Do you sometimes think of moving out of Chicago? (Detroit: renting, violent crime)

[andrew61]

Originally Posted by Avengerfire

"problematic (harassment, fighting, or rude)" can certainly encompass people that "troll." When a poster goes out of his or her way to mention how badly a city or area sucks, (whether it has any basis in fact or not) or put down inhabitants of a city or area in just about every post, no matter what forum they post in, that is an example of harassment. When someone makes some stupid thread (especially more than once) stating something to the effect of "I think your city sucks,people suck,restaurants suck,etc", that is provoking a fight, which would fall under all three categories: harassment, fighting, or rude.

Most of the real problem posters have exhibited the above behavior. We have had a few real gems in here that will post how much they think Chicago sucks in forums from Texas to Timbuktu. I am not even going to mention the names of some of the losers that have been in and out of this forum the last two years. Anyone that reads or posts in this forum regularly can attest to the screen names of these posters.

Nobody is saying that if you do not like an area and post once or twice about it you should be censored or banned. But there are people that go way above and beyond that.

There are people that will post in forums such as California,New York and others, and somehow find a way to mention how much they think Chicago sucks. (Of course there are people that do this in regards to other cities as well.) Then they come in the Chicago forum (or whatever appropriate thread) and start fights. If that is not a definition of problematic-what in the world is?

Well, yeah. I see what you're saying, of course, and I agree for the most part. But sometimes, determining whether someone is a "troll" or not is, at best, a judgment call.

And, in the post that started this whole, er, "discussion", I personally didn't see it. The poster made a very brief post in which he named two things he didn't like about Chicago: (1) the weather, and (2) the attitude. But he qualified the weather remark by adding that of course it wasn't Chicago's fault... and furthermore, he did concede that Chicago is "a great city".

Quite frankly, I saw nothing trollish or combative in that post. Besides, I thought it was on topic given that this thread is about "Have you ever considered leaving Chicago?"

And again, I personally refrain from accusing posters of using "multiple accounts" even if I strongly suspect it. My reason being that I myself have, in the past, been wrongly accused of being mutliple posters... not on this site, but on certain boards elsewhere on the internet. Because of my personal experience along those lines, that's a sensitive issue for me.

[Tao111]

Originally Posted by Avengerfire

So what? That is the case with any city or town in the United States.

I certainly do not make Chicago out to be the Emerald City and neither do most others that post in this forum.

No. Most do make it out to be an Emerald City of sorts.
Some "insight" from an outsider's perspective here. It is percieved that there are far too many Chicagoans and their suburban counterparts that make the choice to belittle the identity of other cities in America, and around the world. When talking about other people's homes, Chicagoans tend to speak their (often negative) opinions as if they are fact.

"This town over here is provincal...this one over here doesn't have enough to do...this one over here can't make pizza right...this one has no culture"

Instead of stating them as opinions, which is what they are, Chicagoans go the extra step to minimize everyone else and pump up Chicago beyond its air capacity. There is barely any self deprication from Chicagoans. The pride comes across as a complex. There is a percieved attitude that Chicagoans think they are better than everybody else no matter how bad the city gets for the average joe. This is the same such attitude that has America itself in a bad light with much the rest of planet Earth.

[Avengerfire]

Originally Posted by Tao111

...It is percieved that there are far too many Chicagoans and their suburban counterparts that make the choice to belittle the identity of other cities in America, and around the world. When talking about other people's homes, Chicagoans tend to speak their (often negative) opinions as if they are fact...

...Instead of stating them as opinions, which is what they are, Chicagoans go the extra step to minimize everyone else and pump up Chicago beyond its air capacity...

1)But if that is not what is projected by most Chicagoans on this site-why in the world fight a battle against an "enemy" that is not present?

Again, people do this all over the country. It is certainly not exclusive only to Chicagoans. I have seen people all the time on this site from New York,L.A.,San Francisco, Wisconsin, you name it, that do what you say way more often than people in the Chicago forum.

2) Is your statement not an opinion to begin with?

[chicagocubs]

Well, I think that anyone who is seeking Utopia is going to be disappointed. No matter where you live, there are good/bad things about that place.

