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15 years ago was 2007. Right after that, the world collapsed and took about 5 years to get back to normal.
So that leaves 10 years to prepare. But wait!
On the eve of changing over, we had Covid 19 shut down the world for 18 months, with severe supply chain bottlenecks, including a severe semiconductor chip shortage approaching zero.
So during the two most critical years immediately before commercial fleets had to upgrade for CARB compliance, the world collapsed again.
In 2008, the target of implementing 2010 standards by 2023 was instituted. Since then, hundreds of thousands of trucks have been updated. No excuse IMHO.
CARB, the California Air Resources Board, enforces California air quality standards. 15 years ago, they set a timetable to ban older commercial diesel trucks when they implemented then clean diesel standards. The then-new standards were temporary and gave 15 years to meet much more rigorous future standards.
It gets much worse than that. I forget the details, but some years back there were entire fleets of new commercial diesel trucks that did not meet the CARB standards for clean diesel, and had to have their nearly new engines ripped out and replaced with CARB compliant engines.
Meanwhile, a full diesel ban is on the horizon.
Big change for big rigs: California unveils mandate to phase out diesel trucks
The clean-vehicle mandate begins with 5 to 9% of trucks sold in 2024. By 2035, 55% of delivery vans and large pickups, 75% of larger vehicles such as school buses and garbage trucks and 40% of the big rigs sold in California must be zero-emissions.
But air board staff said that means only 15 percent of the 1.9 million trucks expected to be on California’s roads in 2035 would be zero-emission.
So this not close to being a "Diesel Ban" or even a real "phase out" - there is no current plans to ban diesels.
In 2008, the target of implementing 2010 standards by 2023 was instituted. Since then, hundreds of thousands of trucks have been updated. No excuse IMHO.
We don't know where do you live, but here in Paradise, CA 95969 we have a NG gas furnace, water heater, and AC system on electric. How would you react to a directive from the government that the furnace and water heater are more than 15 years old and need to be updated to a new green machine at the cost of $ 6-8 K ? Replacing the engines in diesel trucks could run much much higher than that, and there is no guarantee that they won't get banned again within a few years.
Last edited by mgforshort; 12-31-2022 at 05:35 PM..
Is this going to cause out of state trucks to stop at bordering state lines and drop trailers and then CA EV trucks will pick them up? Are they going to try and force the railroads into this? That’ll be hilarious as railroad will tell them to go f*st themselves.
I do understand what they are doing though. In order to clean the smog problems via geography/weather things, things need to change and this is a step.
Not happening, especially with people that own the trailers such as my hub before he just retired in the spring. He has a 2001 Freightliner (car carrier) and trailer that still looks new. He's the only owner, bought it new. Owner operators won't let someone take their loaded trailer away. It's also possible that the load gets unloaded in another state, then reloaded on a CA compliant truck.
Freight going to CA will only be taken by guys with newer trucks/trailers.
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WRM20
... Older diesel trucks are a major contributor to poor air quality and particulate emissions. The new rules allow 2010 and newer engines to be used. That means 12 year old engines are legal in California. Which seems reasonable.
I doubt there is measurable emissions from older commercial diesel truck use in CA.
DOT makes it nearly impossible to keep an older diesel commercial vehicle legal to operate on public highways. So... CARB need not flex it's muscles.
Hope there is an exemption for AG. Many of us use our many 50+ yo diesel trucks for a few weeks / yr (<1000 mile/yr.. thank goodness). Some don't even use 1 tank of fuel / yr. But do their faithful duty well. Spending $50,000 - $250,000 investment each for several vehicles is not gonna pencil out too well.
You want to make an impact on emissions in CA? Get off the GAS (ick)
Gasoline is the most used transportation fuel in California, with ninety seven percent of all gasoline being consumed by light-duty cars, pickup trucks, and sport utility vehicles. In 2021, 13.8 billion gallons of gasoline were sold, according to the California Department of Tax and Fee Administration.
#1, MANDATORY.. trade those SUV's for 50+mpg 3cyl micro hatches
#2, close all the drive-thru lines (Idling is a max offender for gas (ick) engines)
#3, reduce the daily aircraft flights (CA alone accounts for 20% of USA Jet fuel use (1.37 m gal / day in USA))
#4 Conservation diet for ALL energy use. 10% / yr minimum. Perks for more, Bonuses (tax credits?) for reductions exceeding 20%
^^^ this is all VERY simple to do. (no CARB (or EV) required)
Diesel? Not so much. (<20% of CA fuel use)
hint:... the economy runs on Diesel and.... there are plenty of varieties of diesel equivalent fuels which reduce emissions by 80%, no engine or infrastructure modifications required (But CARB won't hear of that)
Oil drives California 58 million gallons every day – California consumes 48 million gallons of gasoline and 10 million gallons of diesel every day
2019 Source: Western States Petroleum Association
A real tragedy (sickness). "Oil addiction" (gas (ick) car addiction in CA)
Really quite unnecessary for most "light-duty cars, pickup trucks, and sport utility vehicles "
"Older diesel trucks are a major contributor to poor air quality and particulate emissions."
I don't think so.
Will not currently impact out of state reg'd vehicles. CARB working with DMV to withhold reg renewal on CA based rigs. There are plans to enforce out of state vehicles (especially restricting port access) but even CA knows the politics of this is touchy. They’d rather go after mom and pops vs. UPS.
That would be very hard for CHP to enforce if it included out of state trucks & vehicles.
California becoming like Google. Every move they make they want you and the erst of the country to join in lockstep. I would say something to these lawmakers that the late George Carlin would say.
They never have all based covered. Won't their "my way or the highway approach" screw up their electrical grid even more? The reliance on electric charging more vehicles combined with those annual rolling blackouts doesn't seem like a winner to me.
Buy who knows, perhaps they did cover all bases and have a long term plan that is failproof.
Will more solar panels on newly built homes and businesses actually offset the increased EV charging?
Or is this another attempt and forced law to secure their political careers with the younger generations.
i still prefer gas powered vehicles (ICE) over EV's. Although, a high-end EV SUV or even mid-level 4-runner could change my mind.
^CHP MREs and CVIS are tenacious. I think many of them would rather be looking for "real" violations, but if theres something to find, they'll find it. That said, 99% of fleets will self report via TRUCRS
We don't know where do you live, but here in Paradise, CA 95969 we have a NG gas furnace, water heater, and AC system on electric. How would you react to a directive from the government that the furnace and water heater are more than 15 years old and need to be updated to a new green machine at the cost of $ 6-8 K ? Replacing the engines in diesel trucks could run much much higher than that, and there is no guarantee that they won't get banned again within a few years.
Well that’s like comparing apples to kiwi fruits. My replacing a gas furnace or water heater doesn’t allow me to take that expense and deduct it against my corporate taxes and depreciate it over X years.
BTW I’m in MA. Some cities and towns have already banned new NG connections. When my two furnaces go, I’ll probably be changing over to mini-splits.
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and.... there are plenty of varieties of diesel equivalent fuels which reduce emissions by 80%, no engine or infrastructure modifications required (But CARB won't hear of that
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