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How so? I think St. Louis is obviously further on the road back, but I don't see where that map shows that.
Cleveland is still very much an industrial core city, while St. Louis has recently made the transition to skilled anchor.
Industrial Core = slower population growth, lower diversity, and lower educational attainment Skilled Anchor = slower population growth, lower diversity, and higher educational attainment
The St. Louis region is also still slowly growing, while the Cleveland region is shrinking. St. Louis also has better bones (architecture and infrastructure), charm and overall better layout than Cleveland, in my humble opinion.
This is not an intended to be a put down of Cleveland either. I'm just giving some of the reasons people may be voting for St. Louis over Cleveland, despite our "One of America's most dangerous slums" reputation.
Just released ... There are some extremely ambitious development plans on tap for Cleveland's downtown and lakefront areas. This proposed SKY LIFT would be an iconic addition to the core of the city. These plans are in their infancy as of now, but there are already some major sponsors backing the project.
I would say that if adequate support is garnered we can expect to see this project become reality within a few short years - Cleveland is seeing a huge amount of development occurring in the downtown area right now, so I would not be one to dismiss the probability of this project.
I think the OP's question is skewed a bit: Cleveland was decimated more than any metro area in recent decades, with the possible exception of Detroit -- I haven't heard St. Louis suffering economic blows anywhere near what Cleveland has... That said, as JohnDBumgarndner has noted, Cleveland has picked itself up off the canvas amazingly in the past 5 years with things such as the new medically-oriented convention center, population growth in several in-city neighborhoods, notably downtown... That's not blind boosterism, that's fact ... sorry it offends certain posters... It also isn't saying that Cleveland has solved all it's economic and other woes, because it most certainly has not... but it shows that this city has hardly thrown in the towel, either, which has to be admirable I don't care what city you come from/root for.
The fact that St. Louis leads in the above "poll" 2-to-1 shows more hometown boosterism more-so that people dealing with actual fact.
Your first point is very, very debatable (while also not really being important for this thread based on the OP's question...), and seems to suggest quite a bit of historical ignorance. Second, maybe you should read the thread a bit, most people's problems with "John" stem from his seemingly intentional misrepresentation of facts with the hopes that no one will notice, many of these he has been called out on in the past (such as his theatre district claim), and he continues to ignore corrections and attack rather aggressively anyone who points out his errors (such as his rather obnoxious population error in this thread, I pointed out his mistake then he proceeded to attack me and call me stupid.... ) Cleveland is doing a lot to fix itself, especially concerning its downtown (more than most midwestern cities), but ignoring the the situation of the city as a whole and/or what St. Louis is doing at the same time doesn't make you an impartial expert...
Furthermore, in regards to the poll and "hometown boosterism," I take it you think STL and Cleveland are 2-to-1 respectively population-wise then? Or that you consider the polls scientific? Nice credibility...
Just released ... There are some extremely ambitious development plans on tap for Cleveland's downtown and lakefront areas. This proposed SKY LIFT would be an iconic addition to the core of the city. These plans are in their infancy as of now, but there are already some major sponsors backing the project.
I would say that if adequate support is garnered we can expect to see this project become reality within a few short years - Cleveland is seeing a huge amount of development occurring in the downtown area right now, so I would not be one to dismiss the probability of this project.
Cleveland is still very much an industrial core city, while St. Louis has recently made the transition to skilled anchor.
Industrial Core = slower population growth, lower diversity, and lower educational attainment Skilled Anchor = slower population growth, lower diversity, and higher educational attainment
The St. Louis region is also still slowly growing, while the Cleveland region is shrinking. St. Louis also has better bones (architecture and infrastructure), charm and overall better layout than Cleveland, in my humble opinion.
This is not an intended to be a put down of Cleveland either. I'm just giving some of the reasons people may be voting for St. Louis over Cleveland, despite our "One of America's most dangerous slums" reputation.
Apparently you don't pay attention too well. If you did, you'd realize that Cleveland been morphing away from hard industry (heck, there's very little left in town) and growing rapidly in health care, for which Cleveland with one of the largest and most prestigious medical complexes (Cleveland Clinic) along with a 2nd network a few blocks down Euclid Ave. that could hold its own with most major cities' first health care system (University Hospitals). The new downtown Global Center for Health Innovation connected with the recently revamped/greatly enlarged convention center positions Cleveland to practically become ground zero for America's health care industry. ... oh, and did I mention that it was recently announced that a new 650-to700 room tower hotel connected with the convention center/medical complex would soon be rising?
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