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i think regional rail is philly.. the mbta calls theirs commuter rail.
also springfeild is based in massachusetts but as explained before it mite make more sense for new york to create a commuter rail station there.
Springfield is getting commuter rail, from New Haven, CT. Technically you will be able to commute from Springfield to Grand Central, but that would be a loooong commute. I assume most commuters will be headed to Hartford, New Haven, or maybe a few to Stamford.
Yes, I texted Springfield, MA ought to have a MBTA regional rail line b/c the way things are heading for major US city limits to create a high cost of living; therefore, people will commute & live further away from the city centers to annex other towns: 1 or 2 hrs away. All of the US metro cities might want to plan ahead into building mass regional rail lines, or else our highways & infrastructures will be a chaotic nightmare.
If we go to Springfield we might as well build out to Albany, and extent the Providence line to New London or Mystic because 100 mile commutes are the future.
Springfield is getting commuter rail, from New Haven, CT. Technically you will be able to commute from Springfield to Grand Central, but that would be a loooong commute. I assume most commuters will be headed to Hartford, New Haven, or maybe a few to Stamford.
Quote:
Originally Posted by btownboss4
If we go to Springfield we might as well build out to Albany, and extent the Providence line to New London or Mystic because 100 mile commutes are the future.
does boston commuter rail go to hartford, ct ? then you would be able to take public transportation to nyc. would probably be an 8 hour trip.
does boston commuter rail go to hartford, ct ? then you would be able to take public transportation to nyc. would probably be an 8 hour trip.
Hartford is nowhere near Boston. It's connected more to NYC (or, more accurately, northern suburbs of NYC), which is, in part, why it's getting commuter rail.
Yes, in theory, if you extended Boston commuter rail to Springfield, you could take commuter rail all the way from NYC to Boston. Or, if you extended Boston commuter rail to New London, you could do the same. But Boston doesn't have the same geographic/commuting reach as NYC, so not very likely.
Hartford is nowhere near Boston. It's connected more to NYC (or, more accurately, northern suburbs of NYC), which is, in part, why it's getting commuter rail.
Yes, in theory, if you extended Boston commuter rail to Springfield, you could take commuter rail all the way from NYC to Boston. Or, if you extended Boston commuter rail to New London, you could do the same. But Boston doesn't have the same geographic/commuting reach as NYC, so not very likely.
This.
And the only people who who would ever take commuter rail all the way from NYC to Boston if it was possible are the people who want to say they took commuter rail all the way from NYC to Boston. It would be one hell of a long trip. Otherwise they'd take Amtrak (NER or Acela), one of the many buses you can take for between $1 and $5 if you book with any sort of notice, or fly.
Boston-Springfield and Boston-New London commuter rail is insane. It will never happen in my lifetime.
This is true, Philly has much better overall coverage. But for such fantastic coverage, and size, and centrality, the fact that its commuter rail system is electrified, it's still lacking in ridership. Part of the reason could be headways, or an antiquated fare system. I don't know, but you would think it would blow past the Bay Area in ridership.
MUNI + BART + Caltrains + ferries alone blow past Philly + PATCO and any other system you want to throw in there. Add in SamTrans, GGT, and ACT, all three of which feed SF, and you have about 1.4 million riders to pull from in a city that's 35% the land area and half the population. Add in all Bay Area transit (down to SJ for instance) and you have well over 1.6 million transit riders in a population area about the same size as metro Philly.
As sucky as Bay Area transit is, as crowded as it is, despite the fact that it's never on time, old trains/cars, lots of crazies and homeless, fare readers that often don't work, trolley buses responsible for 200K riders a day that frequently break down or get stopped up in Chinatown, or take 1-1.5 hours to traverse the peninsula in traffic, light rail that's ineffective and doesn't serve most of the city, only 1 serious commuter rail line, you have more riders than in Philly, plain and simple.
It's hard for me to justify responding to someone who can't spell or use punctuation/grammar.
But.
BART 455K
MUNI 679K
Caltrain 61K
Ferries 17K
Subtotal 1212K vs the 1382K you listed above
Population served by the above is quite small in comparison to the population served by the Philly agencies
San Jose 147K
Peninsula 43K
Oakland/Alameda County 194K (including commuter rail)
Contra Costa 24K
North Bay 24K
Total 1644K
Populations served are roughly equivalent
There are literally only 2 agencies/transit types where Philly exceeds SF in ridership:
1) commuter rail: 129K (according to APTA; you listed 142K...I don't feel like checking your other #s) vs 61K (for just Caltrain, which is 1 line)
2) City bus agency: Philly's SEPTA bus carried 541K + trolley of 22K (again, you listed 550K but APTA has something different) serving a population of 1.56 million vs SF bus + trolley of 478K serving a population of 852K.
Recap
Philly:
563K bus passengers in a city of 1.56 million
SF:
478K bus passengers in a city of 852K
Philly has far excessive coverage and more options than SF/Bay Area, yet somehow has much lower overall ridership. To me that signals some sort of weakness in the system. I think you're crazy if you can't see that.
Philly has far excessive coverage and more options than SF/Bay Area, yet somehow has much lower overall ridership. To me that signals some sort of weakness in the system. I think you're crazy if you can't see that.
I think it's a mischaracterization to say there's a "weakness" in the system, as in fact, SEPTA itself does pretty darn well (although all PT systems, of course, could do more to improve operations) and ridership is actually breaking records in recent years:
Even so, the lack of ridership compared to peer cities comes down to one word: jobs. The trend of the suburbanization of jobs in Philadelphia has been well-documented over the course of the past half-decade, and it's more pronounced in Philly than it is in cities like Boston and SF. The fact of the matter is SEPTA, like most legacy transit systems, were designed for suburb-to-city commutes--not suburb-to-suburb or even city-to-suburb commutes: https://phillymotu.wordpress.com/201...rch-rest-stop/
It think the suburbanization of jobs trend is finally abating with the urban resurgence across the US, but Philly could certainly stand to gain a much greater share of the metro's jobs.
Aside from that, it's worth noting the Philly's walkability and bikeability and the extra compact nature of Center City's/University City's job hubs being coterminous with the young professional hubs actually lends to lack of a need, to some degree, of public transit for professionals living within the city. I think this differs from cities like Boston, DC and SF, where many professionals are not quite as close to job centers and thus need to use at least some form of transit to supplement their commute.
I live just outside CC and more people walk/bike to work in my neighborhood than any other form. PT is second and driving is third.
I think there is an article somewhere in that 30+% of people in the expanded CC area (was like 180K people) walk to work, more than take PT
And you are spot on with two accounts, after 40+ years of job flight to the burbs the trend is changing but the PT is not the issue it the jobs, SEPTA could handle another 300K riders on rail with no changes sadly the job demand isn't there yet
apparently the green/orange/silver lines are rich and red/blue are poor.
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