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Apparently not. Even with God being all knowing, he still created man, designed him to fail, then created a torture chamber for him, all the while knowing most would fail. Some God you have there.
Let me rewind for a second. You wrote this ^^^ in response to this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pleroo
Yep, the broad way leads to "destruction" or apōleia which is derived from the word apollymi.
Of course, Jesus also said that the Son of Man came to seek and save that which is "lost" or apollymi.
And you are saying that the Son can't succeed in that mission. Tsk.
Which leads me to suspect you didn't understand this ^^^.
Kjw believes that God is going to annihilate people based on the bible passage s/he referenced about the broad way leading to destruction.
I was showing him/her that all the people who are lost on that broad way to destruction are, according to the bible s/he believes, being sought and saved by the Son of Man. So, according to the bible there's no annihilation, no torture chamber... just everyone who is "lost" on the road to "destruction" being found and saved.
Let me rewind for a second. You wrote this ^^^ in response to this:
Which leads me to suspect you didn't understand this ^^^.
Kjw believes that God is going to annihilate people based on the bible passage s/he referenced about the broad way leading to destruction.
I was showing him/her that all the people who are lost on that broad way to destruction are, according to the bible s/he believes, being sought and saved by the Son of Man. So, according to the bible there's no annihilation, no torture chamber... just everyone who is "lost" on the road to "destruction" being found and saved.
Are you saying they walk this path until saved? What it says to me is that most of mankind fail and are destroyed. Which, since the bible is the only way God reaches out, makes complete sense that most fail to find its path.
Are you saying they walk this path until saved? What it says to me is that most of mankind fail and are destroyed. Which, since the bible is the only way God reaches out, makes complete sense that most fail to find its path.
Essentially, yes, that is what the passages I referenced indicate. If you have an interest in the topic, you may wish to do some research on what Christian Universalism or Universal Reconciliation has to say. They make a strong biblical case for their belief that all will be saved.
I'm fairly new here and a recent convert to Atheist. Before becoming an Atheist, I struggled with the doctrine of ET. I discovered that ET was not biblical, yet, I'm shocked at how many pastors and Christians believe this doctrine to be biblical and even worse, reasonable. I cringe when I here Christians say that another human should burn in hell for eternity. I found the bible to clearly support annihilation.
My question is: Do you believe in ET and do you consider it just punishment? If so, have you really considered what that means?
As now an atheist and unbiased in this matter, how do you judge the evidence in favor for universal salvation?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmiej
Not so fast.
In Matthew 25:46, Jesus said, "Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.†In this verse, the same Greek word is used to refer to the destiny of the wicked and the righteous. If the wicked are only tormented for an “age,†then the righteous will only experience life in heaven for an “age.†If believers will be in heaven forever, unbelievers will be in hell forever.
Essentially, yes, that is what the passages I referenced indicate. If you have an interest in the topic, you may wish to do some research on what Christian Universalism or Universal Reconciliation has to say. They make a strong biblical case for their belief that all will be saved.
I think it would be great, if it were true, but considering all the contradictions, brutality and favoritism in the bible, I find it non-reflective of a true God. To me, the bible is just Jewish fables. I'm concerned with its indoctrination of Christians that inhibits their use of common sense and reason.
If any other religion or earthly power portrayed biblical morals and judgements, Christians would view that entity as sadistic and evil, yet, they are blind to it in Christianity.
I haven't researched universalism. I've heard of it, but have not seen the need to understand it since I do not consider the bible of a god.
This thread was more directed at getting Christians to comprehend the sadistic doctrine they believe in. Even if they believe it and intend to maintain their religion, they should at least use enough common sense and reason to see it for what it is, which is sadistic no matter who implements it.
I haven't researched universalism. I've heard of it, but have not seen the need to understand it since I do not consider the bible of a god.
This thread was more directed at getting Christians to comprehend the sadistic doctrine they believe in. Even if they believe it and intend to maintain their religion, they should at least use enough common sense and reason to see it for what it is, which is sadistic no matter who implements it.
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