I am a native Chicagoan who now lives in Charlotte, NC. There is plenty about Chicago that I love and when I visit, I usually try to do all of those things. There are things about Charlotte that I love and, well frankly, that is why I live here. Do I get frustrated in Charlotte in the summertime where there are is no Cubs game that I can go to or the beach close enough to go for the afternoon?? SURE. When I have car trouble and cannot get to work unless I get a ride (little to no public transportation), do I get annoyed?? SURE. When I am hungry for a decent hot dog or beef sandwich, do I long for the city? YEP When I am in Chicago and I am looking for an ATM from my bank ( which is in the top 10 of the nation) and they don't exist...do I get annoyed?? YES. When I visit my uncle in the nursing home and it is not Wi-Fi enabled, am I amazed? YES...and, most importantly, when someone scraped my rental car in the parking lot of a hotel and I had to file a police report...in person and not online like I could have done in Charlotte...does it make me mad?? SURE!!

The list goes on & on. I don't think anywhere is heaven, (this side of actually being IN heaven). So, to the OP, there really is nowhere like Chicago. I have been all over the world and, Chicago is unique. The job market is much worse elsewhere in the country, and, truth be told, working conditions are not great in other places, either. If you can afford to be there (and you can tolerate the winters), by all means, try to stick it out. It really isn't going to be much better elsewhere.

[ImaloneJill]

Most current unemployment stats:
Top 10 Worst, Best States for Unemployment - ABC News

[oakparkdude]

Originally Posted by ImaloneJill

Quality of schools have plummeted in the last 20 years. Magnet schools are good, but limited room.
Crime has soared.

I can't disagree with everything about your post, but these two items stuck out. CPS has been notoriously bad for decades and in the past few years have shown, if anything, a slight improvement. Likewise, crime rates today are nowhere near as bad as during the awful years of the 80s and early 90s.

[ImaloneJill]

The reason the I mentioned the crime is because it has been so much in the news lately, esp. in light of Chicago's bid for the Olympics. I thought I had read that it had gone up. Could that have been violent crime or teenage crime?

As far as the schools go, two of my three children are products of the Chicago Public School system in the 80's and 90's. I had pretty good experiences with the schools, but I have heard nothing but complaints in recent years from others. If I am in error, I apologize.

[oakparkdude]

Originally Posted by ImaloneJill

The reason the I mentioned the crime is because it has been so much in the news lately, esp. in light of Chicago's bid for the Olympics. I thought I had read that it had gone up. Could that have been violent crime or teenage crime?

As far as the schools go, two of my three children are products of the Chicago Public School system in the 80's and 90's. I had pretty good experiences with the schools, but I have heard nothing but complaints in recent years from others. If I am in error, I apologize.

Back in the early nineties, we had around 900 murders a year. We're at half that number now. We have just as dramatic decreases in robberies, burglaries, rapes, etc. People get a distorted perspective about crime rates from the media. Remember, the media tends to go by the mantra, "If it bleeds, it leads", rather than a dispassionate analysis of crime rates.

[andrew61]

Originally Posted by ImaloneJill

The reason the I mentioned the crime is because it has been so much in the news lately, esp. in light of Chicago's bid for the Olympics. I thought I had read that it had gone up. Could that have been violent crime or teenage crime?

There does seem to have been an uptick in violent crime over the past two years or so. But whether that turns out to be just a blip or the beginning of a reversal of the longer-term downward trend remains to be seen.

[Lookout Kid]

Originally Posted by Avengerfire

1) You have no idea what you are talking about in terms of the amount of murders per year in Chicago. The amount of murders was pretty damn high even seven to ten years ago.

1990: 851
1991: 927
1992: 943
1993: 931
1994: 929
1995: 827
1996: 789
1997: 759
1998: 704
1999: 641
2000: 628
2001: 666
2002: 647
2003: 598
2004: 448
2005: 449
2006: 467
2007: 442
2008: 521

Crime in Chicago - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

2)Where was this?

And to add to Avengerfire's comments, the "advances in medical care" argument holds no water. We'd still see a tremendous increase in non-fatal shootings if this were true, and there has been no increase in non-fatal shootings. The city is MUCH safer now than even ten years ago.