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Verna wouldn't it be more fitting of us to glorify God than ourselves by declaring He will complete that which He started in me ? and to quote the Apostle Paul " it's no longer I that liveth"
...Of course! I proclaim this every day!!!
I do declare!...HE WILL COMPLETE THAT WHICH HE BEGAN IN ME!!! << there you go pcamps...it's all your fault...you made ME say ME again! And it is no longer I that liveth...but Him that liveth inside ME!!! AMEN! THANK YOU JESUS!
Last edited by Verna Perry; 12-01-2009 at 06:56 PM..
I do declare!...HE WILL COMPLETE THAT WHICH HE BEGUN IN ME!!! << there you go pcamps...it's all your fault...you made ME say ME again! And it is no longer I that liveth...but Him that liveth inside ME!!! AMEN! THANK YOU JESUS!
Verna what He is doing in you , is much different to i will , i never, i choose and so on. I think you know very well what i am getting at
Verna what He is doing in you , is much different to i will , i never, i choose and so on. I think you know very well what i am gettingat
Seriously pc, you give me way too much credit!....I've yet to come within a month of knowing what you EVER are attempting to get at...but by all means...attempt to enlighten me ...I'm all "I's"...<<Get it?...(I's/eyes?)
If you say that you keep being saved by serving God you are basing your salvation on your works and not God. What happens if you sin and you suddenly die are you not saved?
No, the serving God part is indicative of the change within when you become born again. You should serve God because you want to, not because you have to. It is a by-product of your born-again spirit within. You are saved by faith in the redemptive death and resurrection of Jesus. But...after that...once you are saved...it will be evident you are born again because your works will show it. Either the tree bears good fruit, or it does not. What would you think of a tree with a sign on it that said "Apple Tree", yet year after year after year all it bore was thorns? The bible says every tree that does not bear fruit will be hewn down. There is something wrong with a person who says "I'm a Christian", yet year after year after year bears no fruit, or "works". Here's some scripture on that:
Luke 3
9 "And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: every tree therefore which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire"
James 2
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
- - Nor any created being per Romans 8. Why do you continue to deny the power of God to do what He said He would do?
2 Tim. 2:13 - If we are faithless, He remains faithful, for He cannot deny Himself. If we fall away from the faith, He still will not deny Himself.
- - It is impossible to crucify Christ again. No one can be renewed again because it is unnecessary since no one can loose their salvation. Their deeds will be judged at the judgment seat of Christ. They will be saved even though they will be burned.
Hebrews 3:12-14 - I explained this already - I can't remember the post number.
1 Timothy 1:19 - see 1 Cor. 5:1-5 about how believers can be handed over to Satan and remain saved.
Hebrews 2:1 - What does this have to do with salvation?
1 Tim 4:1 - Nothing mentioned concerning the status of salvation.
John 6:66-68 - Jesus had not died yet. The Holy Spirit was not given permanently yet for salvation.
2 Tim 2:12 - Read 2:13 - if we are faithless, He is faithful. So even if we fall away from the faith, He remains faithful to His promise.
2 Peter 2:20-21 - Not speaking of salvation.
John 15:4-6 - Branches that are thrown away are burned - see the Hebrews verses and the judgment seat of Christ.
Hebrews 10:26-27 - Same as Heb. 6 - Christ can't be crucified again. Judgment will occur by fire through the judgment seat of Christ (1 Cor. 3). The fire will destroy only the adversaries - it will only burn the believer (Heb. 6:8) and salvation is still valid.
1 Chronicles 28:9 - This does not refer to salvation after Jesus' death.
1 Cor 9:27 - Disqualified from witnessing to others - others will not listen to him because he is known for bad conduct. This is not about salvation. Check the context.
Hebrews 6:4-6 - This just says Christ can't be crucified again. Read verse 8 - they are "close" to being cursed and are only burned.
Matthew 6:15 - Part of the sermon on the mount - not directed at believers - content does not deal w/ salvation.
Matthew 10:22 - Saved from what?
Luke 12:45-46 - Not sure on this one yet.
Rom. 11:18-22 - You need to look up to Rom. 11:11-13 to see who the branches are. This is not about individual salvation - but about Gentiles and Jews as groups.
Rev 3:5 - Who are the overcomers? 1 John 5:5 - Who is the one who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God?
So the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God will not have his name erased from the book of life.
That's a good way to end this post.
]
Oh...good grief! My impression is you seem to have your "mind totally made up", and nothing I or anyone else says will change it, scripture or otherwise. I'm sorry, but if you can't see salvation tied to those scriptures, then I can't help you...and I just don't have an inclination to spend hours and hours going in circles arguing. I'm not mad at you, I just dont' have time to sit here and argue over something that will very likely be fruitless. I'll tell you what though: I'll pray that God will open your eyes to the truth. (I really will!)
Have a nice day. (And that's a good way to end this post!)
Oh...good grief! My impression is you seem to have your "mind totally made up", and nothing I or anyone else says will change it, scripture or otherwise. I'm sorry, but if you can't see salvation tied to those scriptures, then I can't help you...and I just don't have an inclination to spend hours and hours going in circles arguing. I'm not mad at you, I just dont' have time to sit here and argue over something that will very likely be fruitless. I'll tell you what though: I'll pray that God will open your eyes to the truth. (I really will!)
Have a nice day. (And that's a good way to end this post!)
Bud
I'm sensing a trend among those who believe you can lose salvation.
When they put verses out there and no one answers back - they trumpet the fact that their way is correct. When they get an answer that puts their error in the light, then they don't want to argue, or your mind is made up, or it won't do any good.
When I put out verses, or I ask a question - rarely do I get an answer. Or if I get an answer, it's about how dangerous and ludicrous my views are.
