Train. Second, consider the highway access, price of gas, parking, etc. in the Bay Area vs. along 85/Atlanta. Finally, and I don't mean to be stereotypical here, but look at the 'mindsets' of people in the Bay Area over the Atlanta / NW Metro Atlanta area regarding public transit.

You will see the comparisons are just not viable.

I respectfully disagree that comparing the 'Brain Train' to the CalTrain is a very poor comparison.

Comparing the 'Brain Train" to the CalTrain is a very good comparison because, even though there is increased population density along the route of the CalTrain, the population of the area that the Brain Train will run through is not static but is indeed very dynamic, meaning that the population of the area that the Brain Train runs through continues to grow at a very high rate (roughly 1200% population growth rate in Gwinnett County between 1970 and 2013) and will grow at an even higher rate once such a very-major mode of transportation is implemented.

...Just like population growth in outlying areas like Gwinnett, North Fulton/Forsyth and Cobb counties accelerated DRAMATICALLY after a very-major mode of transportation in the form of superhighways (I-85, GA 400, I-75/I-575, respectively) were built through those areas, relatively quickly turning those formerly rural areas into urban areas in a relatively short period of time.

Comparing the 'Brain Train" to the CalTrain is also a very good comparison because just like the existing CalTrain serves a multitude of important locations in the Bay Area (including Downtown SF, Candlestick Park, SF Airport, Stanford University, Santa Clara University, Great America theme park, future 49ers Stadium, Silicone Valley, Downtown San Jose, San Jose State University, etc), the future Brain Train will serve a multitude of very-important locations in the Atlanta region including 5 major university campuses, the world's busiest passenger airport, 6 major regional employment centers, 3 major football stadiums, 3 major basketball arenas and 2 major convention centers, including the 4th-largest convention center on the North American continent.

Also, while because natural geographical barriers in the form of the Pacific Ocean, San Francisco Bay and mountains and high hills, the Bay Area may have greater population density than the Atlanta region, ironically, like the Bay Area, the Atlanta region has a fairly-limited and constricted road network.

Though, Atlanta's limited road network is largely due to political constraints (increasing public resistance to large-scale road expansion) rather than physical constraints (mountains and bodies of water).

Even though Atlanta may not have the physical constraints to sprawling development that places like the Bay Area may have, the inability to further expand Atlanta's constricted road network on a large-scale to accommodate high rates of continued population growth makes investment in alternative non-automobile forms of transportation (bus and rail transit) a necessity.

Also, the reason why there currently may be no demand for Brain Train transit service in the Atlanta-Athens corridor is because the Brain Train does not currently exist.

People just simply cannot use a mode of transportation that does not exist and has not yet been built and become operational.

If we build the Brain Train (and other regional high-capacity passenger rail transit lines) and make it available for people to use, then the public will use it...just like the public used the Interstate system when the nation built the Interstate/superhighway system and made it available for use.

[Born 2 Roll]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Ug. I am so tired of paying for other peoples roads. We need to stop this. Let private companies build toll roads. Thanks for that Born 2 Roll.

Privately built, operated and maintained major roads is actually the wave of the future in the United States.

Though, technically, the roads are not really truly and completely wholly privately-funded as private entities only provide the upfront capital needed for a road to be built or rebuilt that the public may not necessarily have on hand at any given time.

It is actually the users of the road that pay the cost of constructing, operating and maintain with the user fees (tolls) that they pay when they use the road.

As our nation's Interstate/superhighway transportation infrastructure (most of which was built in the mid and late 20th Century) continues to age towards needing near-total replacement at some point in the not-too-terribly distant future, private investment backed by user fees, not diminishing fuel tax revenues, is the most likely method that will be used to pay the cost of that much-needed replacement of such a crucial piece of transportation infrastructure.

User fee-funding also enables traffic congestion to be better managed during peak travel periods (rush hours, etc) with congestion pricing in the form of tolls that rise and fall with the amount of congestion on roads, and variable speed limits on adjustable electronic signs to help keep traffic moving during peak traffic periods.

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by Born 2 Roll

Privately built, operated and maintained major roads is actually the wave of the future in the United States.

Though, technically, the roads are not really truly and completely wholly privately-funded as private entities only provide the upfront capital needed for a road to be built or rebuilt that the public may not necessarily have on hand at any given time.

It is actually the users of the road that pay the cost of constructing, operating and maintain with the user fees (tolls) that they pay when they use the road.

