Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Ilene, I cannot spend all of my time on this forum. I spend too much time as it is. To continue to repeat things over and over is a waste of time. There comes a point when enough has been said. It is a given that there are people who reject fundamental doctrine and always will no matter what may be said.
As far as this particular thread is concerned, I have said enough and people will just have to refer back to my prior posts. People are free to believe what they want. I can't hold a club over anyones head and make them believe anything. All I can do is to present information. And that I have done.
Well maybe what you have previously posted is not addressing the questions Mike? That looks as though that's the problem to me, you give a broad post and expect it to answer every and all questions. I don't know, call me crazy but people don't want to refer back to anything, especially when it's not addressing the questions they are asking.
This is an ongoing discussion board and things get repeated over and over again. If what I said were so all-fire important to me then I would gladly post it again. There's always the copy/paste or quote features.
And good for Mike, that kind of growth isn't his problem.
God declares that his Son will reign forever...Isaiah 9:7, Luke 1:33
God declares that his will is that only those who looks to and believes in his Son are saved John 6:40
God declares his wrath remains on those who reject his Son John 3:36
Isaiah 9:7
Of the increase of his government and peace there will be no end. He will reign on David’s throne and over his kingdom, establishing and upholding it with justice and righteousness from that time on and forever. The zeal of the LORD Almighty will accomplish this.
Luke 1:33
"and he will reign over the house of Jacob forever; his kingdom will never end.”
1 Samuel 12:15
But if you do not obey the LORD, and if you rebel against his commands, his hand will be against you
John 6:40 For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, ..."
So you found a Satanic Bible that says Jesus will reign forever. Anyone can follow Satan like that. But only a real man can follow a true translated bible that has Christ reigning for the ages of the ages or eons of the eons.
Being that scripture teaches Amillennialism and not Millennialism is not the point.
Either way, The zeal of the LORD Almighty will accomplish this.Jesus will reign forever
Isaiah 9:7
Of the increase of his government and peace there will be no end. He will reign on David’s throne and over his kingdom, establishing and upholding it with justice and righteousness from that time on and forever. The zeal of the LORD Almighty will accomplish this.
Luke 1:33
"and he will reign over the house of Jacob forever; his kingdom will never end.”
I think the Bible is clear that he will reign on earth, but I wanted to highlight to Mike the incongruity in his belief that one day he will fly up to the clouds to be with the Lord in the air forever. Christ has always been talking about the coming of the kingdom of his Father on earth, not in the skies. One thing leads to another.
I think the Bible is clear that he will reign on earth, but I wanted to highlight to Mike the incongruity in his belief that one day he will fly up to the clouds to be with the Lord in the air forever. Christ has always been talking about the coming of the kingdom of his Father on earth, not in the skies. One thing leads to another.
1) The rapture is not the topic of this thread.
2) Your statement reveals an ignorance of what the rapture or resurrection of the church is and how it relates to dispensational truth. Nevertheless, it will not be discussed on this thread.
Last edited by Michael Way; 01-19-2011 at 07:24 AM..
Funny thing about the bolded words above, nowhere in the Bible does it even remotely state that.
Nor does it say that "God will rule over all" after Jesus turns over the kingdom to God.
Nor does it say that "Jesus will turn over the Millennial kingdom to God."
It does however say "that God may be All in all" (1 Cor.15:28).
Agreed!
Mr. Ray A. Van Dyke, compiled a comparison between the revelation given in Revelation and that given to Paul, as recorded in 1 Cor. 15:22-28. His comments are reproduced here:
"In the book of Revelation we do not have the final plan of God. Paul, in 1 Cor. 15:22-28 takes us much further into the future than does the book of Revelation. To illustrate this more clearly, study the following: 1 Cor. 15:22-28 as compared with the new heaven and new earth of Revelation 20-22:
In 1 Cor. 15:22-28, we have:
No more rule
No more authority
No more power
No more enemies
No more reigning
All subjected
No more death, death destroyed.
All made alive, immortal
In Revelation 20-22, we have:
Still rule (20:6; 22:5)
Son still reigns (22:1-5; 11:5)
Authority (21:24,25)
Power (21:24,25; 22:2
Kings (21:24-26)
Saints reign (22:5)
Second death still exists (21:5)
The nations still mortal (22:2)
-end quote
Christians who believe in universal reconciliation believe that the Bible is God's Word, and His Word cannot contradict itself, hence the inspired sacred Scriptures say in Rev. 11:15; 22:5, eis tous aionas ton aionon, "for the eons of the eons." Thus, Christ our Lord "reigns for the eons of the eons," not as the king's translators rendered, "forever and ever." Therefore, Revelation 20-22 fits into the framework of the eons, and is truth relative to the eons. First Corinthians Chapter 15 fits at the consummation (end) of the eons. We give the second Adam, Christ, as much credit and numerical ability as the first Adam, and use 1 Cor. 15:22-28 also for this truth. (Read Rom. 5:18-19.)
Consequently, Col. 1:16-20:
All in heaven and earth created in Him (verse 16)
All for Him (verse 16)
All estranged are reconciled (verse 20)
1 Corinthians 15:22:
In Adam all are dying
In Christ shall all be made alive
The literal Greek in 1 Corinthians 15:22 reads:
hosphor gar en to Adam pantes apothneskousin houtos kai en to christo pantes zoopoiethesontai.
