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I affectionately disagree, Mystic. Logic is logic for everybody. But people tend not to pursue rational inquiry too rigorously when deeply held beliefs are at stake. That's normal for everybody, too.
That's right, there is no room for man's logic with the word of God!
It says what it says, it explains itself! Man's logic is where all false doctrine originates.
I see the source of the problem. You're using a definition of "logic" that I'm unfamiliar with. Here is what I mean by "logic", just so we're clear.
Logic is the power of arriving at facts by means of reasoning from other known facts. For example, I watch as a lady puts an orange in her shopping basket. Then I see her putting another orange in her shopping basket. Now, from this angle I cannot see inside her basket - - but I know there are at least two oranges. I know that because of logic.
Rest assured that God uses the same logic. He is, after all, its author. There is no distinction between man's logic and God's logic. Logic is logic.
I'm just saying; if you take the claims you made to their logical conclusions, I think it would create some problems.
That's all.
It is and it isn’t
The fullness needs to come to pass of all things, all reaching the extent of their own natural growth and diversification
There is only one God, one Spirit, etc and there has been a “seeding” relating to “man” who is “called” and who has “bonded” others in that “calling” creating “households” “cities” etc, and each has performed their own duties in their own “generations” and “ways”
Isa 55:1**Ho, every one that thirsteth, come ye to the waters, and he that hath no money; come ye, buy, and eat; yea, come, buy wine and milk without money and without price.
Isa 55:2**Wherefore do ye spend money for that which is not bread? and your labour for that which satisfieth not? hearken diligently unto me, and eat ye that which is good, and let your soul delight itself in fatness.
Isa 55:3**Incline your ear, and come unto me: hear, and your soul shall live; and I will make an everlasting covenant with you, even the sure mercies of David.
Isa 55:4**Behold, I have given him for a witness to the people, a leader and commander to the people.
Isa 55:5**Behold, thou shalt call a nation that thou knowest not, and nations that knew not thee shall run unto thee because of the LORD thy God, and for the Holy One of Israel; for he hath glorified thee.
Isa 55:6**Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:
Isa 55:7**Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.
Isa 55:8**For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
Isa 55:9**For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.
Isa 55:10**For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater:
Isa 55:11**So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.
Isa 55:12**For ye shall go out with joy, and be led forth with peace: the mountains and the hills shall break forth before you into singing, and all the trees of the field shall clap their hands.
Isa 55:13**Instead of the thorn shall come up the fir tree, and instead of the brier shall come up the myrtle tree: and it shall be to the LORD for a name, for an everlasting sign that shall not be cut off.
I affectionately disagree, Mystic. Logic is logic for everybody. But people tend not to pursue rational inquiry too rigorously when deeply held beliefs are at stake. That's normal for everybody, too.
I see the source of the problem. You're using a definition of "logic" that I'm unfamiliar with. Here is what I mean by "logic", just so we're clear.
Logic is the power of arriving at facts by means of reasoning from other known facts. For example, I watch as a lady puts an orange in her shopping basket. Then I see her putting another orange in her shopping basket. Now, from this angle I cannot see inside her basket - - but I know there are at least two oranges. I know that because of logic.
Rest assured that God uses the same logic. He is, after all, its author. There is no distinction between man's logic and God's logic. Logic is logic.
That "reasoning and facts" are from your mind and do not always conform to scripture.
That's why the "reasoning and facts" are dropped when the scripture is cracked open and you let scripture interpret scripture.
No reasoning, no facts but the ones found written in scripture that confirms other scripture.
It's very easy if you train yourself to leave all opinions at the door, and let the scripture tell you the facts.
God could have destroyed the devil and his hoards after the cross of Christ, as the devil became a defeated foe to God and believers who engage in His blessing ......... BUT God saw that He gave everything to Jesus Christ and Jesus gave everything to the followers of Christ..... So God left the devil and his hoards as a challenge for God's followers
That's right, there is no room for man's logic with the word of God!
Charlie, let me try to show you that logic is the same for man as it is for the Word of God.
If by "the word of God" you mean the scriptures, then I would challenge you to find a passage that makes a claim that is "illogical" by human standards. Find a passage that uses logic differently from how humans use it. Bear in mind that miracles don't offend logic. The statement "Jesus rose from the dead" does not contradict itself nor result in any logical absurdities. Even if an atheist feels dead sure that the resurrection never happened, he will have to admit that the claim that it did happen does not violate logic per se. However, it would violate logic to find a scripture with a self-contradiction in it like, "and you shall build a circular pillar with four straight sides." That would violate man's logic, because it is rationally absurd to propose a square circle. Can you find us a scripture that is absurd according to man's logic, but valid according to God's? It would strengthen your point that man's and God's logic are different.
Another way to understand "The word of God" is in the Johannine sense of the Logos - - the rational principle that gave birth to this whole universe and which governs all of its dynamics. We as humans cannot escape the rational order we live in (though we might ignore it). God Himself is this logic, this order, that allowed a universe to be. Our minds also have the gift of logic, which allows us to do math, physics and a good many other things, and which is not a different type of logic, but just logic as God made it.
Charlie, let me try to show you that logic is the same for man as it is for the Word of God.
If by "the word of God" you mean the scriptures, then I would challenge you to find a passage that makes a claim that is "illogical" by human standards. Find a passage that uses logic differently from how humans use it. Bear in mind that miracles don't offend logic. The statement "Jesus rose from the dead" does not contradict itself nor result in any logical absurdities. Even if an atheist feels dead sure that the resurrection never happened, he will have to admit that the claim that it did happen does not violate logic per se. However, it would violate logic to find a scripture with a self-contradiction in it like, "and you shall build a circular pillar with four straight sides." That would violate man's logic, because it is rationally absurd to propose a square circle. Can you find us a scripture that is absurd according to man's logic, but valid according to God's? It would strengthen your point that man's and God's logic are different.
Another way to understand "The word of God" is in the Johannine sense of the Logos - - the rational principle that gave birth to this whole universe and which governs all of its dynamics. We as humans cannot escape the rational order we live in (though we might ignore it). God Himself is this logic, this order, that allowed a universe to be. Our minds also have the gift of logic, which allows us to do math, physics and a good many other things, and which is not a different type of logic, but just logic as God made it.
Great post, Hump.
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