As our nation's Interstate/superhighway transportation infrastructure (most of which was built in the mid and late 20th Century) continues to age towards needing near-total replacement at some point in the not-too-terribly distant future, private investment backed by user fees, not diminishing fuel tax revenues, is the most likely method that will be used to pay the cost of that much-needed replacement of such a crucial piece of transportation infrastructure.

User fee-funding also enables traffic congestion to be better managed during peak travel periods (rush hours, etc) with congestion pricing in the form of tolls that rise and fall with the amount of congestion on roads, and variable speed limits on adjustable electronic signs to help keep traffic moving during peak traffic periods.

Yea. Agreed. And yea, it will still need to be PPP that must be managed as roads can easily become a monopoly.

[LynnHarris]

MARTA extension plan draws new attention from Dunwoody, Sandy Springs

Sandy Springs and Dunwoody officials are starting to pay close attention as MARTA takes a new look at mass transit north of the Chattahoochee River.

Don Boyken, chairman of the Dunwoody Chamber of Commerce, told members of the Dunwoody Homeowners Association on Nov. 3 “it’s not too early” to start lobbying the transit agency over its plans to extend the rail line north from North Springs station.

Boyken said a new MARTA study shows the rail line to the east of Ga. 400, which means neighborhoods in Sandy Springs and Dunwoody would be in the path of construction. Two decades or so ago, local officials convinced MARTA to build on the west side of Ga. 400, he said, but those plans have been set aside and are to be replaced by new ones.

“We as Dunwoody and Sandy Springs need to talk to MARTA to get them to go back to the [old] plan,” Boyken said..."


Full Story: http://www.reporternewspapers.net/20...sandy-springs/

[cqholt]

Damn NIMBYs trying to delay a much-needed project. The ROW exist for the rail line to run along the eastside of 400. These are the same people that complain about the cost of the project, when they are the ones trying to add nearly a million dollars to the cost of the project.
I was surprised to see LRT costing more, but I assume that has to do with building a maintenance yard for the trains.
HRT is the way to go in this corridor, since the Armour Yard already exist, has the capacity, and it would prevent demand users from transferring.

[Gulch]

Originally Posted by cqholt

Damn NIMBYs trying to delay a much-needed project. The ROW exist for the rail line to run along the eastside of 400. These are the same people that complain about the cost of the project, when they are the ones trying to add nearly a million dollars to the cost of the project.
I was surprised to see LRT costing more, but I assume that has to do with building a maintenance yard for the trains.
HRT is the way to go in this corridor, since the Armour Yard already exist, has the capacity, and it would prevent demand users from transferring.

Looking at Google Maps, ROW seems to exist on both sides, so I don't get the whole "neighborhoods would be in the path of construction." I think the main point of contention is the site of the proposed station at Northridge Road.

This was also interesting:

Two decades or so ago, local officials convinced MARTA to build on the west side of Ga. 400, he said, but those plans have been set aside and are to be replaced by new ones.

I never heard of this, from what I recall the North Line Extension (south of the Hooch anyway) was always slated to go on the east side of 400 specifically to avoid crossing the highway.

[cqholt]

Originally Posted by Gulch

Looking at Google Maps, ROW seems to exist on both sides, so I don't get the whole "neighborhoods would be in the path of construction." I think the main point of contention is the site of the proposed station at Northridge Road.

This was also interesting:



I never heard of this, from what I recall the North Line Extension (south of the Hooch anyway) was always slated to go on the east side of 400 specifically to avoid crossing the highway.

Yeah, I would need to see documentation to believe their claim.

[SAAN]

It is just a stalling act to push it back further like always. GA 400 has sound barriers and trees on both sides of the expressway, so home owners would not even be able to see the train, since they cant even see the express way right now.

[10 feet tall]

Originally Posted by SAAN

It is just a stalling act to push it back further like always. GA 400 has sound barriers and trees on both sides of the expressway, so home owners would not even be able to see the train, since they cant even see the express way right now.

False. There are trees, but sound barriers are rare as hen's teeth when you get north of 285.

And it is not a stalling act. There are two elementary schools and a 7 story office building that back up to GA400 on the east side in between the North Springs Station and Northridge Road before you hit the river, not to mention numerous subdivisions/yards. The right-of-way is not as large as you think, and fitting in a MARTA track or a new station there will be extremely tough.