"Even as for in the Adam all are dying, thus also in the Christ, all shall be made alive."
The more one studies this Scripture as well as dozens more like it, it becomes abundantly clear that as in Adam all died, that very same all will be made alive in Christ. There is not one in Adam that will not be made alive in Christ. It is a perfectly balanced statement which Jesus said was already set in motion.
I think the Bible is clear that he will reign on earth, but I wanted to highlight to Mike the incongruity in his belief that one day he will fly up to the clouds to be with the Lord in the air forever. Christ has always been talking about the coming of the kingdom of his Father on earth, not in the skies. One thing leads to another.
Interesting! Jesus reigning on earth, not in the sky! So those "raptured away" will be going to a place where Jesus is not reigning!
Literalism just tears up the scriptures like nothing!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteWings
Agreed!
Mr. Ray A. Van Dyke, compiled a comparison between the revelation given in Revelation and that given to Paul, as recorded in 1 Cor. 15:22-28. His comments are reproduced here:
"In the book of Revelation we do not have the final plan of God. Paul, in 1 Cor. 15:22-28 takes us much further into the future than does the book of Revelation. To illustrate this more clearly, study the following: 1 Cor. 15:22-28 as compared with the new heaven and new earth of Revelation 20-22:
In 1 Cor. 15:22-28, we have:
No more rule
No more authority
No more power
No more enemies
No more reigning
All subjected
No more death, death destroyed.
All made alive, immortal
In Revelation 20-22, we have:
Still rule (20:6; 22:5)
Son still reigns (22:1-5; 11:5)
Authority (21:24,25)
Power (21:24,25; 22:2
Kings (21:24-26)
Saints reign (22:5)
Second death still exists (21:5)
The nations still mortal (22:2)
-end quote
Christians who believe in universal reconciliation believe that the Bible is God's Word, and His Word cannot contradict itself, hence the inspired sacred Scriptures say in Rev. 11:15; 22:5, eis tous aionas ton aionon, "for the eons of the eons." Thus, Christ our Lord "reigns for the eons of the eons," not as the king's translators rendered, "forever and ever." Therefore, Revelation 20-22 fits into the framework of the eons, and is truth relative to the eons. First Corinthians Chapter 15 fits at the consummation (end) of the eons. We give the second Adam, Christ, as much credit and numerical ability as the first Adam, and use 1 Cor. 15:22-28 also for this truth. (Read Rom. 5:18-19.)
Consequently, Col. 1:16-20:
All in heaven and earth created in Him (verse 16)
All for Him (verse 16)
All estranged are reconciled (verse 20)
1 Corinthians 15:22:
In Adam all are dying
In Christ shall all be made alive
The literal Greek in 1 Corinthians 15:22 reads:
hosphor gar en to Adam pantes apothneskousin houtos kai en to christo pantes zoopoiethesontai.
"Even as for in the Adam all are dying, thus also in the Christ, all shall be made alive."
The more one studies this Scripture as well as dozens more like it, it becomes abundantly clear that as in Adam all died, that very same all will be made alive in Christ. There is not one in Adam that will not be made alive in Christ. It is a perfectly balanced statement which Jesus said was already set in motion.
Beautiful addition, WW! See below..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555
Universalism is not the topic of this thread.
Jesus Christ is God and as such, He will rule throughout all eternity future along with God the Father. No more rule means no more rule which is in opposition to God.
Do not bring Universalism onto this thread.
Mike,
Jesus is the head of the body (mankind). Where 2 or 3 are gathered together, He is in the midst.
Once all authority and power has been put down, then Jesus too will be put under, that God may be all in all.
At least that's what we read in 1 Cor. 15:28 --"And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all."
No "sinner" (outdated word) is out of God's reach!
"And I will shake all nations, and the desire of all nations shall come: and I will fill this house with glory, saith the LORD of hosts." Haggai 2.7
Interesting! Jesus reigning on earth, not in the sky! So those "raptured away" will be going to a place where Jesus is not reigning!
Literalism just tears up the scriptures like nothing!!
Beautiful addition, WW! See below..
Mike,
Jesus is the head of the body (mankind). Where 2 or 3 are gathered together, He is in the midst.
Once all authority and power has been put down, then Jesus too will be put under, that God may be all in all.
At least that's what we read in 1 Cor. 15:28 --"And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all."
No "sinner" (outdated word) is out of God's reach!
"And I will shake all nations, and the desire of all nations shall come: and I will fill this house with glory, saith the LORD of hosts." Haggai 2.7
The topic of this thread is that Jesus Christ will rule forever. You introduced universalism at the bottom of your post with that nonsense about all men being saved. One of the rules on this forum is that you don't take a thread off topic. If you want to talk about Universalism, do it on your own thread. Not on mine.
Mike,
You don't sound very gracious. Is this really YOUR thread? Would you like it if Universalism was a banned topic from this forum? I don't think anyone can OWN a thread. You often sound very over-bearing as well as condescending in your manner of speech. Why is that?
Mike,
You don't sound very gracious. Is this really YOUR thread? Would you like it if Universalism was a banned topic from this forum? I don't think anyone can OWN a thread. You often sound very over-bearing as well as condescending in your manner of speech. Why is that?
Heartsong
You know full well that threads are supposed to remain on topic. Not that they usually do, but they are supposed to.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
