Most vibrant urban core (outside the big 6)? (skyscrapers, living, best)

[jsimms3]

Originally Posted by Summersm343

IDK if Philly has any burbs that reach 20-30k per-say, but there are definitely higher density burbs than Camden.

Camden is mostly a rundown, abandoned ghetto. Mostly abandoned buildings, rundown neighborhoods with tons of empty lots, and large surface parking lots in what is considered the "downtown." Camden certainly is built to be a much denser city, and at one time in history it was, and maybe one time it will be again in the future, but as of right now, no.

Some higher density and MUCH nicer burbs around Philly include:

Millbourne: 16,557 ppsm
Millbourne, Pennsylvania - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Conshohocken: 13,138 ppsm
Conshohocken, Pennsylvania - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Darby: 12,624 ppsm
Darby, Pennsylvania - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

East Lansdowne: 12,517 ppsm
East Lansdowne, Pennsylvania - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Parkside: 10,897 ppsm
Parkside, Pennsylvania - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Clifton Heights: 10,882 ppsm
Clifton Heights, Pennsylvania - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Upper Darby: 10,397 ppsm
Upper Darby Township, Delaware County, Pennsylvania - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

West Chester: 10,256 ppsm
West Chester, Pennsylvania - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Collingdale: 10,107
Collingdale, Pennsylvania - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Norristown: 9,806
Norristown, Pennsylvania - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Drexel Hill: 9,113 ppsm
Drexel Hill, Pennsylvania - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Not to drag back off topic, but I would only place "value" on a few of these cities.

City / Land Area / Population

Upper Darby / 7.9 sq mi / 82,795
Norristown / 3.5 sq mi / 34,324
Drexel Hill / 3.2 sq mi / 30,036

West Chester / 1.8 sq mi / 18,461
Darby / 0.8 sq mi / 10,687
Collingdale / 0.9 sq mi / 8,786
Conshohocken / 0.6 sq mi / 7,883
Clifton Heights / 0.6 sq mi / 6,779
E. Lansdowne / 0.2 sq mi / 2,668
Parkside / 0.2 sq mi / 2,267
Milbourne / 0.07 sq mi / 1,159

Total / 19.77 sq mi / 205,845 (density of 10,412 ppsm)


San Francisco's largest suburbs:

City / Population / Land Area / Density

San Mateo County incorporated cities > 25,000 people

Daly City / 101,123 / 7.66 sq mi / 13,201
San Mateo / 97,207 / 12.13 sq mi / 8,014
Redwood City / 76,815 / 19.42 sq mi / 3,955
S San Francisco / 64,409 / 9.14 sq mi / 6,961
San Bruno / 41,114 / 5.48 sq mi / 7,503
Pacifica / 37,234 / 12.66 sq mi / 2,941
Menlo Park / 32,026 / 9.79 sq mi / 3,271
Foster City / 30,567 / 3.76 sq mi / 8,130
Burlingame / 28,806 / 4.41 sq mi / 6,532
San Carlos / 28,406 / 5.54 sq mi / 5,127
E. Palo Alto / 28,155 / 2.51 sq mi / 11,217
Belmont / 25,835 / 4.62 sq mi / 5,592

Total / 591,697 / 97.12 sq mi / 6,092

So greater than 82% of a stereotypically sprawly Silicon Valley county lives in cities > 25,000 people that have an average density of > 6,000 ppsm.

Alameda County incorporated cities (all of them)

Oakland / 400,740 / 55.79 sq mi / 7,184
Fremont / 220,000 / 77.46 sq mi / 2,840 (one of those cities that is almost entirely uninhabitable for mountain ranges)
Hayward / 144,186 / 45.32 sq mi / 3,182 (one of those cities that is almost entirely uninhabitable for mountain ranges)
Berkeley / 112,580 / 10.47 sq mi / 10,753
San Leandro / 84,950 / 13.34 sq mi / 6,368
Livermore / 80,968 / 25.17 sq mi / 3,217
Alameda / 73,812 / 10.611 sq mi / 6,956
Pleasonton / 70,285 / 24.11 sq mi / 2,915
Union City / 69,516 / 19.00 sq mi / 3,659
Dublin / 49,890 / 14.91 sq mi / 3,346
Newark / 42,573 / 13.88 sq mi / 3,067
Albany / 18,539 / 1.79 sq mi / 10,368
Piedmont / 10,667 / 1.68 sq mi / 6,357
Emeryville / 10,080 / 1.25 sq mi / 8,090

Total / 1,388,786 / 314.78 sq mi / 4,412

This encompasses 92% of the county's population (the county as a whole is 738 sq mi and mostly uninhabited). Taking out the western low density suburbs and Fremont/Hayward, which are mostly uninhabited mountain ranges, you're left with 780,884 people living in 113.93 sq mi, for an average density of 6,854 ppsm. In reality, the 5-7,000 ppsm range is where the entirety of Fremont/Hayward population is, and I would suspect that you're really looking at 1.15 million people living at about 6,000-6,500 ppsm. Not bad for suburbs.