Jesus makes direct statements about salvation. Some of them I have posted. Tell me how I am misinterpreting the words of Christ.
Bud - You put out the verses - what's the point if you aren't to discuss them?
How can He mean what He says when He never said this?
Jesus does say that the one who hears my message and believes the one who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned, but has crossed over from death to life (John 5:24).
Jesus says the one who believes in him is not condemned. The one who does not believe has been condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the one and only Son of God (John 3:18).
If you believe - you have eternal life and you are not condemned. Those are unconditional quotes straight from the Son of God.
You can not quote anyplace where Jesus directly says salvation can be lost.
On another thread, where I spoke out against universalism, I used John 3:18 and a couple of other verses that were direct quotations of Christ Himself, and a poster implied that I was putting words in His mouth.
On another thread, where I spoke out against universalism, I used John 3:18 and a couple of other verses that were direct quotations of Christ Himself, and a poster implied that I was putting words in His mouth.
Funny
The word applied correctly is like kryptonite to some around here.
You quoted scripture inaccurately. Do you not study to show yourself approved? (2 Timothy 2:15) My experience with the Bible has told me that many people say they are saved when in actuality they may not be. The Bible says that the demons believe in Jesus and they tremble (James 2:19. It is not enough to believe but one must make Jesus Lord and follow Him. If you say you are a believer and walk in darkness the Bible says that you are a liar and the Truth is not in you (I John 5:13). The question isn't once saved always saved or can you lose your salvation? The question is "Is your salvation geniune"?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Verna Perry
Hebrews.
Chapter 3:
(7) Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, Today if ye will hear his voice,
(8) Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
(9) When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.
(10) Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do always err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.
(11) So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)
We must examine our hearts.
Satan wants to bring Christians to a place where they have hardened their hearts against God, and eventually are led to a place where they are totally alienated from Him. Paul's warning to the Hebrews in these verses reveals this devious strategy that Satan will try to use to lead you step by step into a deep, dark pit of spiritual darkness where you are:
alienated from God
unable and unwilling to hear His voice
calloused
disobedient
unrepentant
One of the greatest dangers concerning this strategy is that so many Christians feel that this could never happen to them. Unfortunately, Satan uses false teachers, that teach false doctrine...called the "Doctrine of the Devil" to try and make Christians believe the lie that they cannot lose their salvation once they have confessed Jesus as their Savior...and I am here to dispell these lies that come straight from the pit of hell...because I love you and want you to know the truth! Paul's warning in these verses is not issued to the unbelievers...but to the Church! And this is a warning that God is directing to His people today as people have hardened their hearts to the truth...to hearing and believing God's Word...in unbelief they are unable to see the fulfillment of God's covenant promises in their lives. Those whose hearts have been "hardened' are past feeling and have lost all sensitivity to the Spirit. There is no remorse concerning sin. The root word for "harden" or "hardening" is "porosis," which describes a state of petrification. It is used medically to refer to the callus that is formed when a bone has been fractured and reset. This callus becomes harder than the bone itself.
This dangerous condition of having a hardened heart does not happen overnight. It happens gradually, through a progression of steps. Paul uses Israel's hardening of their hearts against God in the wilderness as an example to warn the Hebrews of the dangers of hardening their hearts (Deuteronomy 1:19-46). Israel refused to hear God's voice. Instead, they murmered and complained against God. They were filled with unbelief; they did not believe that God would do as He had said. Israel rebelled against God, refusing to obey the charge that God gave them to go in and take possession of the land; they chose, instead, to follow their own wills. As a result of their disobedience and sin against God, Israel was NOT ALLOWED TO ENTER INTO THE PROMISED LAND. They failed to take possession of their inheritance and reaped the wages of their sin. Step by step the Israelites, through the HARDENING OF THEIR HEARTS, were led to destruction.
Paul drew a parallel. The Israelites, under Moses, were given covenant promises and an inheritance that was theirs based upon their faithfulness and obedience to God. And, just as they had forfeited their inheritance, he was warning the BELIEVERS of THE POSSIBILITY OF THEIR LOSING THEIR POSITION AND INHERITANCE THROUGH UNBELIEF AND HARDENING THEIR HEARTS. He said,...
"For we are made partakers of Christ, IF we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast UNTO THE END" (verse 14).
For this reason, Paul said, "TAKE HEED, *brethren, *lest there be in any of you an evil heart of UNBELIEF, in *departing from the living God...lest any of you be HARDENED through the deceitfulness of sin" (verse 12-13). He was exhorting them to EXAMINE their hearts to see if there was any unbelief. It is through the sin of unbelief that our hearts become hardened to God.
As we look at the strategies Satan will use against you to lead you to this dangerous position, remember the position God gave you over ALL the power of the enemy. Satan does not have the power to make you sin. He has no power over your will. Christ defeated him...broke his power over you. Through the power of the Holy Spirit within you, you are able to RESIST...STAND FAST and OPPOSE every attack of Satan!...and DO NOT listen to the lies that are being spewed by some here on this board that you cannot lose your salvation...no matter how much you sin.....these are lies from the pit of hell!
You quoted scripture inaccurately. Do you not study to show yourself approved? (2 Timothy 2:15) My experience with the Bible has told me that many people say they are saved when in actuality they may not be. The Bible says that the demons believe in Jesus and they tremble (James 2:19. It is not enough to believe but one must make Jesus Lord and follow Him. If you say you are a believer and walk in darkness the Bible says that you are a liar and the Truth is not in you (I John 5:13). The question isn't once saved always saved or can you lose your salvation? The question is "Is your salvation geniune"?
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..these are lies from the pit of hell!
