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May I ask a few questions of anyone? Particularly unbelievers? Have you ever "seen" wind? Not the 'impact' the wind makes upon the trees; therefore, the tree moves, not the 'sound' of it rustling through the bushes, not the 'feel' of it on your face, not the whistling sound of it. Have you ever "seen" wind? Yes or no?
But you know it's the wind because? What? How do you know it's the wind?
My question then is, why do you need so much "proof" that the Holy Spirit exist? If you can't even believe the Holy Spirit is undeniably real, then how is it you are so readily able to believe that your saved? By salvation? A free gift from God?
You don't believe in the Giver of the Gift, but you are ready to believe that the gift is yours for the taking? How much greater is the Giver of the gift than the gift itself? And like the wind, you know it exist, even if you can't see it!!
How hypocritical is that? That God is such a loving God, I can take His gift, Salvation. It's free and I don't even have to acknowledge the giver of the gift? Do you not know the Giver of the Gift is His son Christ Jesus? That He sent His only Begotten Son to die in place for you?
It requires something! It requires BELIEF!! Belief that Jesus is the way to life everlasting! You believe that the wind exist right? Right! I've never seen it, but I know it's exist! I believe it exist. I've never seen the Holy Spirit, but I believe He exist! I know He exist!
Let me try another angle, same outcome. There's an order of things in the spiritual. You can't bypass the Son and go straight to the throne. "Well God you know that I accepted your free gift of salvation, though I did'nt acknowledge the Giver of the one who came bearing the gift, eh em, your Son Christ Jesus, here I am anyway Lord, standing before you." Really?
No, people. He is not willing that any should perish but that all, all should come to repentance. And repentance requires that you believe in the name of the LORD JESUS CHRIST!!!
No feel good sermon here!! Time is of the essence! Salvation requires belief in Jesus Christ the King! The bearer of the free Gift.
Last edited by Betsey Lane; 12-06-2008 at 11:58 AM..
Reason: commas, etc..
May I ask a few questions of anyone? Have you ever "seen" wind? Not the 'impact' the wind makes upon the trees; therefore, the tree moves, not the 'sound' of it rustling through the bushes, not the 'feel' of it on your face, not the whistling sound of it. Have you ever "seen" wind? Yes or no?
But you know it's the wind because? What? How do you know it's the wind?
Good example Betsy. The same can be applied to pain. It can be felt, but not seen, and yet we all know it exists.
Betsey would like to know, what would it take for you to believe? The wind requires no belief, you know it's there, right? How can I help you to understand that Jesus loves you unconditionally. That He's a friend through and through. I would like to know, what it is you need to know.
Part of belief comes to being ready. Are we ready to give up our illusion of control on our lives? We live on this earth, thinking that we have some measure of control, when in reality we have very little. We can control how we react to situations, but nothing else. I can't control what other drivers will do on the road, what questions my profs have put on the 2 finals I take tomorrow (I'm on a study break!), if I get sick or not (I can eat healthy foods, exercise, wash my hands, but germs still come), if others get sick. So part of belief has to be a readiness to admit that we are not control.
Another part comes from the heart, do we want to give up our pride and be vulnerable before God. Is our heart ready for what HE has to give?
I've found the best way to reach people is to share the logical facts of Christianity- as with the discussion of the HS and wind or pain, but to also just love them and be their friend. Patience is a big key, though I admittedly am not real good at that! =)
Part of belief comes to being ready. Are we ready to give up our illusion of control on our lives? We live on this earth, thinking that we have some measure of control, when in reality we have very little. We can control how we react to situations, but nothing else. I can't control what other drivers will do on the road, what questions my profs have put on the 2 finals I take tomorrow (I'm on a study break!), if I get sick or not (I can eat healthy foods, exercise, wash my hands, but germs still come), if others get sick. So part of belief has to be a readiness to admit that we are not control.
Another part comes from the heart, do we want to give up our pride and be vulnerable before God. Is our heart ready for what HE has to give?
I've found the best way to reach people is to share the logical facts of Christianity- as with the discussion of the HS and wind or pain, but to also just love them and be their friend. Patience is a big key, though I admittedly am not real good at that! =)
BTW- I love the analogy using wind! THANKS!!!
Thank you for your honest explanation. I'm merely trying to understand from a believer perspective. Though, I myself were'nt always a believer. It's just that after tasting of this wonderful gift of salvation, I'm just amazed to why so many won't come aboard. Just wondering.
PS: Thanks for sharing, but are'nt you suppose to be studying? (Mhhm)
Location: In the North Idaho woods, still surrounded by terriers
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmyPoohFan317
Part of belief comes to being ready. Are we ready to give up our illusion of control on our lives? We live on this earth, thinking that we have some measure of control, when in reality we have very little. We can control how we react to situations, but nothing else. I can't control what other drivers will do on the road, what questions my profs have put on the 2 finals I take tomorrow (I'm on a study break!), if I get sick or not (I can eat healthy foods, exercise, wash my hands, but germs still come), if others get sick. So part of belief has to be a readiness to admit that we are not control.
Another part comes from the heart, do we want to give up our pride and be vulnerable before God. Is our heart ready for what HE has to give?
I've found the best way to reach people is to share the logical facts of Christianity- as with the discussion of the HS and wind or pain, but to also just love them and be their friend. Patience is a big key, though I admittedly am not real good at that! =)
BTW- I love the analogy using wind! THANKS!!!
Actually, speaking only for myself, (someone who is not Christian but does believe in a Creator energy...a Source of life), it really has nothing to do with giving up control or having pride. I believe in a Universal randomness, that I really have very little control in things other than, as Pooh said, how I react and how I maintain my attitude. This does not worry or frighten me because I believe things will turn out as they are supposed to.
I don't need proof of God...I know there is a Source of life in the world around me and the universe beyond...but I would need some sort of physical proof to believe in Jesus as God, to believe in Heaven or Hell, to believe I need any sort of salvation (I am responsible for my own screw-ups), or that God has something to "give". I do not fear death, I do not worry about being "left behind", I do not fear the "end times" or any other Christian concerns. I know/believe that the creation of all of "this" is inside of me and inside of everyone else and how we use that life energy, spirit, soul or whatever one cares to lable it, it strictly our responsibility.
That being said, I have no problem with Christians believing what they believe. That is their need, their choice, it fulfills something in them which is lacking or missing, some sort of self-assuredness...but I see no problem with it at all. The exception are some of the Fundamentalists who spew words of fear and doom and gloom and hellfire and horror in order to control their followers. This is frightening and shows definite mental or emotional weakness or affective disorders, at least in my opinion. But those are, thankfully, in the minority...
Anyway...I know what causes the wind to blow, why leaves change color in the fall, why there are rainbows and the aurora in the skies. That is the natural world, the beauty of life, which may or may not be unique to this planet. My place in the universe is to take care of that, to treat other life as carefully and lovingly as I would want to be treated, and to use my life to promote kindness and care. I do not require an intermediary (Jesus) to bring me to that place. It's in me and I will, and have, gather(ed) the fruit (good and bad consequences) of my decisions and my actions. I feel peaceful in this world and I am not looking for proof of the Christian god.
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Betsy