Picking and choosing suburbs - Berkeley + Daly City + E. Palo Alto + Albany + San Mateo + Foster City = 388,171 people, 38.32 sq mi, 10,130 ppsm

I'm getting tired of spending time on this, but I think the point is making claims about the density of eastern suburbs is probably not the right path to go down, especially for purposes of this thread. Rosslyn-Ballston is misleading in that the whole corridor is like Midtown Atlanta. You'll have a Census tract that covers a string of high rise apartments and has a very high density, but very little land area and a small population overall, and then next door you'll have a large Census tract that covers considerably more land area and a mixture of SFH with yards and 2 story attached luxury townhouses, with larger population and low density.

To re-establish the Big 6, you have:

NYC
Chicago
SF
Boston
Philadelphia
DC
and as we have debated, potentially LA to make it the Big 7. I would think if we include LA for the Big 7, we should make a Big 8 and include Seattle. But that's me.

I think LA and Seattle are the *clear* next guys after the established Big 6. Then a whole range of cities where it's hard to make a very objective determination on which is most vibrant in the core. Portland, San Diego, Minneapolis, Denver, Pittsburgh, Baltimore, New Orleans, and Miami are all pretty darn vibrant in different ways and for different reasons.

[RightonWalnut]

Originally Posted by jsimms3

Not to drag back off topic, but I would only place "value" on a few of these cities.

Lol.

Why is everything a competition between San Francisco and Philly with you? Lol.

Are you jealous of something? I was simply showing you there are denser suburbs than Camden, because you claimed Camden was the densest Philly suburb. I in no place said anything about San Francisco and it's suburbs. I think you may be confusing me with someone else.

[Ant131531]

Originally Posted by Summersm343

Lol.

Why is everything a competition between San Francisco and Philly with you? Lol.

Are you jealous of something? I was simply showing you there are denser suburbs than Camden, because you claimed Camden was the densest Philly suburb. I in no place said anything about San Francisco and it's suburbs. I think you may be confusing me with someone else.

Are you surprised? He's a techie living in SF. Everything to him is a competition. He wants to feels superior to you.

[RightonWalnut]

Originally Posted by Ant131531

Are you surprised? He's a techie living in SF. Everything to him is a competition. He wants to feels superior to you.

Haha exactly. I'll simply respond to one of his posts and he comes at me with something in the San Francisco area like I care. I mean read my posts... was it confrontational at all? I didn't think so lol

[MDAllstar]

Originally Posted by OyCrumbler

Sounds good. Don't really see what you see, but I do see DC isn't supposed to be outside the top six. Let's at least say that's a compliment!

After that, LA, I think. Much of it is definitely built oddly compared to the other six though and it isn't quite built the same way the sunbelt boom cities are either. The only other major US boom city of its time period was Detroit, I believe, but LA and Detroit went on some radically different trajectories over the last half century or more.

I get it. You're not trying to talk about this. You're right, this has nothing to do with the thread. In fact, nothing we have been saying had anything to do with this thread. I got sick of it today though. I was at a tipping point. I apologize.

[Ant131531]

Originally Posted by Summersm343

Haha exactly. I'll simply respond to one of his posts and he comes at me with something in the San Francisco area like I care. I mean read my posts... was it confrontational at all? I didn't think so lol

Half of his posts indirectly bashes Atlanta in one form or another. He'll be talking about something that has no relevancy to Atlanta, but he'll bring it up anyway and make a comparison. I don't get it.

[Trafalgar Law]

Originally Posted by Ant131531

Are you surprised? He's a techie living in SF. Everything to him is a competition. He wants to feels superior to you.

He doesn't work in tech. You can just tell by reading his posts, he's not in tech.

[OyCrumbler]

Originally Posted by MDAllstar

I get it. You're not trying to talk about this. You're right, this has nothing to do with the thread. In fact, nothing we have been saying had anything to do with this thread. I got sick of it today though. I was at a tipping point. I apologize.

Well, so what do you think is number seven in the US? LA? Seattle? Baltimore? Providence? Pittsburgh? Minneapolis?

[jsimms3]

Originally Posted by Red John

He doesn't work in tech. You can just tell by reading his posts, he's not in tech.

I'm not in tech.

I don't mean to make Philly a centerpiece of competition. I think it has just naturally turned into one with me on this forum (it is City vs). Atlanta is a whole other story. While I may indirectly criticize it a lot, usually accidentally to the contrary of what people might believe, the Atlanta posters are some of the most egregious culprits of boosty, defensive, non-contextual posters ever (and my latest mention of the city was in its defense). I was a typical Atl poster when I first moved to the city. As a I grow older and with more travel under my belt (not just to see family in Philly, Chicago, or elsewhere, but actual travel), the more I internally despise Atlanta and my time spent there, and the more I realize how great lots of other cities are (Philly included).

[Ant131531]

Originally Posted by jsimms3

I'm not in tech.

I don't mean to make Philly a centerpiece of competition. I think it has just naturally turned into one with me on this forum (it is City vs). Atlanta is a whole other story. While I may indirectly criticize it a lot, usually accidentally to the contrary of what people might believe, the Atlanta posters are some of the most egregious culprits of boosty, defensive, non-contextual posters ever (and my latest mention of the city was in its defense). I was a typical Atl poster when I first moved to the city. As a I grow older and with more travel under my belt (not just to see family in Philly, Chicago, or elsewhere, but actual travel), the more I internally despise Atlanta and my time spent there, and the more I realize how great lots of other cities are (Philly included).

Maybe it's because of the way you constantly attack Atlanta.